Talk:Eurovision Song Contest 2015/Archive 4

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Latvia

I've had to remove a source from the main article, due to WP:SELFCITE. The source itself is this one, which has now been removed, and should not be re-used due to conflict of interest. Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 17:50, 6 November 2014 (UTC)

Trijntje Oosterhuis for the Netherlands

Trijntje Oosterhuis is going to represent the Netherlands at the Eurovision Song Contest, it's a Dutch source, but it says that she's gonna represent it with a nummer that's gonna be written by Anouk. [1]Sophie | ^T@lk 22:32, 7 November 2014 (UTC)

@Sophietjex: Firstly, why have you copied my signature style? I put a lot of thought into my signature style, and find it a bit cheeky that you just copy it. Secondly, is that source reliable? If not, then we can not treat it as verifiable accuracy. Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 21:51, 7 November 2014 (UTC)

eurovision.tv themselves are only saying rumours, but sourcing from an NOS article who says she is? A bit odd since AVROTROS is the usual broadcaster. -- [[ axg // ✉ ]] 22:27, 7 November 2014 (UTC)

Yes, the only reason I added it to the article was because NOS reported on it and they're technically part of the same broadcasting corporation together with AVROTROS. I don't know, maybe it would be better for it to be removed for now until it's clear that it is official. Pickette (talk) 22:37, 7 November 2014 (UTC)

This was why I said in the first place that was the source reliable? OK it came from NOS, but doesn't AVRO, TROS, NOS (whatever they are called) take it in turns to be responsible for their selection? Who's turn is it for 2015? That is why I felt it was more logical to wait for additional sources to verify this, just in case we ended up adding rumours. I think its inclusion was a tad zealour, and its temporary removal would be the logical step at this present time. Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 14:52, 8 November 2014 (UTC)

According to an article that I read, Trijntje isn't the Dutch entrant. Her participation is just rumors from the 2013 participant Anouk. The Dutch broadcaster must confirm it first. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Adamantios 171101 (talk • contribs) 12:42, 8 November 2014 (UTC)

Trijntje Oosterhuis could might be the Dutch entrant for 2015, however several sources (like Eurovision.tv) says that she is NOT confirmed and therefor should this "news" only be called a rumor until AVROTROS have made a confirmation about this. It is just like the Bosnian news about Hari Mata Hari a few weeks ago. /Hollac16 (talk) 11:46, 9 November 2014 (UTC)

I think under the spirit of WP:CRYSTAL, until there is 100% confirmation, then the information should be omitted from this article. However, there is nothing wrong to elaborate on this information within the relevant article at Netherlands in the Eurovision Song Contest 2015 to which we'd be able to state and source this "early reports" matter. Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 18:23, 9 November 2014 (UTC)

Well that puts an end to the debate. There is an English source that now provides 101% confirmation that Trijntje Oosterhuis is the Dutch participant. Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 11:01, 10 November 2014 (UTC)

Australian broadcast & commentators confirmed

It was confirmed on November 14 2014 that Australian broadcaster SBS will once again broadcast both semi finals and the final, in Australia, of the 2015 Eurovision Song Contest, and both Sam Pang and Julia Zemiro will return as commentators. Australia is not able to compete, but perhaps that should be mentioned somewhere in the article. http://www.tvtonight.com.au/2014/11/sbs-2015-highlights-poh-go-back-food-and-drama.html. Whats new? (talk) 09:28, 14 November 2014 (UTC)

 Done - Thanks for the heads-up. I've added the information to the commentators section. Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 10:06, 14 November 2014 (UTC)

It's quite curious that the Eurovision contest is popular in Australia. Given that Armenia and Israel, being non-European countries, already participate, maybe Australia will be able to participate in the future, who knows? Mondolkiri1 (talk) 06:11, 20 November 2014 (UTC)

Bosnia and Herzegovina

This is final and official confirmation from national TV station of Bosnia and Herzegovina that Bosnia and Herzegovina will not take part in ESC 2015. It is confirmed today (17.11.) on official website. Translated as: "Given the very difficult financial situation in which there is BHRT, and a drastic drop in license fee collection, this house has been withdrawn from the Eurovision Song Contest, which will be organized next year in Austria." --Smooth O (talk) 15:10, 17 November 2014 (UTC)

I think we should wait for an English worded source (no offence) just for more clear verification. Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 15:31, 17 November 2014 (UTC)

39 countries, not 38...

