Talk:Audition (The Fools Who Dream)

Rainbow Connection

Why does "Audition (The Fools Who Dream)" sound so much like "Rainbow Connection" from "The Muppet Movie"? There must be a story here.

Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 10:39, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

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Emma Stone

• ... that Emma Stone (pictured) is not lip-syncing in "Audition" and is actually singing live? Source: [1]
  • ALT1: ... that Emma Stone (pictured) sang "Audition" live on set? Source: Same
  • ALT2: ... that Emma Stone (pictured) sang La La Land's "Audition (The Fools Who Dream)" live on set? Source: Same
  • Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/Hogwarts School of Prayer and Miracles

5x expanded by Pamzeis (talk). Self-nominated at 05:11, 13 July 2023 (UTC). Post-promotion hook changes for this nom will be logged at Template talk:Did you know nominations/Audition (The Fools Who Dream); consider watching this nomination, if it is successful, until the hook appears on the Main Page.

General: Article is new enough and long enough
New enough: Long enough:

Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems
Adequate sourcing: Neutral: Free of copyright violations, plagiarism, and close paraphrasing:

Hook eligibility:

• Cited:
• Interesting: - n

Image: Image is freely licensed, used in the article, and clear at 100px.
Freely licensed: Used in article: Clear at 100px:

QPQ: Done.

Overall: @Pamzeis: Good article, but I feel like a better hook could be made here. Onegreatjoke (talk) 03:11, 15 July 2023 (UTC)

Would any of these alternatives:

• ALT3: ... that La La Land's composer initially wanted "Audition (The Fools Who Dream)" to be the film's "award song" instead of "City of the Stars"? [2]
• ALT4: ... that a journalist said La La Land's "Audition (The Fools Who Dream)" features "the world's most accommodating key change, the equivalent of going half a speed faster on a treadmill"? [3]
• ALT5: ... that "Audition" signifies how La La Land is "back in old-musical Heaven"? [4]
• ALT6: ... that La La Land's "Audition" takes place after a long absence of musical numbers, signifying how the film is "back in old-musical Heaven"? [5]

work? Lemme know what you think! Pamzeis (talk) 11:13, 15 July 2023 (UTC)

ooh, I love La La Land! I'm learning all the pieces on piano :) going to say no to ALT5, as it looks like it expresses an opinion in wikivoice; of the choices presented, I think ALTs 0 or 3 are best. Pinging Onegreatjoke for a final call. theleekycauldron (talk • contribs) (she/her) 22:34, 15 July 2023 (UTC)

Approve. Onegreatjoke (talk) 16:31, 19 July 2023 (UTC)

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Audition (The Fools Who Dream)/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Cessaune (talk · contribs) 14:09, 25 August 2023 (UTC)

I am going to review this. Likley timetable is two weeks. Cessaune [talk] 14:09, 25 August 2023 (UTC)

Hey, Cessaune! Any updates on that review? Only asking because it's been two weeks since your above comment. Obviously, it's fine if you need more time Pamzeis (talk) 13:26, 8 September 2023 (UTC)

Sorry, I'm being really lsow. Give me a few more days. Thanks for your continued patience. Cessaune [talk] 22:28, 9 September 2023 (UTC)

@Cessaune: Courtesy ping :) Pamzeis (talk) 10:06, 26 September 2023 (UTC)

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@Pamzeis: thank you for your exceptional patience. I do hope that I didn't waste too much of your valuable time.

As a formatting thing, you should comb through the entire thing and change "Audition" to Audition.

•  Not done per MOS:MINORWORK

Lead

Y Fine as is.

Background

• Delete As a drummer, Chazelle has a predilection for musical films. I don't understand the connection here. Firstly, the point that this sentence attempts to make is barely even tangential to the article. Secondly, I don't think that the implications of the sentence make any sense. Why would drummers have a preference for musical films as opposed to any film? Don't essentially all films nowadays incorporate some sort of music in the background? What does him being a drummer have to do with his preference for musical films?
  •  Done
• Delete ...when the film industry seemed out of reach for him. Firstly, this is tangential to the article. Secondly, as far as I'm aware it isn't supported by the source.
  • I think it's a relevant detail; the film industry being out of reach is something that shaped Mia's story (I think), which eventually leads into this song. I've added another source to support it.
    • Unless it explicitly says this in the source, that's bordering on WP:OR. Cessaune [talk] 16:56, 1 October 2023 (UTC)
      • Fair—cut. Pamzeis (talk) 01:17, 2 October 2023 (UTC)
• Replace He conceived the film when he was a student at Harvard University with his classmate Justin Hurwitz with He conceived the concept of the film while a student at Harvard University, alongside classmate Justin Hurwitz. It more accurately summarizes the source, and it's worded better IMO.
  •  Partly done

The rest is fine.

