Talk:Kurds/Archive 15

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Kurdish migration to Turkey

Kurds who fled Iran-Iraq war from 1988 Halabja : 60.000-120.000

Kurds fleeing the 1.Gulf War 1991 : 460.000 [1]

Kurds who fled civil war in Syria : 400.000 Syria civil war [2]

ISIS terror Yezidis fled : 100.000 [3]

Kurdish population in Turkey: Kurdish population in Turkey before 1980 was around 9-11%. Iran-Iraq war of Halabja,First Gulf War,Gulf War 2,Syria civil war Began to increase, Today, the Kurdish population in this migration has reached 14-16%

— Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.178.45.153 (talk • contribs) 15:00, 16 November 2014 (UTC)

Bullshit :) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 151.250.15.59 (talk • contribs) 16:59, 23 November 2014 (UTC)

If neither of you cite sources, no one is going to act either way. Please see WP:Verifiability for why we cite sources, and WP:Citing sources for how to do so. Thank you.  — SMcCandlish ☺ ☏ ¢ ≽^ʌⱷ҅_ᴥⱷ^ʌ≼  10:18, 3 August 2015 (UTC)

Kurdish population is not correct , showing the political high Iran demographics Iran demographics — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.160.197.161 (talk) 20:48, 17 October 2015 (UTC)

Judaism - again

It seems like the "Judaism" section is back in this article again, and that the 100-200k "Kurds in Israel" has been added back to the population figures. This is ridiculous, the Jews of Kurdistan are ethnic Jews. Again, that section could be added to the Kurdistan article. Shmayo (talk) 15:15, 26 November 2015 (UTC)

Just noticed that the section was added today. Shmayo (talk) 15:21, 26 November 2015 (UTC)

That's not the truth, they're ethnic Assyrians and not Kurds and they are speaking a Jewish dialect of Assyrian Neo-Aramaic called "Targumic", Jews as an ethnicity doesn't exist for almost 2000 years — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.64.182.139 (talk) 19:59, 28 November 2015 (UTC)

Flag of Iraqi Kurdistan is not the flag of all Kurdish groups

Various Kurdish organizations have many flags . Some of the flags are covered in article Kurdish flag , to have a view of how many flags that are used by many Kurdish groups , I present the temple about Kurdish nationalist organisations:

Then why the article , that is about all groups of Kurds , uses only one flag out of many ?--Alborz Fallah (talk) 11:50, 13 October 2015 (UTC)

There is one and only one Kurdish flag, and thats Flag of Kurdistan. Other flags are just organisatory ones. --Ahmetyal (talk) 19:03, 13 October 2015 (UTC)

Is there consensus among all Kurds about that ? As I know almost all Kurdish populations that have connection with PKK ( Syrian Kurds and Turkey's Kurds ) never use the flag that is popular in Iraq ( and to some extent in Iran ) . Can you give a source about consensus among all Kurds to use one flag ( that flag ) ?--Alborz Fallah (talk) 21:35, 27 October 2015 (UTC)

The Kurdish flag is banned in Turkey, Syria and Iran so naturally you're not going to see it there as frequently as you see it in Iraq. The Flag of Kurdistan is used by all Kurds. This is visible during protests and demonstration outside of those countries where a Kurdish flag is usually present next to that of a political organization. See GettyImages and other news sites. Is there a reason to believe that the Flag of Kurdistan isn't the flag of all Kurds? ~ Zirguezi 22:38, 27 October 2015 (UTC)

To be used as official flag of all Kurdish groups , reliable sources are in need . In Wikipedia , we need RS for every sentence , but the opposite is not true : I mean I don't need to represent any sources to show that is NOT the flags of all groups . --Alborz Fallah (talk) 06:50, 21 November 2015 (UTC)

If you'd bothered to look actually read what I wrote you would have had your sources. Here are some more: 1234. Please refrain from changing the article until we've reached a consensus. ~ Zirguezi 20:31, 21 November 2015 (UTC)

Pardon , but I do bothered so much to read any sources , but there was only reverting and no source-giving . Anyway , the recent sources are as following : 1- Danilovich, has no page to look ! 2- Aziz, Mahir , In page 130 says nothing about Kurds of Syria or Turkey ( or etc ): it is talking about conflicts between central government of Iraq and autonomous Kurdish region of Iraq about their flags . 3- In the third source "Iraq : briefings and hearing" there is nothing about flag of kurdish Syrians or Turkish Kurds .--Alborz Fallah (talk) 08:03, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

Links work for me. Here are the extracts:

• The Kurdish flag has particular significance for this stateless nation. It was first hoisted to mark an independent Kurdistan(...) Since then, this red, white and green banner has been a rallying sign for all Kurds and a symbol of Kurdish national identity. ~ Dr Alex Danilovich
• The flag for the Kurds represents their nationality and it functions as an important symbol for Kurdistanyati ~ Mahir A. Aziz
• You can call this place Kurdistan (…) only the Kurdistan flag flies ~ Iraq : briefings and hearing
• and the Peshmarga general gave Davidson a Kurdistan flag ~ Charles M. Grist

Nowhere is the distinction made between an Iraqi Kurdistan flag and a Syrian/Turkish/Iranian Kurdistan flag. The flag is just referred to as the flag of Kurdistan or Kurdish flag. Danilovich even states that it is for "all Kurds". Do you have a source that claims otherwise? If you do you should consider adding it to Flag of Kurdistan ~ Zirguezi 10:13, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

Among the above , only Danilovich may have that understanding . Can you give the page ( and an online link if possible ) ?--Alborz Fallah (talk) 11:47, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

Danilovich and the other sources prove that the flag is referred to as the flag of Kurdistan as opposed to the flag of Iraqi Kurdistan. If you think otherwise then please provide a source that says that there is a difference between. I don't have the links right now but I've added the page number to the article source. ~ Zirguezi 23:20, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

To prove that is flag of all groups , we need sources , but in asking for sources , we don't need RS to prove that is wrong . --Alborz Fallah (talk) 09:13, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

I'm from northern Kurdistan and I say Kurdistan flag is national flag of all Kurds. I think you're an Persian nationalist and you do not want the union of Kurds. Selocan49 (talk) 06:17, 30 November 2015 (UTC)

That's a personal attack for which you could be blocked. See WP:WIAPA: examples of blockable personal attacks includes "Using someone's affiliations as an ad hominem means of dismissing or discrediting their views—regardless". Asking for sources is a reasonable thing to do. Dismissing that request with a personal atack and with original research ("I'm from northern Kurdistan and I say Kurdistan is national flag") which is also prohibited is not acceptable. DeCausa (talk) 07:48, 30 November 2015 (UTC)

Proposal for the deletion of all the galleries of personalities from the articles about ethnic groups

Seemingly there is a significant number of commentators which support the general removal of infobox collages. I think there is a great opportunity to get a general agreement on this matter. It is clear that it has to be a broad consensus, which must involve as many editors as possible, otherwise there is a big risk for this decision to be challenged in the near future. I opened a Request for comment process, hoping that more people will adhere to this proposal. Please comment here. TravisRade (talk) 23:06, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

That is not an RfC and it doesn't follow the RfC process. It's just a collection of opinions and has no authority. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 23:14, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

The RfC was opened correctly. please comment at Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Ethnic_groups#Proposal_for_the_deletion_of_all_the_galleries_of_personalities_from_the_infoboxes_of_articles_about_ethnic_groups. Dkfldlksdjaskd (talk) 09:30, 17 December 2015 (UTC)

Removed Propaganda Source with Incorrect Math

http://ekurd.net/mismas/articles/misc2012/9/turkey4166.htm

There's no such a publication, completely propaganda source. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Noyan Sipahi (talk • contribs) 16:21, 23 December 2015 (UTC)

You should add the kurdish professional Wrestler Heresh Kurdi in this article.

Wrong question

The discussion above about whether the tricolor flag with the yellow star is representative of Kurds in general is interesting, but it is somewhat beside the point here. The use of flags in connection with the heading of ethnic group infoboxes has been popular in some Wiki areas, but according to WP:MOSFLAG flags should not be used like that. Such flags have been removed from several "Kurds in xxx" articles and other "Ethnic group Y in zzz" articles, and they should not figure here either. If the discussion about the flag is to be continued, it should probably be discussed at Template talk:Kurds, where the flag, if applicable, is more relevant. --T*U (talk) 21:38, 22 December 2015 (UTC)

Thanks very much for this. It's something that's been nagging at the back of my mind about this discussion and I agree that we should not be using flags here. Doug Weller (talk) 21:59, 22 December 2015 (UTC)

I agree. Other pages like Pashtuns don't seem to have a flag either. ~ Zirguezi 12:17, 30 December 2015 (UTC)

Falsified information

I deleted "Large number of Kurds in Iran show no interest in Kurdish nationalism,[158] especially Shia Kurds who even vigorously reject idea of autonomy, preferring direct rule from Tehran.[158][175] Iranian national identity is questioned only in the peripheral Kurdish Sunni regions.[181]" and replaced with "Large number of Kurds in Iran are neutral to Kurdish nationalism and barely one-third support the government especially Shia Kurds who even vigorously reject idea of autonomy, preferring direct rule from Tehran. Iranian national identity is questioned mainly in the Kurdish Sunni regions"

The source doesn't say that large number of Kurds in Iran show no interest in Kurdish nationalism, it says: ...Kurdistan Democratic Party of Iran (KDPI) must be set less promising factors. Barely one third of Iranian Kurds fell inside the republic, and of these a large number, perhaps a majority, remained passively neutral. Most, tribal Kurds still had no interest in Kurdish nationalism...

This means large number of Kurd in Iran are neutral to Kurdish nationalism. With Tribal Kurds he meant the Kurds in 80' and 90'. It is not possible you decide from it that large number of Kurds in Iran show no interest in Kurdish nationalism. Also, this source says, large number of the Kurd support autonomy in Iran. Source: McDowall, David (1992). "The Kurds: A Nation Denied". London: Minority Rights Publications p. 65. Ferakp (talk) 19:35, 20 January 2016 (UTC)

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Kurdish Political Situation

Hello! I believe someone must state the current political situation of the Kurds; somewhere along the lines of their hostility and constant attacks against their fellow Christian neighbors in Iraq. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 205.154.39.203 (talk) 00:59, 11 February 2016 (UTC)

You're welcome to do it if you've a legitimate, non-anecdotal source. ~ Zirguezi 23:36, 13 February 2016 (UTC)

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Deism??

The religion category in this infobox mentions a deist minority among the Kurds. Can anybody provide a source for this? I haven't been able to find any references, and it seems on the face of it implausible that deism, a philosophical position associated with a particular time and place in the western tradition, would have a more than negligible following among a people with a completely different philosophical tradition. It seems most plausible to me that a previous editor has mis-characterized 'secularism' as a political position with 'deism' as a philosophical position. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.165.8.63 (talk) 14:46, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

Deism is not necessarily a "position associated with a particular time and place in the western tradition". I'm not a student of philosophy, but generally "deism" can mean a faith in God that is not bound to a particular revealed scripture or religious authority. This position definitely exists among contemporary Kurds, and I think that's what is meant. If there is any specific reason why the word "deism" should not apply here, you would have to give more precise arguments. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 93.206.129.241 (talk) 00:40, 27 March 2016 (UTC)

Zand Period - Iran Civil War!

In the section pertaining to Zand period, it is stated that:

"After Nader's death, Iran fell into civil war, with multiple leaders trying to gain control over the country". This is absolutely incorrect. A History of Persia by Sir Percy Molesworth Sykes (1930) is used as a reference. This book, which has two volumes, makes no such assertions. In fact, there is not a single historian who has ever stated that Iran has ever experienced a civil war. This claim is balsas and without a shred of evidence.

I attempted to correct this mistake, by altering the following statement:

"After Nader's death, Iran fell into civil war, with multiple leaders trying to gain control over the country" to "after Nader's death, a number of popular uprisings began, with multiple leaders trying to gain control over the country".

This edit was reverted by WilliamThweatt with the following explanation: "sorry but "a number of popular uprisings with multiple leaders trying to gain control over the country" = Civil War".