Hi, I'm sorry to say that, correct me if it needs, but it has mistakes on the number of confirmed countries, in spite of the withdraw of Bosnia and Herzegovina, the official list of 39 countries (Jon Ola Sand said that in a tweet), does not include Bosnia and Herzegovina because, its confirmed participation was not a final confirmation, moreover, Greece isn't included in this list, 'cause its new broadcaster NERIT isn't an EBU's broadcaster yet.http://www.escdaily.com/sand-39-countries-vienna/ Wikays (talk) 17:50, 17 November 2014 (UTC)

That is an old source and is basically reprinting other sources that picked up on Jon Ola Sand's twitter feed of "39". We've already established how we are treating the Greece situation, and the current method used on the article has gained more favourable support, and it does state in the footnote for Greece that their application is "provisional" and "pending their EBU membership" - membership that sources have also verified is "to be granted at the EBU General Assembly" next month. Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 17:57, 17 November 2014 (UTC)

Ya I know but Greece isn't in the official list, many sources/links say that, so it has 39 countries plus 2 other mysterious countries, since the withdraw of Bosnia-Herzegovina... Wikays (talk) 18:04, 17 November 2014 (UTC)

@Wikays: - Here we go with the confirmation that Bosnia will not be in Vienna, the source states the current provisional number is 38 (and also shows Greece within that number, despite them being "pending"). It is the fact that Bulgaria are still undecided; and should they say yes to 2015, then they'd become number 39. But one also needs to remember that the list is only provisional and is subject to change until the publication of the finalised list which is expect sometime in January. We should not be mixing the two definitions and trying to say everything is concrete 100% official, until such final list is published. Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 18:07, 17 November 2014 (UTC)

Map of participating countries

Bulgaria is coloured as if they had never participated. They need to be coloured yellow and not gray. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.249.183.252 (talk) 15:43, 19 November 2014 (UTC)

Bulgaria are grey because they are still to make a decision on participation. If they decide not to participate, then they will be turned yellow. If they say yes to participation, they will be turned purple. Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 16:09, 19 November 2014 (UTC)

Amber's song

Are we not being a bit premature regarding the song for Malta? PBS changed the rules, and the winning artists now has the choice of whether to sing Warrior in Vienna, or something different - see here which quotes "The result means Amber wins the right to represent Malta at the Eurovision Song Contest next year, however not necessarily with the entry she performed tonight. New rules brought in for this years edition of Malta’s Eurovision Song Contest selection process allow for the winning artist to change their song should they choose.". I would have waited for solid confirmation of song choice for now, based on that factor alone, or at least footnote it and hold-off on creating an article for the song itself at this early stage. Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 23:12, 22 November 2014 (UTC)

I agree with you in principal. But I can see now that an article about the song has been created. So I personally see no harm in letting the article stay at the ESC 2015 article with a note that it might not be the final song. But that is just my opinion.--BabbaQ (talk) 23:17, 22 November 2014 (UTC)

The article I suppose is fine for now. But it really needs strong emphasis that the song title may not be the one to be performed in Vienna. The song article currently states that it will be performed in Vienna, when the PBS rules explicitly state it may not, that choice is now down to Amber. Footnoting this article and Malta in ESC 2015 article to show this factor would be the most logical thing to do! Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 23:21, 22 November 2014 (UTC)

Yes, you are right.--BabbaQ (talk) 23:24, 22 November 2014 (UTC)

 Done  expanded Warrior (Amber Bondin song) and added a footnote to this article so they explicitly show the song choice is subject to change, per PBS rules. This way we are expressing the true facts. Trying to say the song will be Warrior is giving factual in-correctness, especially when we have sources that contradict that fact and show it may be the song choice. Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 23:41, 22 November 2014 (UTC)

• I do have one question though. Why do national broadcasters and the like have to start doing weird changes like this, that gets us lot into a pandemoniums state, and we end up running around like headless chickens not knowing how to handle this bizarre situations. First we had NERIT, and we didn't know what to do, how to handle it, and then just gave it a "footnote" (which I will admit, does the job perfectly). And now this with Malta, who may change their song (again the footnote does the job nicely). Lesson to learn here - if in doubt... footnote it! Simples! Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 23:48, 22 November 2014 (UTC)

Logo

Plz convert logo to SVG. ← Alex Great ^talk_rus? 10:35, 25 November 2014 (UTC)

Probably a bit too complicated to be vectorised. -- [[ axg // ✉ ]] 18:48, 25 November 2014 (UTC)

I need to upload png version in SVG file of logo in Russian Wikipedia at first time, because many users upload this copyrighted logo at Commons. Plz {{ping}} me if you vectorise it in English Wikipedia. ← Alex Great ^talk_rus? 07:25, 26 November 2014 (UTC)

I agree with AxG, it looks a very complex design to be vectorised. Way too much intricate detail. Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 17:28, 26 November 2014 (UTC)

If anybody cares, I've found another version of the logo online with much higher resolution (although it is jpg and not png) https://www.wien.gv.at/rk/msg/2014/11/25007.html Judith Sunrise (talk) 23:04, 13 January 2015 (UTC)

Unfortunately, as per the Wikipedia:Non-free content criteria (criterion 3b), only the lowest usable resolution should be uploaded to the English Wikipedia. CT Cooper · talk 11:58, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

Australian Participation ?