Writing and filming

• Replace ...since he wanted to learn more about the rest of the soundtrack before working on it with since "...we wanted to understand what the rest of the music was in the movie before we tackled this".
  •  Done
• Delete The song was composed quickly this time, since Hurwitz connected to the notion of a discouraged artist with big ambitions. What does this mean? "Since" implies causality, and, based on my reading of the sources provided, there is no causal relationship here. In addition, the sentence feels like filler.
  • Expanded on this
• Delete It had minimal changes before its lyrics were written. I can't find anything in the source that qualifies this statement, and the statement is confusing to begin with.
  •  Done
• Replace Actress Emma Stone (who portrays Mia) sounded better in one key for the delicate introduction and another for the emotional finale, so the music team had to explore some challenging modulations with According to Hurwitz, Stone sounded "better in one key for the fragile opening, and another for the emotive climax", so the music team had to explore some challenging modulations.
  •  Done
• Replace ...Mia had to slip into song with ...Mia had to "slip into song".
  •  Done
• Reformat the second paragraph:

Chazelle allowed Pasek and Paul to write lyrics with detailed narratives. According to Paul, "[t]here was never a push to write sort of more accessible pop-ified lyrics that were general and didn’t tell stories much." Pasek was told by a musical theater professor that "a theater song you have to approach like it's a verb: It's what the action is and what's going to change"; Pasek and Paul attempted to make "Audition" as much of a "verb" as possible, as once Mia sings it, everything changes for her. They also took inspiration from a monologue Chazelle wrote for Stone.

• •  Done
• Reformat the third paragraph:

During pre-production, the music team worked with Stone extensively. There are no cuts in the scene; thus, it had to be perfected entirely in one shot. Multiple rehearsals were held so she could learn the song's technical points, notes, and form; the plan was for her to memorise "Audition" so well that she focus on her actions when filming. The camera movement was meticulously planned by the filmmakers, who shifted sets, pulled tables out, dimmed lighting, moved the camera around 360 degrees, and pulled back. While this was happening, Stone needed to ignore it and pretend none of it was occurring.

• •  Mostly done
• Replace Hurwitz was accompanying her on piano, allowing her to lead the song. Because of this, he was reacting to her, and as a result, the piano was somewhat behind the singing. Hurwitz stated that this contributed to the song's melodic, authentic, and honest feeling. with Hurwitz played the piano accompaniment live, allowing her to lead the song. Because of this, he was reacting to her, and as a result, the piano was somewhat behind the singing; Hurwitz stated that this contributed to the song's melodic, authentic, and honest feeling.
  •  Done
• Hurwitz believed that the piano needed to be recorded independently from the orchestra—there is no context for this statement. Since when was there an orchestra? Assuming that the reader knows nothing about La La Land, or even if they do, the article needs to explain early on the types of instruments present (even though it does later on). In addition, this sentence feels like it would more logically fit after ...feeling it on set with [Stone]".
  • I've done some tinkering around with this. Lemme know if it's sufficient.
• Replace Finding the arrangement on "Audition" took some time. The music team spent a long time attempting to make it completely orchestral and eliminate the piano entirely; it took a while to calibrate the orchestra entering so gently yet having to grow immensely by the last chorus without overwhelming the vocals with Writing the orchestral arrangement for "Audition" took some time. The music team spent a long time attempting to make it completely orchestral and eliminate the piano entirely; it took a while to calibrate the orchestra in such a way that it could enter gently and grow in a expansive way without overwhelming Stone's vocals.
  •  Done. Pamzeis (talk) 12:48, 1 October 2023 (UTC)

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As a point of note, it seemed like you directly copied the quotations in many cases without altering the wording, or leaving the words as quotations. In my mind, that made for a lot of awkward wording and weird phrasing. The way we speak is vastly different from anything encyclopedic. Cessaune [talk] 03:54, 1 October 2023 (UTC)

• @Cessaune: Responded to your comments Pamzeis (talk) 01:47, 2 October 2023 (UTC)

  Alright. I went through and finished verifying the sources, and everything checks out. Good job; the article has passed!

  Are you going to do a DYK nom? Cessaune [talk] 17:47, 5 October 2023 (UTC)

  Actually never mind; one was already done. Cessaune [talk] 17:51, 5 October 2023 (UTC)