The user WilliamThweatt is not at all informed in the subject matter and rather shockingly, deploys a personal, and rather creative interpretation of what is written. Putting aside how uninformed and simply, flat out wrong, the response "sorry but "a number of popular uprisings with multiple leaders trying to gain control over the country" = Civil War" is, creative interpretations of certain historical events, carry no value. Iran has never experienced a civil war in it's 7,000 years history, not even for a short period of time. This is a fact and not an opinion. The burden of proof is on those who reject this to provide evidence to the contrary.

1. I recommend making the following alteration: "after Nader's death, a number of popular uprisings began, with multiple leaders trying to gain control over the country";

2. Limit the authorities of the user WilliamThweatt who has demonstrated his/her lack of knowledge in the subject matter. It makes absolutely no sense for such a user to alter or revert a page when the said individual has no/limited knowledge in that area.

Perpetuation of false information needs to stop immediately. Wikipedia is not a propaganda platform. Individuals attempting to use it as such ought to be sanctioned.

Kind regards NuturalObserver (talk) 00:02, 24 April 2016 (UTC)

A number of sources mention civil war in Iran/Persia, including one between Artaxerxes II and Cyrus the Younger, eg [4], [5], [6] and [7]. Looks like there are historians who argue that there was at least one civil war.Then there's Persian Constitutional Revolution which seems to describe a civil war and calls it one, and another article Attempts at Constitutionalization in Iran#Civil War and Legacy of the Revolution which has a section on civil war (hm, aren't these duplicates?). As for the Zand period, "The restoration of Iranian control over the South Caucasus proved to he shortlived. and came to an abrupt end with the assassination of Nader Shah in 1747 Iran sank into renewed civil war..."[8] "Persia's sufferings did not end with Nader's death. The greater part of the next 50 years was taken up by civil war as his empire split."(note the word "renewed"[9]If anyone is going to be sanctioned by the way it would be you for the personal attack. Doug Weller talk 02:15, 24 April 2016 (UTC)

More details comments now at WP:RSN#Are these sources suitable for suggesting Iran/Persia has experienced civil war?. Doug Weller talk 14:40, 24 April 2016 (UTC)

Kurdish population in Syria

The 4th edition of Atlas was used a source. The problem with the source:
1. The total population of Syria mentioned in the source is not valid anymore and it's old, even though the book was published in 2010. All newest sources give 22-24M, the Atlas is in 21M.
2. More than 9 sources are against Atlas source, they all give 8-15%, but Atlas gives 6% which is clearly not even close to other sources.
3. The World bank and all its sources are against Atlas numbers.
4. CNN library 2015 shows many sources and it give 10%.

The Atlas source was contradictory and against all other sources. Also, all newest sources are against it. That's why I removed it. Ferakp (talk) 17:25, 18 May 2016 (UTC)

Kurdish population in Turkey

Source number 3 is not a valid proof. In the beginning it says "The Turkish Statistical Institute (TurkStat) recently published the birth records of Kurdish citizens in Turkey." But this is not true, these are not the birth records of Kurdish citizens, but the birth records of cities in the southeastern region of Turkey which are mainly populated by Kurds. This is not the same.

At the end there is a calculation how they determined the number of the Kurds in Turkey:

"But, taking 22.7 million as the number of Kurds and adding the 1 million who live in central Anatolia and other regions, then subtracting the number of citizens of other ethnicities who live in the Kurdish regions, leads to an acceptable figure of around 20 million."

But this calculation doesn't seem to be scientifical because nobody knows for sure how many Kurds live in central Anatolia or how many citizens of other ethnicities live in the Kurdish region. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 93.192.66.242 (talk) 05:58, 12 June 2016 (UTC)

World Factbook figures given in this article are interpreted incorrectly

"Turkish 70-75%, Kurdish 18%, other minorities 7-12% (2008 est.)"CIA Factbook Note that this is a 2008 estimate. The population is stated to be "79,414,269 (July 2015 est.)" The footnote also has an estimate from a 2002 book, given publication times the estimate is probably from 2001, ie 15 years old.

In other words, the Kurdish population of Turkey IN 2008 was estimated to be 18%. But what was the population then? Our article on Demographics of Turkey says 71,517,100 and one of the sources, an official Turkish one, so we end up with 12,873,078. Doug Weller talk 12:42, 1 July 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 1 July 2016

"estimates from 12 to 22.5 million" is incorrect. There are around 14m Kurds are living in Turkey. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurdish_population Stardust al (talk) 09:29, 1 July 2016 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. — JJMC89 (T·C) 20:39, 1 July 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 1 July 2016

http://ekurd.net/mismas/articles/misc2012/9/turkey4166.htm

In this article it says "there are 22,691,824 Kurds in Turkey, mostly born in Kurdish cities in the southeast of the country. Therefore, out of Turkey’s 74.7 million citizens, more than 30 percent are Kurds. These records only include people who have been registered at official government institutions." It does not mean that the people who born in these cities are Kurdish, vice versa it means they are Turkish because country is Turkey, and they are Turkish Citizens, not Kurdish citizens. It is not a reliable source.

Stardust al (talk) 09:32, 1 July 2016 (UTC)

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format.  ^B E _C K ^Y _S A ^{Y L} E _S  14:06, 6 July 2016 (UTC)

Kurds in Armenia

At the time of survey conducted, only 2 162 /two thousand one hundred sixty two/ people have identified themselves as Kurds (քուրդ, on the fifth line), according to the given source, which is National Statistic Service's last population census: here

35 308 /thirty five thousand three hundred and eight/ people have identified themselves as Yazidis (եզդի)․ Yazidis are a distinct ethno-religious group, although 'genetically' belonging to wider Kurdish genome. They did not and do not identify themselves as Kurds.

So the number in the intro box is just an approximately summed up one and does not represent the facts. So please change. 46.241.210.207 (talk) 13:17, 26 August 2016 (UTC)

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Iraqi Kurdistan–Rojava relations

I've created a draft article about relations between Iraqi Kurdistan and Rojava using a paragraph from Foreign relations of Rojava. It needs a lot of work and I'd truly appreciate some help in developing it. Charles Essie (talk) 23:05, 14 December 2016 (UTC)

Kurds would never call themselves Iranian people

Kurds would never call themselves Iranian people, can someone please edit that? It's a very wrong fact Kurdiiaa (talk) 15:46, 20 October 2016 (UTC)

You should read the note at the head of the talk page: "This article has attracted repeated discussion whether Kurds are or are not Iranian, including the position that they instead be considered Median or Indo-European. At this time, a consensus has been reached that Kurds are often classified as Iranian, based on the reliable sources contained in the article. Before requesting the removal of the Iranian description, please familiarize yourself with the cited sources, as well as the prior discussions about this issue on this talk page and its archives. Your concerns may have already been addressed."--Ahmed Hallak (talk) 17:57, 20 October 2016 (UTC)

Academic consensus has demonstrated that they are Iranian. By the way, the term Iranian refers to " Iranic", and not about being the citizen of Iran. I think you confuse these two. 185.80.129.193 (talk) 05:16, 21 December 2016 (UTC)

Population of Kurds

The population of Kurds is about 41 million or more! Abdhm98 (talk) 22:27, 10 January 2017 (UTC)

According to the sources used in the article, the number is no more than 32 million. Here on Wikipedia we need to have "reliable sources" for any information we choose to add to articles. Yazan (talk) 16:14, 12 January 2017 (UTC)

Zand and Lurs are Kurds.. they are not not seperate , Lurstan was a part of Kurdistan.

Please remove Iranian, change it to Zagros...

Kurds are not related to Iranian at all...Kurds are older. Kurds are in fact are Sumeerian and Median. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Leonardosv (talk • contribs) 15:34, 27 June 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 25 September 2017

Add: -> Regions with significant population. Diaspora-> Israel 200,000. Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurdish_Jews_in_Israel Schubidubi (talk) 17:09, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

Not done: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit semi-protected}} template. — nihlus kryik  (talk) 18:46, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 6 October 2017

In the second sentence of the first paragraph under the section titled "Medieval period", change "Micheal the Syrian" to "Michael the Syrian". Dandelong (talk) 16:20, 6 October 2017 (UTC)

• Done. Thanks for bringing this to our attention. Tiderolls 16:28, 6 October 2017 (UTC)

Kurdish comunnity in Israel

Today, there are almost 200,000 Kurdish Jews in Israel.

http://www.timesofisrael.com/pride-and-unlikely-guests-at-kurdish-jewish-festival/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurdish_Jews_in_Israel — Preceding unsigned comment added by BorgCyber (talk • contribs) 20:31, 17 June 2017 (UTC)

See earlier discussions. These are not ethnic Kurds. Will be removing it from article again. Shmayo (talk) 16:34, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

Read WP:RS and WP:Verifiability, before imposing your personal opinion. They are self-identifying as Kurds - and described in thousands of sources, including scholarly books in Hebrew. And in Israel they are called Kurdim. And this is supported by many reliable sources published in Israel. Avaya1 (talk) 20:15, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

Thank you, I am already well aware of the rules and policies. "Kurdish" in this sense is only geographical, as they are ethnic Jews and claim so. You keep talking about reliable sources without posting any. This have been up for discussion many times here. They are described as "Assyrian Jews" in some sources, does that make them ethnic Assyrian? The Jews of Kurdistan have been speaking Neo-Aramaic for centuries. Shmayo (talk) 10:20, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

What makes these Jews different from other Mizrahi Jews? It's just nonsense. Shmayo (talk) 10:26, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

Those who persist on mentioning the 200K "Kurds" in the article are probably not familiar with the composition of the Israeli Jewish society. The Jewish population in Israel consists of Jews who migrated from many different regions and countries in which exiled Jews lived for the recent two and a half millennia. Most of the times, they didn't see themselves as part of the nation or ethnic groups they were surrounded by. Now that they are here in Israel, they carry their origin with some kind of pride, and calling themselves "Kurds" while not referring to the Kurdish ethnic and cultural life, whereas to the history and culture of Jews in Kurdistan. You can even consider their use of "Kurds" simply as a shorter name for "Jews from the Kurdistan Jewish community". Anyway, a better term for those 200K Jews would be Kurdish exodus, not Kurdish diaspora. They have been in diaspora while in Kurdistan. Now they are once again out of there. TalatlWIKI (talk) 16:46, 28 September 2017 (GMT+2)

Exactly. Jews have been living around different places in the Middle East for centuries. The question remains; what make these Jews any different from other Mizrahi Jews? Absolute nonsense to seriously claim that these Jews would be ethnic Kurds. While Jewish identity may be a complex subject, this is barely questionable. Shmayo (talk) 14:10, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

@Avaya1: I am waiting on some sort of reply, will be reverting back otherwise. Shmayo (talk) 18:41, 10 October 2017 (UTC)

I am an Israeli citizen, and the Kurdish Jews are called Kurds in Israel, and distinguish themselves as a separate identity to the many other Mizrahi Jewish groups. They also have (many of them) a Kurdish self-identity and indeed organize Kurdish events (all of which meets the fresh-hold for being identified as Kurds, as much as many other groups that come under this umbrella). This identity was indeed suppressed in Israel since the 1950s, with the belief that Jews of all backgrounds should form a 'melting pot'. But the identity exists nonetheless. All of this is personal discussion is kind of irrelevant though, to the single fact that wikipedia adheres to WP:NOTTRUTH and WP:RS and we have many reliable sources (not supporting the 200,000 figure), but supporting a figure of at least one hundred thousand. I recommend reading Ariel Sabar's book on the Kurdish Jews, which covers in depth the community in Israel and the discrimination they faced and also their connection to Assyrian peoples and the Aramaic language. https://www.amazon.com/My-Fathers-Paradise-Search-Familys/dp/1565129334 Avaya1 (talk) 08:02, 11 October 2017 (UTC)

Sorry, but that is not enough. I asked you to provide reliable sources claiming that the Jews of Kurdistan would be ethnic Kurds, and I highly doubt there are any. As you are admitting that these are Mizrahi Jews, that is just contradicting. These Jews have been speaking Aramaic longer than the Kurds have been living in the areas of northern Iraq. Furthermore, I just provided a sources where they are called "Assyrian Jews", how come that is possible if it's an establish fact that they are Kurds. It is geographical, nothing else. They may have some cultural similarities, but that does not make them Kurds. Shmayo (talk) 22:41, 12 October 2017 (UTC)

The term 'Mizrahi Jews' refers to all the dozens of different Jewish communities from the Middle East (whether Indian, or Georgian, Yemeni or Moroccan). (Mizrahi means 'Eastern'). Each of these Jewish communities has an individual history in itself. Mizrahi Jews are not a single group - but just a way to put all the non-European Jews together. Kurdish Jews are culturally distinct from other Iraqi Jews, by centuries of different history, language, and culture.

