Talk:Person of Interest (TV series)

Clarification (Antagonist groups, and Catalyst: Indigo)

I realize that this isn't a forum but as a casual viewer who is thoroughly confused by the long-arc storylines of this show (which makes HR mob plot look straight-forward), I just want to clarify that there are three antagonist groups that Reese, Shaw and Finch are fighting against:

• The government/intelligence community (Control?)
• Business interests (Decima Technologies)
• Rebels/hacking community (Vigilance)

Is this correct? Because it's not always clear who they are running from in each episode. I'm also not sure if Root is an antagonist or not as Finch believes she is a threat but she works alongside the group at times. She is probably best thought of as a free agent, I suppose.

Also, the article probably should be updated to note all of the character deaths that occurred in fall 2013...I would but as my knowledge on this show is a bit shaky, I hesitate to write anything authoritative as it might involve some guesswork on my part. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 23:58, 11 January 2014 (UTC)

P.S. I just saw on another page, in reference to this show, "Indigo" mentioned as an agency, group or project. An explanation would be welcome if it is an important plot point. Thanks. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 00:09, 12 January 2014 (UTC)

I think you're essentially correct in your list of antagonists, and your "Indigo" seems to be "Catalyst: Indigo, which is the codename for ISA teams (the guys who get numbers from Research a.k.a. The Machine, investigate and take action - see the episode "Relevance" for examples)." This info/quote taken from a Reddit page about 'Why are there no blue squares?' ( https://www.reddit.com/r/PersonOfInterest/comments/26732u/why_are_there_no_blue_squares/ ). Therefore Catalyst:Indigo is the operational arm of the government/intelligence community. The reddit response also says, "Shaw and Cole represent the intended part of Team Relevant, they act on The Machine's intel to protect the USA/the world. Hersh represents the corrupt part of Team Relevant who deals with the nasty business around the intended task by making sure that the program remains secret even if that means killing people." I agree that this kind of information (both your list of antagonists and the info about Catalyst:Indigo) probably belongs in the main article, but not sure how to add it. It's here for anyone who reads the Talk page. :) I did make an addition to this 'Subject' line, hope that's ok. UnderEducatedGeezer (talk) 04:55, 4 February 2019 (UTC)

No, as per WP:PROTAGONIST. Also, please don't resurrect a more than five-year-old thread. —Joeyconnick (talk) 19:15, 9 February 2019 (UTC)

Person of Interest is not science fiction

I would like to see wikipedia change the genre as to not lable P of I as science fiction.Dr Meno (talk) 16:15, 11 July 2017 (UTC)

Why? The series has been labeled science fiction by several third-party sources ([1] [2] [3] [4] [5] [6] [7] [8] [9]). Drovethrughosts (talk) 16:32, 11 July 2017 (UTC)

Agreed. I see no need for a change. The whole machine arc is classic sci-fi. ----Dr.Margi ✉ 17:40, 11 July 2017 (UTC)

Influence by Neuromancer?

Is there any influence by Gibson's novel "Neuromancer"? There are two scenes where people walk past a row of pay phones, and they ring, as the machine tries to contact someone. That seems like a quotation from a scene in Neuromancer, when Wintermute is insisting on talking to someone. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:600:9500:A:593E:FD92:B104:7018 (talk) 20:16, 6 May 2020 (UTC)

Removing extensive cast list

It has been requested that I open up a discussion re my recent edit to remove the non-main cast names from the article. My reasons for the edit are adequately explained in the Edit Summary: this article does not need a list of all the cast and characters that appear in the show. This is something that somebody else evidently agreed with at some point, since we have the List of Person of Interest characters article linked at the top of the section. Wikipedia also does not, as standard, list casts so extensively in the principal article (see MOS:TVCAST). Discussion welcome. -- JascaDucato (talk | contributions) 14:07, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

There has been no objections after seven days, so I'm going to go ahead and remove the additional names now. -- JascaDucato (talk | contributions) 13:37, 7 November 2024 (UTC)

I disagree with the complete removal of the recurring cast, clearly there should be a middle ground. It's quite common for TV series which have a large number of episodes (over 100 in this case) to list notable recurring characters. Also, since the series has a quite small main cast (only 6 actors) and the article itself isn't super long, I don't see an issue with having a more condensed list of the most important recurring characters. Drovethrughosts (talk) 16:14, 7 November 2024 (UTC)

Apologies; I overlooked this discussion when the editor initially posted it, or I'd have objected immediately. I concur, @Drovethrughosts. Your rationale for restoration is appropriate; I'd add that the recurring cast is unusual in that it is highly structured and many of the characters appeared across multiple seasons. Person of Interest is serialized from the beginning, and understanding the core recurring cast is important. Several of us built that list episode by episode, and kept it well organized so it had an appropriately encyclopedic structure that supported the remainder of the article. Consequently, consigning the entire list to an ancillary page doesn't serve the main article well. However, we could probably do some pruning of some characters who are less significant now the show is no longer on the air.