I have read in some articles that the Australian broadcaster is being discussing with EBU about the Australian participation in the contest because of the big amount of viewers, is it true? 46.246.206.72 (talk) 13:28, 6 December 2014 (UTC)

Protection request

There's many a red-linked editor going mad over returning nations, may need to protect the article somewhat in the short-term? doktorb _words^deeds 17:18, 9 December 2014 (UTC)

Request for semi-protection has been submitted. Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 13:47, 10 December 2014 (UTC)

Since a response at WP:RFPP has not been forthcoming, I've re-protected the page myself for a nine month period. Normally I would have gone for sixth months but since it would have set expiry shortly after the contest had finished, I didn't think that would be appropriate. Pending changes has been tried but activity is really too high for it to work on this article. CT Cooper · talk 19:50, 10 December 2014 (UTC)

norway`s participation could be in jepordy

netflix is suing NRK over lilyhammer for somewhere around 90 millions. if they have to pay that it could either prevent the national final of even prevent participation. 84.213.46.153 (talk) 10:12, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

This feels like déjà vu, I'm sure someone else on here stated a participation was in 'jeopardy', but in the end they participated. Anyway, we can not change anything until they announce something. -- [[ axg // ✉ ]] 14:53, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

Albanian song

Why is the Albanian song named as Diell ? It is said on eurovision.tv or esctoday.com that the song title is Të kërkoj. I think there is a little problem no ? Yoyo360 (talk) 00:09, 29 December 2014 (UTC)

Originally the song was called "Të kërkoj" but it was changed shortly before the second semi-final. All sources used and the Albanian broadcaster call the song "Diell" however Eurovision.tv seems to be incorrect in reporting it under its original title. { [ ( jjj 1238 ) ] } 01:08, 29 December 2014 (UTC)

Well this issue is very simple to resolve. If RTSH changed the song title to "Diell", but sources stipulate "Të kërkoj", then ideally we should use the latter as we are able to verify with sources. However, use a footnote (like we did for Greece) so that we can provide additional information about RTSH and/or the artist changing the song title shortly before the second semifinal. Because we all know that between now and May, that Albania may change the title again and for the entry in English - which will mean we update the article again. If contradicting/confusing problems arise like this, then footnotes are the easiest way to resolve matter, whilst providing a simple compromise. Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 15:13, 29 December 2014 (UTC)

Eurovision.tv has now changed it to "Diell". Problem solved. { [ ( jjj 1238 ) ] } 17:21, 29 December 2014 (UTC)

Finalists?

Why are six countries already listed as being finalists? Surely we won't know who the finalists are until after the semifinals. —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 16:35, 9 January 2015 (UTC)

@Angr: As is the case every year, the host country along with the "Big Five" - France, Germany, Italy, Spain, and the UK - automatically qualify into the grand final - without having to take part in the semifinals. The "big five" are called as such, because they are the major contributors in terms of financing the contest. Without whom, would mean all the other countries would have an even bigger fee to pay, and may result in a lot of countries pulling out of the contest due to being unable to finance their entries. It is all detailed in the Eurovision Song Contest 2015#Format section. Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 16:48, 9 January 2015 (UTC)

OK, thanks! I see that this year they're returning to the tradition of holding the final on the night before Whitsun. I missed it last year because I was expecting it to be the night before Whitsun, but it wasn't. —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 16:57, 9 January 2015 (UTC)

Yeah, they tend to change the dates each year. Once upon a time they took place in April (and I think the odd ones in the earlier years in March). The original dates for this year should have been 12, 14, and 16 - but the Austrian broadcaster moved them back a week. Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 17:04, 9 January 2015 (UTC)

"[T]radition"? - I've never heard about this tradition of holding it the day before that day. -- [[ axg // ✉ ]] 19:03, 9 January 2015 (UTC)

Curiosity got the better of me on this, and I had to investigate if it were true. Here are my findings...

Whitsun

• May: 56; 58–59; 61; 64; 66–67; 69–72; 75; 77–78; 80; 82–83; 85–86; 88–89; 91; 93–94; 96–99; 02; 04–05; 07–10; 12–13; and 15.
• June: 57; 60; 62–63; 65; 68; 73–74; 76; 79; 81; 84; 87; 90; 92; 95; 00–01; 03; 06; 11; and 14.

Eurovision

• March: 57–66; 69–70; 72; 75; and 79.
• April: 67–68; 71; 73–74; 76; 78; 80–83; 88; and 94.
• May: 56; 77; 84–87; 89–93; and 1995–2015.

Only three times in Eurovision history has the date of the final fallen on the Eve of Whitsun: 2012; 2013; and 2015. So not really much of a "tradition" but more a minor coincidence. Ironically, all of those three years are when the preliminary dates were set a week or two before, and the host broadcasters changed the dates. Wes Mouse | ^T@lk 06:35, 10 January 2015 (UTC)

Well, it was a tradition in my mind, because Whitsun is one day when I really don't want to miss church in the morning, which means no staying up late at Eurovision parties on Saturday night! Anyway, thanks for your research; it gives me hope that maybe in 2016 I will be able to celebrate both occasions! —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 14:14, 10 January 2015 (UTC)