Secondly, the concept of 'ethnic Kurd' does not really exist, as they are multi-ethnic, and this article is using a wider sense of Kurds, as it includes groups like Yazidis or Zazas, which are also separate groups that that speak different languages, and do not intermarry (Zazas even have a national movement, yet they are included here). There are hundreds of sources that these are called Kurds under the definition of the word used.

The terminology Kurdish is correct, as they are called Kurds (Kurdim) in Hebrew and by themselves - and we follow WP:RS and WP:NOTTRUTH - they are called Kurdish Jews or Jewish Kurds in the literature and we replicate this. The fact that they are also historical connections with Assyrians can be explained in the body of the text. It's not an either/or question.

Read here for an explanation that Kurds are not a single ethnicity, but a self-identification (note wiki generally follows self-identification) https://books.google.co.il/books?id=JZ6JAgAAQBAJ&pg=PA9&dq=jewish+kurds+ethnic+kurds+assyrian&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiIuZf4tfTWAhWHnBoKHS9JDJg4ChDoAQg6MAQ#v=onepage&q=jewish%20kurds%20ethnic%20kurds%20assyrian&f=false

Here are example sources of terminology: https://books.google.co.il/books?id=DoNSXwb8D9EC&pg=PA150&dq=jewish+kurds&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjy5Ir8sPTWAhXLcBoKHeKLC0YQ6AEIWjAJ#v=onepage&q=jewish%20kurds&f=false

https://books.google.co.il/books?id=xgXICQAAQBAJ&pg=PT224&dq=%22jewish+kurds%22&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiopvnitPTWAhXCuRoKHZdaCqUQ6AEINjAD#v=onepage&q=%22jewish%20kurds%22&f=falseAvaya1 (talk) 05:14, 16 October 2017 (UTC)

Sorry but it is not that simple. There is no need to muddy the waters. Yazidis speak Kurmanji (a Kurdish dialect) and Zazas speak a Northwestern Iranian dialect which is very close to Kurdish (that is the reason why they are often called as Kurds). However, we can't say this for the Jews from the region. They don't even speak an Iranian dialect, let alone Kurdish. The same issue has been heavily discussed before on WP. These Jews from Arab, Persian, Kurdish, Turkish areas are Hebrews. See the article of Arab Jews. Even though the term Arab Jew is sometimes used in the literature, they are still Hebrews and not the Arabs. 109.60.187.151 (talk) 07:08, 16 October 2017 (UTC)

I am pretty sure even you know those do not fall under WP:RS. Very weak comparison with the already controversial issue with Yazidis and Zazas. I fully agree with the user above. Shmayo (talk) 11:12, 18 October 2017 (UTC)

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Kurds in Armenia

Number of Kurdish population in Armenia stands at 2162 according to the latest, 2011 census. http://www.armstat.am/file/doc/99478353.pdf

There was a mini discussion and an unanswered request a zillion years ago

 Done L293D (☎ • ✎) 13:25, 9 June 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 10 June 2018

Please either clarify or remove the last two sentences under Culture>Women. Either there's a myth being propagated that needs to be clearly laid out (and with attention to grammar: instead of 'In 1930s,' it should be 'In the 1930s,'), or this is a PoV edit that somehow slipped through. If you examine the linked article on Kurdish Women, no such myth is mentioned. Also the book referenced is a group of feminist essays on violence against women in Kurdish communities in Turkey, and the final sentence makes it unclear whether the book propagates the myth (as part of the activists mentioned?) or debunks it. Basically, these sentences either need to be clarified or removed entirely. 146.189.21.199 (talk) 19:55, 10 June 2018 (UTC)

 Done L293D (☎ • ✎) 02:16, 11 June 2018 (UTC)

Kurdish Jews

It seems there's a small but very old community of Kurdish Jews. The German article briefly mentions it by giving the following source: H. Lehmann, F. Ala, S. Hedeyat, K. Montazemi, H. Karini Nejad, S. Lightman, A. C. Kopec, A. E. Mourant, P. Teesdale, D. Tills: The Hereditary Blood Factors of the Kurds of Iran. Philosophical Transactions of the Royal Society of London. Series B, Biological Sciences 266, No. 876, Biological studies of Yemenite and Kurdish Jews in Israel and Other Groups in Southwest Asia (Oct. 18, 1973), p. 196. I came to the English article to find out more, but there's no mention here. --2003:71:4F4B:6332:8CC1:64A5:8A7E:9CF5 (talk) 02:26, 19 July 2018 (UTC)

Nevermind, I've only looked at the section Religion. I've now found History of the Jews in Kurdistan. --2003:71:4F4B:6332:8CC1:64A5:8A7E:9CF5 (talk) 02:29, 19 July 2018 (UTC)

Their financial crisis

Why nobody added what we have been going through since 2014 teachers and people who work for the government expects (police until recently)* getting 50% cut then to 75% and on top of that getting paid every 50 plus days instead of 30 days now it has been fixed in April 2018 but it hasn’t gone back to the full 100% , what about our bad electricity, what about the strange smell in the air around the city in summer night because of the oil instruction around the city. Malarzeus (talk) 22:24, 4 July 2018 (UTC)

I don't think it would fit this article to include those events. This page is about the Kurds as a people. The issues you described would better fit Iraqi Kurdistan. But even then I don't think it's very relevant as it is more newspaper content than encyclopedic. You're welcome to add it if you think otherwise. ~ Zirguezi 19:40, 21 July 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 22 October 2018

X:The Kurds (Kurdish: کورد‎, Kurd) or the Kurdish people (Kurdish: گەلی کورد‎, Gelî kurd) comprise an Iranian ethnic group[24] of the Middle East, mostly inhabiting a contiguous area spanning adjacent parts of southeastern Turkey (Northern Kurdistan), northwestern Iran (Eastern Kurdistan), northern Iraq (Southern Kurdistan), and northern Syria (Western Kurdistan).[25] The Kurds are culturally, historically and linguistically classified as belonging to the Iranian peoples. Y: The Kurds are a Caucasian ethnic group, mostly inhabiting a contiguous area spanning adjacent parts of southeastern Turkey (Northern Kurdistan), northwestern Iran (Eastern Kurdistan), northern Iraq (Southern Kurdistan), and northern Syria (Western Kurdistan).[25]

Linguistically, the Kurds speak an Indo-Iranian language that falls into the Indo European language branch. Genetic analysis has shown that the Kurdish people are closely related to the Azeri, Armenian, Georgian, and Jewish peoples, descending from some common ancestors in the northern Near East region

The Kurds are not an Iranian ethnic group but a Caucasian ethnic group. They speak an Iranian language but that does not make them Iranian. I have shown you (from a reliable website) that genetically Kurds are in fact a Caucasian ethnic group, originating from the Caucasus.Indo-European Caucasians: A) Ethnic groups speaking Iranian Indo-European languages include Kurds, Ossetians, Talysh, and That. I have given you a genetic analysis that has been tested and proven to be correct by a reliable website. I hope that you understand my request and change X to Y. Mary.s.Tyler (talk) 04:57, 22 October 2018 (UTC)

Your second source is a literal no-name blog with no genetic data and the study from the first source (HLA class II similarities in Iranian Kurds and Azeris) states this in the abstract: "The results of amova revealed no significant difference between these populations and other major ethnic groups of Iran."

Here is another study that fully contradicts your claims that Kurds are not genetically Iranian, the Fst map contained within says it all:

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1046/j.1529-8817.2005.00174.x

Your claim that Kurds are genetically related to Caucasian groups is true, but it ignores the fact that Persians and other West Iranic populations are also equally closely related to Caucasians as well, and even more closely related to Kurds.

I suggest you take the time to actually read the sources you've presented.

Qahramani44 (talk) 23 October 2018 (UTC)

Jewish Kurds

This article gives little information about jewish Kurds and their significance in kurdish history. It would be expected that it is elaborated in a column in respect of the 200 000 jewish kurds living in Israel and the somewhat 400-700 families left in Iraqi Kurdistan. These are substansial numbers considering this would mean that Israel would be in the top three of countries where people in the diaspora lives. It is also a relevant to explain how the mast majority of the Kurdish Jews in northern Iraq was expelled and rescued to Israel. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 47.152.180.211 (talk) 04:05, 31 October 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 4 October 2018

Requesting edit; particularly the phrase "of the Middle east" is misleading as Kurds are distributed throughout Central Asia and the Caucuses as well. Furthermore the term "middle east" is ambiguous as it can mislead the less knowledgeable readers to incorrect conclusions regarding Kurd ethnicity, language and origins. Xoltron (talk) 18:56, 4 October 2018 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. —KuyaBriBri^Talk 20:16, 4 October 2018 (UTC)

Suggesting replacing middle east with South West Asian and Central Asian — Preceding unsigned comment added by Xoltron (talk • contribs) 22:09, 30 November 2018 (UTC)

No sources

Some sections here are not backed up by sources, and thus needs to be re-formulated. Take a look at this: "The Kurds are culturally, historically, and linguistically classified as belonging to the Iranian peoples." None of the sources cited supports anything else than the LINGUISTICAL classification.

Also: "Iranian ethnic group". This is strangely backed up with a reference to a court judgement which says nothing about this other than the fact that Kurds are an ethnic group!

The fact that the introductory section is filled with the terms "Iranian", sets the standard för this entire page (which is of very low quality) - it stinks of Iranian nationalism (and consequently low self esteem), rather than academic reliabilty.

In fact, Kurdish, only as a LANGUAGE, belongs to the Iranian LAMGUAGE GROUP (which has nothing to do with the People of Iran, or with Iranian Ethnicity), and this is the only accepted connection, in academic circles, with the LINGUISTIC term "Iranian": just read any credible author in the field!

To summarise this page, all of this shows that Wikipedia succumbs under the pressure from non-academians, and attacks made by Iranian (Persian) nationalists. To remedy this,the introductory section should be CLEANSED of all terms "Iranian". 141.70.61.65 (talk)

>> None of the sources cited supports anything else than the LINGUISTICAL classification.

The third source ([28]) in that sentence states: "The classification of the Kurds among the Iranian nations is based mainly on linguistic and historical data". Furthermore, the section "Iran" in this same page states: "Unlike in other Kurdish-populated countries, there are strong ethnolinguistical and cultural ties between Kurds, Persians and others as Iranian peoples.[158]". If you have a problem with said classification, then provide your own sources to disprove them.

Lastly, I'll point out that every other pan-ethnic group (Turkic, Slavic, Germanic, etc.) is based on language ties first and foremost, so there's no reason Iranian pan-ethnic group should be held to any higher standard or scrutiny.

I realize that you, as an emotional Kurdish ultranationalist have some sort of visceral hatred of Persians, but that shouldn't get in the way of facts and sources that have already been provided. This is Wikipedia, not your personal ethno-sectarian echo chamber. -- Qahramani44 (talk) 15:27, 22 January 2019 (UTC)

Excuse me,you only picked ONE of the sources, and took the citation out of its context, to back up the claim - the claim which is apparently made by yourself!

You simply CANNOT claim that "Kurds are Iranian" is backed up by the citation "Kurds and Persians are ethnolinguistically related" - what a terrible logic! Are you Iranian?

On the contrary, consensus amongst scholars would agree that the LINGUISTICAL classification is the ONLY one: just take a look at the pre-history of Iranians and Kurds, in any scholarly work!

By the way: WHAT ABOUT all the other sources that simply have nothing to do with the matter? What has that citation by a Dutch court (!) anything to do with the statements made in this Wikipedia page? What an abuse on TRUTH!