I'm also troubled that an editor who has never to my knowledge, edited this article, which has been very stable for some time, has come in and made a wholesale edit of this length without seeking consensus in advance. I'm going to restore the article to its stable version now we have a discussion going, and let's see where it takes us. I'm also going to take a look at what reductions we could make, particularly among the images included in the article. --Drmargi (talk) 19:42, 7 November 2024 (UTC)

I've looked at the cast list on IMDB to see episode counts, and I'm thinking we can trim the following due to low episode counts and/or notability: Ken Leung (4 episodes), Luke Kleintank (3), Jimmi Simpson (2), Annie Ilonzeh (5), James Carpinello (2), Alex Shimizu (2), Michael Esper (2), Joseph Mazzello (2), Cotter Smith (3), Jacob Pitts (2), Ned Eisenberg (2), Adria Arjona (2), John Fiore (4), Michael Mulheren (3), Brian Wiles (5), James Hanlon (2), James Le Gros (3), Mark Margolis (3), Darien Sills-Evans (3), Oakes Fegley (3), Robert Manning Jr. (5), and Quinn Shephard (2). That would cut the list of 52 recurring characters to 30. Thoughts? Drovethrughosts (talk) 21:41, 8 November 2024 (UTC)

@Drmargi: A user never having edited a specific article before is not grounds for said users edit to the article to be dismissed out of hand. There are thousands of Wikipedia articles I haven't edited before - are you going to be "troubled" the first time I edit any of those? Also, consensus is only needed if two or more parties cannot come to an immediate agreement. If a user was required to seek consensus before making a change in the first instance, no matter how large or "wholesale" said change might be, nothing would ever get done (consider that nobody responded to this talk-page post, which you specifically requested I make, for over seven days until I chose to be bold). That said, we are now at the stage where we are discussing the change. Now, on to the topic at hand:

I have no objections to some of the more prominent recurring characters being listed on this article (e.g. Greer, Elias, Dominic, Quinn) but I believe Drovethrughosts' suggestions of removing only 12 names still leaves us with a list that is far too long. As I've already mentioned in my original post, the List of Person of Interest characters article exists for a reason, and that reason is to allow us to remove the names from the principle article (i.e. this article). Additionally, I can find no other TV show article on Wikipedia with such an extensive cast section; many TV shows that have gone on for a lot longer that PoI have smaller cast lists (see Stargate SG-1 as an example). -- JascaDucato (talk | contributions) 23:37, 8 November 2024 (UTC)

Maybe it was a typo on your end, but my suggestions cuts 22 actors not 12, which is a pretty good chunk. I'm sure we could maybe cut a bit more, maybe get it to 25? It's a lengthy series at over 100 episodes and features a relatively small main cast of only 6 actors, so I believe allowing a longer recurring list is warranted. Also, here are some examples of articles which feature lengthy recurring cast sections: Better Call Saul#Recurring cast, Breaking Bad#Recurring characters, Boardwalk Empire#Recurring characters, Fear the Walking Dead#Recurring, Justified (TV series)#Recurring cast, and Orange Is the New Black#Recurring cast. Drovethrughosts (talk) 13:23, 9 November 2024 (UTC)

Yes, that was a typo. My point remains, however, that I believe any list should work from the top down (i.e. Main Cast and most prominent recurring characters) rather than the bottom up (removing the least prominent characters) - these might sound the same, but you can and should end up with two very different lists.

Thank you for sharing those recurring cast lists. I wasn't aware we had even as many as that number of articles with such extensive cast lists. That being said, each of those examples has a corresponding character list article, which I would (and currently am) argue precludes the need for such an extensive list on this section. The basis for this argument comes from MOS:TVCAST, which advises: "not every character deserves to be listed [...] If the series is long-running, and has a large number of recurring guest stars, it may be better to create a separate list of characters articles (see below for style guidelines on "List of ..." pages).

That all said, using your suggestion for listing based on numerical appearances, I would be a lot more stringent and recommend a list that includes only the main cast and John Nolan (29), Enrico Colantoni (24), and Robert John Burke (17). These three names also happen to correspond with characters who could be considered the three main 'baddies' in the show. -- JascaDucato (talk | contributions) 13:54, 9 November 2024 (UTC)