Finally, it is OBVIOUS that deluded-nationalist-Iranians are behind this page, by the entire introductory section, and that this shows that Wikipedia CANNOT belong anywhere academical! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 141.70.61.65 (talk) 18:18, 24 January 2019 (UTC)

The book by Micheal Izady (who himself is an ethnic Kurd), cited in the first sentence of the article, explicitly states phrases such as "Kurds were and are Iranic" (pg.37), "the Kurdish culture and language are indeed Iranic" (pg.198), and "Kurds are in fact, like the Persians, an Iranic people in speech and culture" (pg.198). Explain in what possible context could those phrases mean anything other than the fact that Kurds are an Iranic people.

>>You simply CANNOT claim that "Kurds are Iranian" is backed up by the citation "Kurds and Persians are ethnolinguistically related"

And yet that is exactly what the term "Iranian peoples" means: a group of ethnicities bound by common cultural, linguistic, and ancestral ties. Again, no different than the term "Germanic peoples" or "Turkic peoples". Explain why the former should be held to any different standards from the latter.

As for the other sources, those have been removed, those irrelevant sources have been replaced by better ones that also state that Kurds are ethnically Iranic.

>>Finally, it is OBVIOUS that deluded-nationalist-Iranians are behind this page,

The only delusional one here is you, you reject academic sources in favor of your own hurt feelings. You've yet to present any kind of source backing up your inane statements, and no, typing in caps lock is not a convincing argument to anyone above a room-temperature IQ. -- Qahramani44 (talk) 01:09, 02 February 2019 (UTC)

@Qahramani44: Judging by this IP's above comments, it appears quite obvious he/she is not here to build an encyclopedia. I would suggest you to ignore them and move forward. Best regards.---Wikaviani ^{(talk) (contribs)} 06:54, 2 February 2019 (UTC)

“Iranic” vs “Iranian”

There is a reason that a semantic divide exists between German / Germanic, Turkish / Turkic, Italian / Italic etc ... and Iranian / Iranic is the same premise. Using “Iranian” confuses people as it is also used for current citizens from the nation of Iran. So when you say “Kurds are Iranian” in English, it appears as if you’re saying Kurdish people are all citizens of Iran, or fully reside within Iran, which is not the case, in fact over 75% of Kurds in the world live outside Iran’s current borders. Moreover, because there is a movement for greater cultural rights by Kurds within Iran, or what some Kurds might refer to as “Eastern Kurdistan / Rojhelat”, when the article unequivocally states in Wikipedia’s voice that Kurds are “Iranian” (rather than Iranic), it appears more like an WP:TENDENTIOUS attempt to erase Kurdish claims of sovereignty or a unique identity, than simply trying to inform the reader that Kurds share linguistic and cultural ties to Iranic peoples (a diverse Indo-European ethno-linguistic group), which is separate and aside from the current nation called Iran. It's for these reasons that I propose Iranic be used, rather than Iranian.  Redthoreau -- (talk) 07:03, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

Let's see what's actually going on, in reality:

• Instead of bringing your concerns to the talk page right from the start, you tried to remove a long-standing consensus note from the talk page on 31 January 2019 (calling it "undue, clean up").[10]
• On 31 January 2019, you removed "Iranian" from the first part of the lede.[11]
• On 3 February 2019, you did the same.[12]
• The following day, on 4 February 2019, you did the same once again.[13]

We use "Iranian" in all articles for people's that belong to the ethno-linguistic "Iranian" group, be it Ossetians, Persian people, Pashtuns, Pamiris, etc. Kurds should be no exception. Looking at the compelling evidence, its not difficult to see that so far, you've been pursuing a WP:TENDENTIOUS editorial pattern on this article. - LouisAragon (talk) 12:35, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

More opinions are welcome @Doug Weller: @Meganesia: @Wikaviani: @Wario-Man: @HistoryofIran: @Khirurg: - LouisAragon (talk) 12:41, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

LouisAragon, the TP note solely focusing on the “Iranian” issue and nothing else is undue I believe, as it is essentially saying, “all of you who will predictably disagree with this questionable statement shouldn’t bring it up again.” The reason it continually arises is because it’s an incorrect way to phrase the issue and contradicts the majority of reliable sources. As for removing Iranian from the lead, I first adjusted it to “Iranic” instead and later removed a second mention of Kurds being Iranian in the first few sentences of the lead, as it was already included in paragraph 2 and in fact used the exact same reference. There is no need to say Kurds are Iranian 2 times in the first few sentences of the article. Lastly, going and tagging editors you are familiar with or people you think or know may agree with you is also against Wiki practices, as it potentially creates an artificial appearance of consensus where one may not exist.  Redthoreau -- (talk) 08:36, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

The common terms in English sources are Iranian (ethnolinguistic group or meta-ethnicity) and Iranian languages (language family) and we use common terms per WP guidelines. If some readers and users are too lazy to click on Iranian peoples and see what it means, then that's their problem and we can't do anything about it. Most articles about ethnic groups use similar pattern, e.g. "X are a <insert ethnolinguistic group here> ethnic group...". Kurds are not a special case here. --Wario-Man (talk) 14:38, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

"Using “Iranian” confuses people as it is also used for current citizens from the nation of Iran. So when you say “Kurds are Iranian” in English, it appears as if you’re saying Kurdish people are all citizens of Iran, or fully reside within Iran, which is not the case, in fact over 75% of Kurds in the world live outside Iran’s current borders." : irrelevant remark, nobody said that Kurds are all Iranian citizens. the word Iranian is used here in an ethnolinguistic sense, not as a citizenship or geographical location. In the same way, Pashtuns, Tajiks, Ossetians etc ... are Iranian peoples, even if most of them are neither Iranian citizens nor living in Iran.

"when the article unequivocally states in Wikipedia’s voice that Kurds are “Iranian” (rather than Iranic), it appears more like an WP:TENDENTIOUS attempt to erase Kurdish claims of sovereignty or a unique identity, than simply trying to inform the reader that Kurds share linguistic and cultural ties to Iranic peoples (a diverse Indo-European ethno-linguistic group), which is separate and aside from the current nation called Iran." : All other Iranian peoples also have a unique identity, nobody tries to erase anything, Kurds are one of the diverse ethno-linguistic group called "Iranian peoples".---Wikaviani ^{(talk) (contribs)} 16:36, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

Unless it can be shown that "Iranic" really is the most common term used in reliable English language sources I agree with those that say "Iranian" is correct. Surely it can be accompanied where appropriate with something that clarifies what is meant. Doug Weller talk 19:18, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

Everyone please see the below subsection, as the utilized Izady reference did not even present what was being claimed.  Redthoreau -- (talk) 09:41, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

Izady reference

In lieu of Professor Mehrdad R. Izady’s work The Kurds: A Concise Handbook being used as the reference to say Kurds are “Iranian” in the first sentence, I went and looked at the book itself. And indeed it confirms my position and not the one stated, as Izady himself uses Iranic, not Iranian ... examples below:

• Pg. 37, “Kurds were and are Iranic.”
• Pg. 198, “The Kurdish culture and language are indeed Iranic.”
• Pg. 168, has a graph that explicitly shows the Kurdish language as “West Iranic”.

Hence, since that is the reference being utilized, I am justified in correcting the information to be in line with the reference used.  Redthoreau -- (talk) 09:10, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

@HistoryofIran:, why are you reverting accurately cited material? Izady was the reference already there (I didn’t add it). I simply looked it up and saw that it was being inaccurately used. You can’t cite someone as a reference, but inaccurately portray what the reference says.  Redthoreau -- (talk) 12:59, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

That's not a valid argument at all. You know very well that the most common/accurate term is 'Iranian', not 'Iranic'. I'm a simple and honest man and therefor I gotta say this looks like pov-pushing to me. Also you're edit warring, reverting several users is not the answer. --HistoryofIran (talk) 15:29, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

HistoryofIran, of course it’s valid. In fact, my position is probably the clearest and most undebatable position possible. All I am trying to do is make sure that the utilized reference is accurately reflected. The very first sentence of the article cites Izady's book, to support the claim that Kurds are "Iranian", despite the fact that Izady actually says they are “Iranic”. Izady even makes note of the dispute with these terms on pg. 198, when he points out that "... confusion that now exists even in scientific circles regarding the terms Iranian and Iranic (notions as distinct as German and Germanic)...”. The only ‘pov’ I am pushing is the one that says cited references must be used accurately. If a book says the sky is blue, you can’t utilize it to say the sky is green. This is actually worse than vandalism, as you are mischaracterizing the cited work of a living person (Izady). I adjusted the wording and included the exact page numbers and words Izady uses. Your claim is basically, "who cares what the reference we’re using says, I like it my way."  Redthoreau -- (talk) 15:52, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

@Redthoreau: that's a personal attack and shows a failure to assume good faith. Your argument seems to be that even if the term used by a reliable source is used by hardly anyone else because there's a more common English word, we have to use it. I just did a search on ""West iranic" language|dialect" and ""West iranian" language|dialect" in Google scholar. There were 23 hits for "iranic"[14] and 1,050 for "Iranian"[15]. Results for Google books were similar, 439 [16] to 4,600 [17]. Doug Weller talk 16:05, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

@Doug Weller: That's not actually my position as it relates to the issue of Izady. My position is that we are utilizing Izady as a reference for a claim that is NOT what he says. In fact, he agrees with me, that Iranic is the correct term. So why are we citing someone to support a claim they do not make? As for word searches, "West Iranic" wouldn't be the right term to search as I don't even want to use that. My proposed term was Iranic, the exact one the utilized ref (Izady) uses.  Redthoreau -- (talk) 16:13, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

You gave "West Iranic" as an example and as it's more specific it's the easiest way to search. I'm sure there's a way to make it clear that when Izady says "Iranic" he means what most scholars call "Iranian". Doug Weller talk 16:23, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

@Doug Weller: your assumption is incorrect. Izady references this exact fact on page 198 and notes how "Iranian and Iranic" are "(notions as distinct as German and Germanic)". They are not the same thing or synonyms according to Izady. And he is the ONLY reference given in the first sentence.  Redthoreau -- (talk) 16:44, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

Ok, that's his opinion. Are you arguing that that is the opinion of the majority of scholars? And the lead keeps changing, at one point there were 2 sources for "Iranic", one being Izady, the other being an encyclopedia that uses "Iranian". We need to standardise the terminology although of course we can at some place in the article show Izady's opinion so long as we can show others share his distinction. If they don't, then WP:UNDUE is relevant. I think we need a WP:RfC. Doug Weller talk 16:59, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

Generally there is a lot of stuff that Izady says that is really questionable compared to that of well-known academic sources. His work has been criticised by some to be "heavy nationalistic". --HistoryofIran (talk) 17:10, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

@HistoryofIran:, if that's the case then why do you support him being used at all? Or if you don't, then you should provide additional sources for the claim. But if we use him as we currently are, we have to cite him correctly, which we currently are not doing.  Redthoreau -- (talk) 19:02, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

If you say we must use "Iranic" because Izady uses it, then that's a weak argument. How many other scholars use it? As I said, Iranian is the common term in academic sources and among scholars, and we should use it per WP guidelines. We don't invent terms and we don't try to make some terms popular on WP. I don't say using that term is wrong but what WP guidelines allow you to replace a common term with an uncommon one? Why do you think this article is special and requires some different stuff in comparison with other Iranian ethnic groups? --Wario-Man (talk) 18:29, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

@Wario-Man:, I am not inventing any terms. What I am saying is that if we are going to cite Izady for a claim, then we MUST use what Izady actually says. And he says they are Iranic, not Iranian. If “Iranian” is the common term in academic sources, then numerous ones should be provided so they can be evaluated. However, the lead is relying on Izady for 2 of the 3 references dealing with the Iranian claim, and that’s not what he claims. The 3rd is the Encyclopedia reference I discuss in the subsection below this one.  Redthoreau -- (talk) 18:57, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

Encyclopedia reference in lead

There are currently 3 references used to justify stating that Kurds are "Iranian" in the disputed lead. Of those, 2 of the 3 are exactly the same, Izady's work The Kurds: A Concise Handbook (1992), which claims Kurds are "Iranic" not Iranian. I have tried to fix this but keep getting reverted. However, the 3rd reference is "Kurds". The Columbia Encyclopedia, 6th ed. Encyclopedia.com. 2014. However, I clicked on the --> link given. It's appears it’s not from 2014, but rather a collection of Encyclopedia entries from the years 1996 to 2004, and says various contradicting things in those editions at the link. Some of those claims at the link are (use ctrl+f):

• "Although they live among them, Kurds are ethnically unrelated to Turks, Arabs, and Iranians." [no]
• "Ethnically close to the Iranians" [maybe]
• "The Kurds, along with the Tats, Talysh, and Baluchis, are Iranian people." [yes]
• "Scholars debate whether the Kurds originally belonged to a group of Iranian (Indo-European–speaking) populations living around Lake Urmia who migrated westward during the seventh century b.c.e.; others emphasize the indigenous character of the Kurds living in the Taurus and Zagros mountain ranges since antiquity." [disputed]

So of all the sources in the entire lead that support saying Kurds are Iranian, 2 of the 3 use Iranic (Izady), and the 3rd says every combination from Kurds not being Iranian to being Iranian. That is not enough to meet WP:Reliable.  Redthoreau -- (talk) 18:13, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

Though I personally prefer the term "Iranic" to be used over "Iranian" (to avoid confusion of pan-ethnicity with nationality), I will say that the article itself contains an additional source using the term "Iranian":

Kreyenbroek, Philip G.; Sperl, Stefan (1992). The Kurds: A Contemporary Overview. London; New York: Routledge.

Also I see no reason to remove the second mention in the lead, as other ethnicity pages (such as Azerbaijanis, Kazakhs) state their pan-ethnicity in the lead multiple times.

-- Qahramani44 (talk) 00:34, 06 February 2019 (UTC)

Jewish kurds?

Nothing about the 200 000 something kurdish jews? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2604:2000:B882:1800:111A:4065:F6D6:73BD (talk) 04:13, 6 February 2019 (UTC)

Are Kurds actually stateless?

Iran is the land of the Iranians, basically the Iranian ethnicities. Kurds are an Iranian peoples, therefore shouldn't the Kurds which don't live in Iran, not be classified as stateless due to this? With this same logic it could be said that Persians, Baluchis, Lurs, Azeris, Mazandaranis, Gilaks and the other Iranian peoples are stateless too. I think there needs to be some talk on this issue because when people say Kurds are "stateless" most of them aren't aware of this fact, probably also because Iran is very unique in this sense and I can't think of a nation or race like Iranians and this could lead to confusion by people which don't know this stuff? What do you all think? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Migboy123 (talk • contribs) 07:30, 22 March 2019 (UTC)

See WP:FORUM. WP talk pages are not for forum-like discussions. How does this topic have any relevance to improvement of this article? Articles already clarifies that "statelessness". But what you wrote here is just a personal opinion without any source or discussing current citations. --Wario-Man (talk) 07:49, 22 March 2019 (UTC)

Jewish Kurds

There is nothing more than 200,000 Kurdish Jews and they are Kurds who have kept their culture and language, really how do you dismiss them?

There are two pages concerning the Jews of Kurdistan: History of the Jews in Kurdistan and Kurdish Jews in Israel. They are not ethnically Kurdish and shouldn't be treated as such on Wikipedia. --Ahmedo Semsurî (talk) 22:10, 1 May 2019 (UTC)

Edit request

A new genetic study about the origin of the Kurds mention that Kurds are lagrely descedants of local people that were "Indo-Europeanized". The study further suggets that the name Kurd is derived from Sumerian Kur which means "mountain or stone". It suggests that Kurd means Mountain people or Stone people in Sumerian. The study states that Kurds are not descedants of the Indo-European horse riders from Central-Asia but that they are descedants of locals. (Possibly Sumerian mountain tribes). Here is the study:80.243.173.100 (talk) 10:24, 8 May 2019 (UTC)

That's not a reliable source. The journal is a predatory publication from Scientific Research Publishing. The study is not new but dated 2012 and our article says " In 2014 there was a mass resignation of the editorial board of one of the company's journals, Advances in Anthropology, with the outgoing Editor-in-Chief saying of the publisher "For them it was only about making money. We were simply their 'front'". If you look org/journal/DetailedInforOfEditorialBoard.aspx?personID=10176 here you see one publication in the " Proceedings of the Russian Academy of DNA Genealogy, vol. 3, No. 12 (December), 2010, 2220-2244; Foreword by Anatole A. Klyosov (2218-2219); online:: lulu. com (the link is on our spam list so I couldn't add it complete) proceedings-of-the-russian-academy-of-dna-genealogy-2010-december-vol-3-no-12/14259780 Note that this so-called Russian Academy uses Lulu.com, ie is self-published, and in fact is something Klyosov (whose DNA work is pseudoscience) created, not really an academy. That link to the author of the study says on Google "Ferdinand Hennerbichler - Editorial Board - Scientific Research ...https://www. scirp.org/journal/DetailedInforOfEditorialBoard.aspx?personID=10176 Ferdinand Hennerbichler serves as the editorial board member in Advances in Anthropology (SCIRP). but that's disappeared from the page linked. So we shouldn't touch it with a barge pole. Doug Weller talk 15:49, 8 May 2019 (UTC)

wow, I did not know that. Thanks for telling me this information. It is sad that such things happen.80.243.173.100 (talk) 16:31, 8 May 2019 (UTC)

References

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 1 July 2019

Please change native to Kurdistan to something along the lines of an area in Western Asia called Kurdistan.98.6.21.229 (talk) 14:05, 1 July 2019 (UTC) 98.6.21.229 (talk) 14:05, 1 July 2019 (UTC)

 Not done: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit extended-protected}} template. —Compassionate727 ^(T·C) 20:44, 9 July 2019 (UTC)

Contradictory info at start and in article about ethnic origin

The intro currently says the Kurds are all Iranian (then source) ethnic origin. But in the article which the intro should be a summary of, it says Kurds are of ethnically diverse origin. Is there a consensus that all Kurds are of ethniclly Iranian origin (separate to their languages being classed as in the Iranian group I think?). Regardless I think it needs to be kept clearer to the casual reader that the intro isn't saying Kurds are allied with Iran necessarily, because aren't Kurds often discriminated against within Iran? Swishoo (talk) 19:04, 20 July 2019 (UTC)

The information in the introduction was added by someone who ended up getting blocked for Wikipedia:Nothere and vandalism on Kurdish-related topics, so it should have been removed by now. I will do that now. --Ahmedo Semsurî (talk) 19:19, 20 July 2019 (UTC)

The "Iranic peoples" classification in the intro was added by me months ago, and cited by the Kurdish historian/ethnographer Michael Izady. I will repost my comment justifying it again:

>The book by Micheal Izady (who himself is an ethnic Kurd), cited in the first sentence of the article, explicitly states phrases such as "Kurds were and are Iranic" (pg.37), "the Kurdish culture and language are indeed Iranic" (pg.198), and "Kurds are in fact, like the Persians, an Iranic people in speech and culture" (pg.198).

The "ethnically diverse origins" part ought to be expanded to describe what exactly the origins are, instead of a vague one-line statement. Not to mention it's not mutually exclusive with the former point; many Arabs have "ethnically diverse origins", but are still Arabs, since its a classification based on language and culture, and the same argument can be used for the term "Iranic". Also, being ethnically Iranic =/= being "allied" to Iran, you're confusing ethnography with politics. Uzbeks and Kyrgyz are both Turkic, but neither group are particularly friendly with each other either. -- Qahramani44 (talk) 21:20, 20 July 2019 (UTC)

You're right I should have said different not necessarily contradictory. Swishoo (talk) 18:35, 24 July 2019 (UTC)

User:Swishoo What does discrimination have to do with origins? Also, Kurds are not marginalized or discriminated in the form that people are often made to believe. EVERYONE in Iran can and is discriminated regardless of ethnicity, language or religion. KhakePakeVatan (talk) 09:27, 29 July 2019 (UTC)

typo in section Antiquities under History

In the second-to-last paragraph of the section Antiquities, the second word in the para. ought to be "settled" rather than "setteld." Harold3Ho (talk) 14:41, 10 October 2019 (UTC)

• Done. --Ahmedo Semsurî (talk) 14:48, 10 October 2019 (UTC)

Syria section badly out of date

The Syria section should be updated in light of Turkey's October 2019 military invasion and occupation of Northern Syria which is targeting Kurdish militants previously allied with US forces. On October 14, after US announced its transfer of troops from Northern Syria to elsewhere in Syria to avoid conflict with Turkish forces, SDF and Kurds announced they were partnering with the Syrian Armed Forces under the official Syrian government led by Assad to defend the territorial integrity of Syria from the Turkish invasion.

See e.g.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/us-troops-withdraw-from-another-syrian-town-as-turkish-forces-block-supply-lines/2019/10/13/aab5fab8-ec5a-11e9-a329-7378fbfa1b63_story.html

https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/14/middleeast/syria-turkey-kurds-civilians-isis-intl-hnk/index.html

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2019/10/syrian-army-deploy-turkey-border-orders-pullback-191013191238367.html

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/14/world/middleeast/turkey-syria.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by BTercero (talk • contribs) 17:32, 14 October 2019 (UTC)

Kurdish studies

Hello fellow Wikipedians, I've created Kurdology article a month ago and I think it should be incorporated in this article. Page is under protection so I couldn't add it. Can someone do that? Thanks --Gogolplex (talk) 16:11, 6 December 2019 (UTC)

Great job with the article! However, I personally don't think it should be merged with this article. Why do you want it to be merged? --Semsurî (talk) 16:16, 6 December 2019 (UTC)

Sorry for the misunderstanding, by "should be incorporated" I meant that this article at least should mention Kurdish studies in some way. Maybe it should be added in See also section? @Semsûrî: --Gogolplex (talk) 22:05, 6 December 2019 (UTC)

I've added the article in the 'see also'-section. --Semsurî (talk) 05:58, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

Request for Edit.

It appears that the article is locked most likely to stop Vandalism and i can understand this, however it states "Which obviously," no Wikipedia article is suppost to make an assumption about the leader it should be changed to "Which threatened the Kurd's." Vallee01 (talk) 23:05, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

I've removed those sentences. --Semsurî (talk) 23:15, 7 December 2019 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 25 December 2019

Based on what resources this article says Kurds are Iranian? This is a bogus claim and very controversial. Currently, for more than 500 years!, the majority of Kurdish land is not part of Iran! Kurdistan was never entirely part of Iran. We don't have such a term as "Iranian ethnic group" but it's been forced by Persians that Kurds are Iranian, while they call themselves Persians! This is absurd and Wikipedia, as a knowledge distributor, must avoid politics. Obviously, Persian Wikipedia's article, as well as all articles and pages related to Iran in Wikipedia in other languages, is controlled and manipulated by Persians, systematically. This must end to let the truth based on reliable sources and reality replace the political agendas of certain people or countries. Xana (talk) 23:39, 25 December 2019 (UTC)

Well they speak an Iranian language, many ethno-linguistic groupings reflect linguistic groupings. This book (page 198) cited in the intro says that this is the view pushed by Tehran. The other source doesn't appear to mention ethnolinguistics. We do have the term Iranian peoples reflecting the linguistic group. – Thjarkur (talk) 23:55, 25 December 2019 (UTC)

For the first source, i'll point out that the (Kurdish) author Izady also states on his own that Kurds are an Iranic people [18]. Furthermore, "as Tehran maintains, Kurds are in fact" is quite plainly an admission of support by the author himself. --Qahramani44 (talk) 05:12, 31 December 2019 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. – Jonesey95 (talk) 06:36, 26 December 2019 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:

• Roj emblem.svg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 02:12, 9 January 2020 (UTC)

Religons

Should the "Religion" section also include Judaism? For example, see History of the Jews in Kurdistan, Kurdish refugees#Kurdish Jews, and http://ericederer.com/ethno/Thesis_on_Cumbus_EEderer.pdf (page 64). Acwilson9 (talk) 09:26, 18 January 2020 (UTC); Acwilson9 (talk) 21:58, 25 January 2020 (UTC)

Recent Changes

I'm wondering about the reasoning regarding the recent changes removing Iranic from the lede, the editor claimed the "source does not state this" yet the posted source "The Kurds: A Concise Handbook" by Kurdish author Michael Izady states that Kurds are Iranic on multiple occasions throughout the book [[19]], if necessary add this direct link to the Izady reference. On top of that the editor citing what apparently seems to be a WP:SPS journal that deals with genetics; sounds like WP:Synth to me to tie an ethnolinguistic grouping with genetics, even assuming the journal itself is a valid source. --Qahramani44 (talk) 02:56, 04 February 2020 (UTC)

The issue is that, out of the fime times 'Iranic' is used by Izady, three of those are in a linguistic context and pertain to Kurdish languages. He does indeed state that "First, they [Greco-Roman sources] used the term Persian loosely to mean any of the Iranic cultural an genetic background" referring to Kurds on page 37, but he goes on to admit that is isn't that simple on page 73. "The 'aryanization' of the aboriginal Paleo-Caucasian Kurds, linguistically, culturally, and racially, seems to have begun by the beginning of the 2nd millennium BC..." First of all, Izady is himself opening up about the non-Iranic origins of Kurds. As in, he is arguing that Kurds have been aryanized/iranized. Secondly, why are we using a historian for this question? --Semsurî (talk) 11:32, 4 February 2020 (UTC)

>The issue is that, out of the fime times 'Iranic' is used by Izady, three of those are in a linguistic context

Not just linguistic, but also cultural. Besides page 37 (which states cultural and genetic background, and the phrase "Kurds were and are Iranic"), there's also page 198 which states "the Kurdish culture and language are indeed Iranic" and "Kurds are in fact, like the Persians, an Iranic people in speech and culture". While he does mention the possibility of Kurds having a non-Iranic genetic portion, he does also mention that they have an Iranic portion ("genetic background" on pg.37).

But again I'll raise the point: Who says the classification "Iranic" is a strict genetic classification? It's not the case for the terms Arabic, Semitic, Turkic, Slavic, or Germanic, all of those classifications are based on culture and language. Why would Iranic be held to a different standard, especially when there is such a large genetic difference even between Persians and Tajiks?

If you wish to have a "genetics" section for Kurds that explores the non-Iranic portions of their ancestry then go for it, there's no issue with that, so long as the sources are valid/reliable sources. However, just as there is a genetics section for say, Azerbaijanis that explains their partial non-Turkic ancestry, they are still nonetheless classified as a Turkic people due to their language and culture being Turkic, and it's shown in the lede of their article.

Lastly regarding Izady being reliable or not, his wiki page states that he received a PhD in the topic of Middle Eastern Languages and Civilizations at Columbia University; is that not enough credentials to write about Kurdish ethnicity? --Qahramani44 (talk) 17:39, 04 February 2020 (UTC)

The page for English people does not (explicitly) state that they are Germanic either, despite their language being it. What's the difference here? If I'm in the minority here, the info can be re-added with Izady as reference. --Semsurî (talk) 22:15, 4 February 2020 (UTC)

Yet the pages for Flemish people, Dutch people, Danes, Swedes do. If you check ethnicity pages for most of them (at least in Europe, Central Asia, Caucasus, India) they list their ethno-linguistic grouping in the lede. There's really no reason to remove it at this point, especially when the talk page itself at the top mentions that a consensus was reached long ago to add it to the description. --Qahramani44 (talk) 01:22, 08 February 2020 (UTC)

It's not a reliable source, nothing published by Scientific Research Publishing is. If you look at the edit history you'll see it's been tagged as a predatory open access journal by our software. I've told the editor this. Doug Weller talk 10:31, 4 February 2020 (UTC)

User:Semsûrî I hope you agree that we can't use the Advances source. Izady can't be using the word "genetic' literally, ie dna related, right? I presume he means something like ancestral. Doug Weller talk 19:07, 4 February 2020 (UTC)

Yes. I did not know that it was self-published, my bad. --Semsurî (talk) 22:15, 4 February 2020 (UTC)

Kurds inhabited area

The picture do not cover all of kurds inhabited area.Yes this is from CIA but Honestly it is not suitable one because it do not cover some area like: sivas,Erzerum,Iskendrun,ilam,kirmanshan ,khoy,urmia,kerkuk,Shingal,sarikani,afrin & so on. please in new photo cover these areas too. Mehran2705 (talk) 19:18, 24 February 2020 (UTC)

Tattoos

Hi whoever is moderating this page. I found this image File:Kurdish-Deq.jpg on wikipedia commons if anyone want to add it to article as a visual reference, that would be nice.--Balyozxane (talk) 20:04, 26 March 2020 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 17 June 2020

Please remove the first or second portion of "are an" from the sentence "Kurds (Kurdish: کورد ,Kurd‎) or Kurdish people are an are an Iranic[29][30][31] ethnic group native to a mountainous region of Western Asia known as Kurdistan, which spans southeastern Turkey, northwestern Iran, northern Iraq, and northern Syria.[32][33]" to refine the sentence as "Kurds (Kurdish: کورد ,Kurd‎) or Kurdish people are an Iranic[29][30][31] ethnic group native to a mountainous region of Western Asia known as Kurdistan, which spans southeastern Turkey, northwestern Iran, northern Iraq, and northern Syria.[32][33]." This is likely a grammatical redundancy error as it does not create a coherent introductory sentence. 23.28.91.188 (talk) 04:33, 17 June 2020 (UTC)

 Done, and thank you! P.I. Ellsworth  ed. ^put'r there 12:10, 17 June 2020 (UTC)

Are Kurds the largest ethnic group without their own state?

I think that Pashtuns, not Kurds, are the single largest ethnic group that do not have 'an own state'. The World Watch Research Unit of Open Doors International in its Pakistan Country Dossier, december 2018 states: "It is frequently stated that the Kurdish people - numbering under 40 million - are the largest people without a nation. Pashtuns however number around 45 million." The Wikipedia article on Pashtuns even estimates there are 63 million of them, substantially more than Kurds. Most of them live in Afghanistan, Pakistan and India, but in no country are they a majority of the population. So I reflected that in the text of this article. Loranchet (talk) 11:02, 1 July 2020 (UTC)

Pashtuns have their own country, its called Afghanistan and they form the majority there (at 65%) while they are a minority in Pakistan and every other country after it. Akmal94 (talk) 19:16, 5 August 2020 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 16 July 2020

The article refers Kurds as an Iranian ethnic group, which isn't a fact. A racist, anti-Kurd Arab edited the article to make it like this. Plus the three references of it, don't say that Kurds are an Iranian group.

My request is to remove the words which mean Kurds are an Iranian group. That is all. RealRojSerbest (talk) 19:32, 16 July 2020 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. – Jonesey95 (talk) 22:01, 16 July 2020 (UTC)

@RealRojSerbest: one of the sources for that, Mehrdad Izady, has a Kurdish Father, another is the Kurdish Institute of Paris. Interesting that you presumably think that they are racists. Calling Izady a racist is a serious breach of our WP:BLP policy. By the way, he wrote "As Teheran maintains, Kurds are in fact, like the Persians, an Iranic people in speech and culture." The Institute page says " Historians generally agree to consider them as belonging to the Iranian branch of the large family of Indo-European races" - I didn't check the third as you so obviously didn't check yourself. Doug Weller talk 14:18, 17 July 2020 (UTC)

@Jonesey95: I want the first sentence in the article to be swapped from this:

Kurds (Kurdish: کورد ,Kurd‎) or Kurdish people are an Iranic ethnic group native to a mountainous region of Western Asia known as Kurdistan, which spans southeastern Turkey, northwestern Iran, northern Iraq, and northern Syria.

To this:

Kurds (Kurdish: کورد ,Kurd‎) or Kurdish people are an ethnic group native to a mountainous region of Western Asia known as Kurdistan, which spans southeastern Turkey, northwestern Iran, northern Iraq, and northern Syria.

Sources are:

I am a Kurd and I know myself better than anyone. RealRojSerbest (talk) 22:48, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

@RealRojSerbest: please drop this. You've already been told we won't do that - it's completely against policy. Wikipedia doesn't use its editors knowledge or experience, please read WP:NOR and WP:VERIFY Doug Weller talk 14:29, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

You being a Kurd does not mean you are an authority on the subject of Kurds. Provide scientific sources for your claim. Also note that that Iranic is not the same as Iranian ~ Zirguezi 20:42, 27 August 2020 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 5 October 2020

In the Cinema section (under Culture), the film 'Duvar' is mentioned but directs to a disambiguation page. This should be fixed so that it links to 'Duvar (film)'. Lennart97 (talk) 11:01, 5 October 2020 (UTC)

 Already done – Jonesey95 (talk) 18:06, 5 October 2020 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 9 December 2020

The total population section appears to be sorted from highest to lowest but Canada and Finland are in the wrong position.

Please change:

United States  20,591
Georgia        13,861
Kyrgyzstan     13,200
Canada         16,315
Finland        14,054
Australia      10,551

to:

United States  20,591
Canada         16,315
Finland        14,054
Georgia        13,861
Kyrgyzstan     13,200
Australia      10,551

 Done Terasail^[✉] 17:09, 10 December 2020 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 27 December 2020

Please add this image File:Kurdish-Deq.jpg with the caption Kurdish woman with Deq tattoo to the Tattoos section. Thank you--Balyozxane (talk) 17:55, 27 December 2020 (UTC)

 Done Danski454 (talk) 00:24, 30 December 2020 (UTC)

Thank you kind stranger!--Balyozxane (talk) 04:41, 30 December 2020 (UTC)

Early history

Please mention Jaban al-Kurdi (RA) in this article. He was one of the earliest notable people in Kurdish history, a compannionof Muhammad (SAWS)SalamAlayka (talk) 21:00, 1 January 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 5 February 2021

https://abpaksazan.com/category/water-treatment/ ویکی مفید (talk) 07:44, 5 February 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Elliot321 (talk | contribs) 03:45, 6 February 2021 (UTC)

Kurds in Israel

You forgot the Kurds in Israel in the info box. 200,000 Kurdish Jews live there.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_Kurdistan  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Avestaboy (talk • contribs) 09:33, 13 February 2021 (UTC) 

Another source: https://jewishstudies.washington.edu/global-judaism/kurdish-israeli-jews-kurdistan-saharane/ FLXXX-JPN (talk) 23:46, 22 February 2021 (UTC)

Kurds are not Iranic, they are the indigenous peoples of Mesopotamia!

Not accurate at all!! Kurds are not Iranic. The Kurds are one of the indigenous peoples of the Mesopotamian plains and the highlands in what are now south-eastern Turkey, north-eastern Syria, northern Iraq, north-western Iran and south-western Armenia.

Kurdish people are an Iranic[28][29][30] ethnic group native to a mountainous region of Western Asia known as Kurdistan, which spans southeastern Turkey, northwestern Iran, northern Iraq, and northern Syria.

Replace it with this:

Kurds are one of the indigenous peoples of the Mesopotamian plains and the highlands in what are now south-eastern Turkey, north-eastern Syria, northern Iraq, north-western Iran and south-western Armenia.

Citations:

Who are the Kurds? https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-29702440 Britannica, The Editors of Encyclopaedia. "Kurd". Encyclopedia Britannica, 17 Dec. 2019, https://www.britannica.com/topic/Kurd. Accessed 24 March 2021.

First, it is well sourced that they are Iranic people, second, your proposed edit is a direct copy of the BBC source and as such we cannot use it. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 11:46, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Jewish Kurds

There are 300.000 Kurds in Israel but this list does not show them. Why ? Xelefe Suvi (talk) 16:38, 18 April 2021 (UTC)

copyedit request

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

---

Hi! Just noticed a wee typo someone with Extended confirmed protected status could please fix? Under Culture/music, it currently says "...the melancholy of separation and unfulfilled love, one of the first Kurdish female singers to sing heyrans is Chopy Fatah, while Lawje is a form ...". Please fix this run-on sentence to something like "the melancholy of separation and unfulfilled love. One of the first Kurdish female singers to sing heyrans was Chopy Fatah. Conversely, Lawje is a form ..."

cheers :) TreeReader (talk) 04:05, 24 April 2021 (UTC)

 Done Paradise Chronicle (talk) 07:05, 18 May 2021 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Garnik Asatrian quotes on Kurdish issues?

How on earth is it possible that a Pan Armenian nationalist like Garnik Asatrian, who has shown deep hatred against the Kurdish people and even goes as far to deny the existince of the Kurds as people, is being used as a source for the Kurdish language and history on this Wikipedia article? A Member of a far right Armenian Nationalist parts. Is this what people here call "unbiased, unpolitical and free access to information? Might as well quote 3rd Reich German sources about the ethnic identity of Jews. I can't believe that this man is used as a source for anything Kurdish related. Only on Wikipedia.....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garnik_Asatrian#Views_and_criticism https://ekurd.net/mismas/articles/misc2012/4/state6114.htm https://www.aniarc.am/2015/12/09/garnik-asatrian-and-onnik-krikorian-on-armenian-kurdish-ties-wikileaks-2006/

2A02:908:C63:D740:44F1:B066:DB70:369E (talk) 07:29, 6 May 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 17 May 2021

In the opening segment of the page it states that: 'Kurdish people are an "Iranic" ethnic group'. The formal academic term is "Iranian" and not "Iranic". Its simple correct term is "Iranian peoples", not the newly crafted "Iranic peoples". Thus, I suggest an edit from Iranic to Iranian. If the suggestion edit is declined, then I want to have a valid academic answer as to why said decision was made. PapakPourkhiz (talk) 20:06, 17 May 2021 (UTC)

 DoneParadise Chronicle (talk) 21:18, 17 May 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 20 May 2021

I want to make some minor edits i found on ancient history of the Kurds, i spoke with historians in Iraqi Kurdistan and have proof of some history which isnt added on the page yet Robin6221 (talk) 20:05, 20 May 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 20:14, 20 May 2021 (UTC)

Alevi

Hi, it says Alevi and then Islam beside it. We are not Muslim, this is something that we have been fighting for hundreds of years. Our Alevi is different than Turkish Alevi. We do not consider our religion a branch off Islam, that is Ottoman and Turkish propaganda to assimilate us and deny our religion and ethnicity. We even have our own wiki page called Kurdish Alevism. I can't edit this page, so can someone please be kind enough to edit that part out? We've literally been fighting for our religion for a very long time. And to see Islam beside it on a wikipedia page is very disturbing. Thanks so much!

Done. --Semsûrî (talk) 12:18, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

According to who the Kurdish alevi I wiki page does not make that distinction this edit should be reverted @Semsûrî:

Alevism is apart of Islam

Why is Alevism classed separately even in the Kurdish alevism wiki page it’s not regarded as its own religion it’s dishonest to claim otherwise. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.107.66.156 (talk) 19:56, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

Iranic People???

This page is based on lies.

There is no mention of Mesopotamia at all when the origin of the Kurds is from Mesopotamia and there's various proof on that! How can you claim that Kurds are Iranic people when Iran didn't exist past 1935. What's your explanation for that? Your citations are from iranica? What non sense is this? This article needs to be reported for vandalism!— Preceding unsigned comment added by Niroz zaito (talk • contribs) 17:47, 24 March 2021 (UTC)

Iranic means part of the indo-iranian language family not the country iran. SarwarBarznji (talk) 23:11, 14 May 2021 (UTC)

You seem to have misunderstood. Iranic means the group of peoples like Kurds, Persians, Afghans and Baluchis. It does not mean of the country Iran. This word was used before Iran was called Iran. -- Guherto (talk) 12:46, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

The correct term is Iranian and not Iranic. How can you claim that Iran didn't exist before 1935 when the name Iran has been used for many thousand years? It's directly derived from Eran which is first attested in the inscription that accompany the investiture relief of Ardashir I at Naqsh-e Rostam. Eran is first attested in the Avesta as Airyanam. Sickofthisbs (talk) 20:57, 5 July 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 15 July 2021

change "made provision for a Kurdish state in the 1920 Treaty of Sevres." to "made provision for a Kurdish state in the 1920 Treaty of Sèvres." 2804:14C:55:87C7:716C:30CB:2C38:5D71 (talk) 00:16, 15 July 2021 (UTC)

 Done ––FORMALDUDE^(talk) 03:29, 15 July 2021 (UTC)

"Iranicised tribes" and "pre-Iranic language"

Replace pre-Iranic language with pre-Iranian language. Iranicised should be replaced with Iranianized or Iranified. Sickofthisbs (talk) 21:01, 5 July 2021 (UTC)

Please clarify why you've refused to make the appropriate change, FormalDude. Sickofthisbs (talk) 14:20, 22 July 2021 (UTC)

@Sickofthisbs: I did not refuse anything: I am not the only one who can approve edit requests on this page, any Editor can. That said, I'll go ahead and address this for you.

 Partly done: Iranic and Iranian have the same meaning and can be used interchangeably, so I have not implemented that change. I have replaced Iranicised with Iranianized.

––FORMALDUDE^(talk) 16:35, 22 July 2021 (UTC)

The Kurds Nation.

The kurds are not a ethnic group. They are a nation.

A nation a large body of people united by common descent, history, culture, or language, inhabiting a particular country or territory. The kurds are have their own language, history,culture, and they have their own self-governing governments, de-facto countries. Also many source,people,country,government,universities sees kurds as an nation.

Kurds are older than nation of middle east. Before turks and iranians.

I think nation is perfect definition to kurds.

Please change page.

NivîskarJan (talk) 13:17, 14 August 2021 (UTC)NivîskarJan

References

Kurdish 100 million people

Concer Aland jakob (talk) 11:55, 15 October 2021 (UTC)

Can someone please add the date for one of the maps

"Maunsell's map, a Pre-World War I British Ethnographical Map of the Middle East, showing the Kurdish regions in yellow (both light and dark)"

On the map it says it was published in 1910. Can you please add the year of the map at the end? Thank you! :)70.29.14.147 (talk) 03:30, 11 September 2021 (UTC) Arnold

√ Done Paradise Chronicle (talk) 21:56, 15 October 2021 (UTC)

Under the Religion section on the main page Muslim or Islam is not listed in bold as are the other listed religions

The main religion of the Kurds Muslim or Islam is downplayed by not being listed in bold print as the other less practiced religions. Someone making a fast scan of this article would might be mislead to missing that fact. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Meztoa (talk • contribs) 18:16, 12 November 2021 (UTC)

Flag doesn't belong to the Kurds

First of all, there is no single source that says that flag belongs to the Kurds. Second thing is that no other ethnicies have a flag added to their ethnicity box. Requesting the flag to be removed. SkyEditor85 (talk) 17:15, 26 December 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 28 December 2021

there is a Kurd population of 200,000 in Afghanistan. They were deported into eastern Persia (modern day Afghanistan) by shah abbas and continue to live in Afghanistan and kept their language and customs.

Source: https://www.institutkurde.org/en/kurdorama/ 68.71.31.171 (talk) 15:03, 28 December 2021 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. The source you provided seems less useful. TheBirdsShedTears (talk) 22:09, 30 December 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 26 December 2021

Requesting so called "Kurdish flag" to be removed. Other ethnicities do not use flag, neither there is a single flag. The current flag belongs to the Iraqi Kurdistan regional government and it's even banned in some NE Syrian Kurdish areas. The flag isn't even allowed in many Northern Kurdish meetings. SkyEditor85 (talk) 17:19, 26 December 2021 (UTC)

It is the ethnic flag of Kurds. I'm not well-versed in whether flags are inappropriate in these infoboxes, but if nothing forbids it, I see no issue. --Semsûrî (talk) 17:27, 26 December 2021 (UTC)

There is no such as ”ethnic flag of Kurds”. The flag belongs to the Iraqi Kurdistan and it is even illegal in many Kurdish areas. Use a source which could defend your claim, please. SkyEditor85 (talk)

I'm not here to debate your lies. The flag belongs to KR when it was created decades prior? Go somewhere else with your POV editing please. --Semsûrî (talk) 15:32, 27 December 2021 (UTC)

Oh, now I understand you better. To all editors who still have some common sense, the flag doesn't belong to the Kurds, it's Iraqi Kurdistan flag and there is no single source claiming it's ethnic flag of the Kurds. Requesting deletion. Additionally, someone please report this user and inspect his/her edits. SkyEditor85 (talk) 10:28, 28 December 2021 (UTC)

You have failed to gather consensus. The flag is not Iraqi but has its origins in Turkish Kurdistan and Xoybun around 1927 and has since been used by Kurds in all parts of Kurdistan and the diaspora. This is not controversial information. --Semsûrî (talk) 10:49, 28 December 2021 (UTC)

You seem to have lack of understanding when it comes to the Wikipedia rules and the policy. If you could find reliable sources defending the fact that the flag is the ethnic flag of the Kurds, then you are welcome to keep it here, but you know it yourself that the flag is not ethnic flag of the Kurds. If it was the ethnic flag of the Kurds, there would be a numerous of sources and publications about it. Remember that there is huge difference between an ethnic flag and other flags. What you don't realize that you are assuming it's ethnic flag even though it's just the flag of the Iraqi Kurdistan. The historic background doesn't really tell anything as there is no reliable sources claiming it's ethnic flag of the Kurds. SkyEditor85 (talk) 13:28, 31 December 2021 (UTC)

Kurds in Ukraine

There are about 25,000 Kurds in Ukraine, their presence dates back to the early 25th century, but in recent years, there has been an increase in population from refugees entering Ukraine. Tarekelijas (talk) 10:20, 28 February 2022 (UTC)

Source: Wikipedia Article titled "Kurds in Ukraine" Tarekelijas (talk) 10:23, 28 February 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 15 April 2022

Kurd Are Not Iranian ,im Kurdish And Not Iranian Please Change This We Are Just Kurdish And Kurdistanian Krd.coder (talk) 16:25, 15 April 2022 (UTC)

 Not done: See Iranian peoples. It is well sourced. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 16:34, 15 April 2022 (UTC)

That is correct, Iranian is a nationality. The correct term is Iranic in the first paragraph, which has a ethnic connotation and is a category that can be applied to all iranic-speakers. Pashtuns in Afghanistan f.ex are Iranic, and have linguistic and ethnic ties to other iranic. But they cannot be ascribed specifically any relationship to the "Iranian" state. The relationship is equvalient for kurds. To describe an ethnic group that is spread in a territory encompassing 4 states is misleading and inaccurate. The term iranian was introduced during the 1920s when reza pahlavi the autocratic ruler of Iran, changed the name to Iran from Persia. The word "Iran" in the discussed context refers purely to the name/title of the state that is refered to as Iran. 158.174.201.16 (talk) 22:54, 21 April 2022 (UTC)

Disputed flag

An ethnic flag has been added to the article, but the flag actually belongs to the Iraqi Kurdistan, an autonomous region inside Iraq. The flag doesn't belong to all Kurds, neither it's universally agreed as a common flag by Kurds. There are no single source proving the flag is an ethnic flag of the Kurds. Thus I believe it should be deleted. Requesting neutral opinion or instructions how to continue from this point. SkyEditor85 (talk) 17:40, 28 December 2021 (UTC)

You are welcome to ask for a third opinion but you need not to be dishonest. You have given us no source for your absurd claim that it belongs to Iraqi Kurdistan (which is merely a geography). On the other hand, you can read at the history section at Flag of Kurdistan and see that the flag has been used by Kurds in both Turkey and Iran as well. --Semsûrî (talk) 17:58, 28 December 2021 (UTC)

Although they don’t have a state, Kurds treat this flag as the symbol of a state. First flown in 1920 by those seeking an independent Kurdistan, it became the official flag of the region after Kurdish autonomy was recognized. Many Kurdish organizations in Iran, Iraq and Turkey use the flag.[20] --Semsûrî (talk) 18:02, 28 December 2021 (UTC)

In order to add a flag as an ethnic flag, you must have sources for that. There is no single source saying it's ethnic flag of the Kurds. As long as you don't have such source or sources, keeping that flag there is not allowed, per Wiki policy and rules.SkyEditor85 (talk) 10:43, 5 January 2022 (UTC)

Merhaba,bu bayrak Kürtler tarafından kabul edilmiş bir bayraktır zaten ırak Kürdistan'ı yokkende bu bayrak vardı ve ben bu bayrağa Kürt bayrağı değildir diyen bir Kürt hiç görmedim. Bayrağın ortasındaki güneş 21 perçemli Kurt güneşidir daha eskilerde ise Aryan güneşi idi Özgür Çiçeklidal (talk) 20:03, 27 May 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 1 July 2022

Please move the section named "Modern Kurdish-majority entities and governments" above the "Gallery" section as it is more appropriate place for the content. Dympies (talk) 16:48, 1 July 2022 (UTC)

 Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit extended-protected}} template. Those are part of the "See also" section, rather than an actual prose related section, and "See also" is generally located below any galleries. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 16:51, 1 July 2022 (UTC)

ScottishFinnishRadish, how can the "See also" section have a sub-section? There is something flawed there which needs to be sorted out. Dympies (talk) 17:55, 2 July 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 9 October 2022

Hi, I have a map of the Kurds/Kurdish people around the world. Sadly, i used at least more than 10 webs and then is unsourced, but considering the population per country of the Infobox, my map is correct, I'd like to add the map like the page of the "Russians" something similar. My map is not uploaded, if the reader needs it, please contact me. Gabriel Ziegler (talk) 16:22, 9 October 2022 (UTC)

 Not done for now: no edits were requested. You are welcome to be bold and upload the image yourself. If the map data is correct like you mentioned then it could be added to the article with another edit request! TGHL ↗ 🍁 19:31, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 7 November 2022

Kurds are not an Iranian ethnic group, we are a Kurdish ethnic group. We are Kurds by ethnicity, not Iranian. I’d like to think somebody who is actually Kurdish knows their own history better than whoever wrote the propaganda on this wiki… Please understand that we are not Iranian (although have many similarities to Iranians) and we are our own unique ethnic group. We are not a sub-category of Iranians. This is absurd. 92.28.246.188 (talk) 15:10, 7 November 2022 (UTC)

• Not done. Please check the info alert in the banners at the top of this page that addresses your concern. Tiderolls 15:26, 7 November 2022 (UTC)

We should not refer Kurd as an "Iranian ethnic group"

The current version of our article reads:

Kurds (Kurdish: کورد ,Kurd) or Kurdish people are an Iranian[33][34][35] ethnic group native to the mountainous region of Kurdistan in Western Asia, which spans southeastern Turkey, northwestern Iran, northern Iraq, and northern Syria.

Here, Kurds are referred as "Iranian" ethnic group. By Iranian, we mean speakers of Iranian languages. Now, a layman reading this sentence may get misled to think that Kurd has some special connection with Iran. However, Kurd is a distinct ethnic group and they don't speak the mainstream Iran language ie Persian. Just because they speak languages which linguists identify as Iranian languages, we should not use the term "Iranian ethnic group" in the first line of the article. Therefore, I propose replace "Iranian ethnic group" to simply "ethnic group" and move the existing sources to language specific line ie "Kurds speak the Kurdish languages and the Zaza–Gorani languages, which belong to the Western Iranian branch of the Iranian languages in the Indo-European language family.[38][39]" Dympies (talk) 10:55, 12 November 2022 (UTC)

I mean, the said layman is one click from understanding what "Iranian ethnic group" is meant here. If WP:RS identifies them as an Iranian ethnic group, then I see no reason to change that. --HistoryofIran (talk) 11:12, 12 November 2022 (UTC)

I would propose some different thing. Remove the term "Iranian" from the first line and add a second line using the existing sources. The wording of this second line should be: "As they speak Iranian languages, they fall in the category of Iranian peoples." Dympies (talk) 18:40, 12 November 2022 (UTC)

Just wondering. Why should this article be an exception to an extensive list of ethnic groups such as Ossetians, Persians, Pashtuns, etc.? Or Turkish people, Gagauz people, Uzbeks vis-a-vis Turkic peoples? Or Poles, Russians, or Czechs vis-a-vis Slavic peoples? For the record, the cited Encyclopaedia of Islam entry on the Kurds refers to them as "an Iranian people of the Near East". - LouisAragon (talk) 21:32, 12 November 2022 (UTC)

Do we need to mention "Indo-European languages" in the lead para

The present version of the lead para reads: Kurds speak the Kurdish languages and the Zaza–Gorani languages, which belong to the Western Iranian branch of the Iranian languages in the Indo-European language family.[38][39]

Even though sources support the "Indo-European" thing, but do we really need to go in too much detail of Iranian languages while describing the Kurd ethnic group? Indo-European is a broad category of languages comprising of 450+ languages. I opine that mentioning "Indo-European language family" is ok for Kurdish languages but not Kurd. Therefore, I propose its removal. Dympies (talk) 10:25, 23 November 2022 (UTC)

Origin of kurds

Kurds aren’t iranian people edit to Sumerian pls thanks M dler23 (talk) 20:03, 11 January 2023 (UTC)

At Wikipedia, we follow sources. It's a fact that Kurds speak an Iranian language, and that the overwhelming majority of academic sources describe them as an Iranian people. Jeppiz (talk) 20:39, 11 January 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 14 January 2023

Kurds are not an Iranian ethnic group, kurds are KURDS and can't be associated with other ethnic groups. Yes, there are 4 parts to Kurdistan due to the treaty of Sévres, a treaty signed between the allies of World War 1 and the ottoman empire to split Kurdistan into 4 parts. One part is located in Iraq, one in Syria, one in Turkiye and one in Iran, therefore prior to the treaty of Sévres Kurds were from Kurdistan and they were classed as their own ethnic group. Hence why it's historically wrong to classify Kurds as an Iranian ethnic group. Dinaaa06 (talk) 15:43, 14 January 2023 (UTC)

No specific edit request made, so nothing done. Requests should be made in a "change X to Y" format. However, on the substance of the request, "Iranian ethnic group" does not mean found only within the borders of modern-day Iran. The Iranian peoples (see that page for details) are a broad ethnographic grouping of peoples from Anatolia through to the Pamir mountains. Iskandar323 (talk) 17:05, 14 January 2023 (UTC)

Kurds aren’t Iranian people change to summery pls thanks

Kurds are separated between 4 different countries iran Syria turkey and iraq that doesn’t make them iraqian or turkish or whatever we are kurds not iranian lol we have our own history 2A02:1810:C31:BD00:D9C:3824:7972:4854 (talk) 22:37, 14 January 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request

Add 'Kurds of European Ancestry' to the 'See also' section in this Article.

Firstly, the Kurdish people have a complex history and a diverse ancestry. While many Kurds live in the Middle East, there are also significant Kurdish populations in Europe and other parts of the world. Highlighting an article specifically focused on Kurds of European ancestry could help readers to better understand the global diaspora of the Kurdish people, and the diversity of their experiences.

Secondly, many people may not be aware of the existence of Kurds of European ancestry, or may not understand how they fit into the broader Kurdish identity. By linking to an article focused on this topic, readers can gain a deeper understanding of the complexities of Kurdish identity and the ways in which it has been shaped by historical and cultural factors.

Finally, adding an article on Kurds of European ancestry to the 'See also:' section would provide readers with additional resources and opportunities for further exploration. It could encourage them to engage more deeply with the topic and to broaden their understanding of the Kurdish people and their history. FormerProdigy (talk) 11:15, 15 February 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 9 March 2023

remove iranian ethnic group. change to Kurds are an ethnic group native to the mountainous regions of Kurdsitan. Kurds are not Iranian's Wikipedia! check your sources. 2600:4040:5797:B300:E8BE:A1E8:94F8:D74E (talk) 02:43, 9 March 2023 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Lizthegrey (talk) 04:32, 9 March 2023 (UTC)

Kurds aren’t Iranian people change to summery pls

Kurds are separated between 4 different countries iran turkey syrie and iraq but that doesn’t make them iranian or turkish etc lol we have our own history do your research good pls and the only reason kurdistan is not independent is because the neighbour lands are benefiting from our oil they are scared of their economy economy 2A02:1810:C31:BD00:D9C:3824:7972:4854 (talk) 22:50, 14 January 2023 (UTC)

The phrase doesn’t mean citizens of modern Iran with its current borders. Iranian people covers a lot of groups who live/lived over a vast region: Iranian peoples Ff11 (talk) 01:07, 26 April 2023 (UTC)

Disputing sourced material

@Serchia: Can you please show some WP:RS that supports your claims here? [21] [22] HistoryofIran (talk) 22:14, 25 April 2023 (UTC)

And to no surprise they cant, yet they ironically just accused me of POV Special:MobileDiff/1152190763. Next time you will reported to WP:ANI for pov pushing. HistoryofIran (talk) 21:04, 28 April 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 29 April 2023

There are 8M-9M+ Kurds in Iraq There are 25M Kurds in Turkey There are 15M+ Kurds in Iran And 2-2.5M+ Kurds in Syria

Some of the other ones stated in the article is incorrect. MusabilCitizen52 (talk) 13:45, 29 April 2023 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Actualcpscm (talk) 14:05, 29 April 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 22 July 2023

Add the Kurdish diaspora map image to the infobox File:Map of the Kurdish Diaspora in the World.svg

2607:FB91:3D9:D174:AC39:8397:6774:AFCD (talk) 11:21, 22 July 2023 (UTC)

 Note: there doesn't seem to be a place in the Infobox to put this image. Nor do I know how accurate it is; there may be a reason it's not in the article at all? Will leave this request open for now to attract other editors. Xan747 (talk) 01:08, 23 July 2023 (UTC)

 Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{Edit extended-protected}} template. M.Bitton (talk) 14:26, 23 July 2023 (UTC)

Why wiki call Kurds iranians?

Why wiki call Kurds iranians? Even if we accept that Kurds were Iranians in the past which according to the historical definitions they were not , todays Iran means very different from the past. calling Kurds Iranians is very offensive for most of the Kurds and not acceptable on wiki Komoro72 (talk) 00:00, 28 August 2023 (UTC)

This has been discussed ad nauseam throughout the years, the consensus is that they are Iranians.

You can view the previous discussions in the archives.

Most people opposing the Iranian label are nationalists with political views instead of any real supporting historicity, and is thus considered fringe. 2607:FEA8:55DF:FC8A:50FF:3B75:A884:468F (talk) 17:19, 29 August 2023 (UTC)

Prehistory

According to Kurdologist Ferdinand Hennerbichler, Kurds are multi-ethnic descendants of various Neolithic peoples. He deems linguistic methods unreliable when searching for the origins of the Kurds, and thus also doesn't believe it would be accurate to label Kurds as Iranic. I understand there has been discussions about the labeling already, but I suggest that at least somewhere in the page it should be mentioned that genetic evidence speaks against Kurds being Iranic. I suggest the editors of this page take a look at Hennerbichler's work (namely, “the Origin of the Kurds”). Admiral90 (talk) 15:28, 9 September 2023 (UTC)

That work has been mentioned before but if I remember correctly it was self-published. Semsûrî (talk) 15:37, 9 September 2023 (UTC)

@Semsûrî A book by Hennerbichler that talks about the same (and some more) subjects was published by the swiss academic publisher Peter Lang, although it only seems to be available in German. Admiral90 (talk) 15:52, 9 September 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 6 October 2023

“Kurdish people, also known as Kurds, are an ethnic group with roots in the mountainous region of Kurdistan in Western Asia. This region spans southeastern Turkey, northwestern Iran, northern Iraq, and northern Syria. While Kurds have their own distinct cultural and historical identity, it’s important to note that they share linguistic and historical ties with the broader Iranian nation. Kurdish is their primary language, but their ethnic identity is Kurdish rather than exclusively Iranian.” بەڕێز (talk) 21:48, 6 October 2023 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. —TechnoSquirrel69 (sigh) 05:40, 7 October 2023 (UTC)