Talk:Shatterer

Genre

I've removed the genre cat from this page which was being pulled from IMDb per the User in question on my talk page. Per WP:RS/IMDb, we don't use that site as a source. Andrzejbanas (talk) 02:15, 17 September 2022 (UTC)

I understand that the current MOS:FILM standard wants a genre to organize this film by categories, but if there is no specifically cited genre, we shouldn't add one from our personal opinions (see WP:RS and WP:OR and WP:SUBJECTIVE for more information) or from IMDb (see WP:RS/IMDb). Andrzejbanas (talk) 07:05, 17 September 2022 (UTC)

You didn't just remove genre categories here, you also denationalized the film so that it isn't in the Category:Italian films, Category:Swiss films and Category:Japanese films trees at all anymore.

But it is absolutely, unconditionally mandatory that all films must be categorized for production nationalities, so simply removing all nationality-based categorization entirely is not acceptable — but simply decreeing that an active wikiproject endeavour to clean up films that are still just in the base national film categories and haven't been properly subcategorized for genre yet doesn't matter just because you aren't personally bothered by the issue, and therefore this one film should get a special exemption from having to be cleaned up the same way all other films are being cleaned up, is also not on your list of options either.

So your options here are to either (a) leave the genre categories alone, or (b) if you're so certain that they're incorrect, then you find the sourcing needed to move the film from the "incorrect" genre category to a more correct genre category. An Italian, Swiss and Japanese film must be in an "Italian [something] films" category and a "Swiss [something] films" category and a "Japanese [something] films" category — that's a requirement, not an option — so if you're not satisfied with the "something" that somebody else picked, then you're perfectly free to find a different "something" and move the film there, but you are not free to revert the film back into the base national categories that need to be emptied out, and you are not free to just completely pull it out of the entire Category:Films by country tree by removing all three categories without replacing them.

The principles here are:

1. The film must be filed somewhere in the Category:Italian films, Category:Swiss films and Category:Japanese films trees, and you are not entitled to pull them out of those trees entirely.
2. The place in each of those trees where the film is filed cannot just be Category:Italian films, Category:Swiss films and Category:Japanese films themselves, but rather there must be at least one other word in each category between the country name and the word films, so you are not entitled to just revert anybody who tries to move them out of the categories that are being cleaned up either.

So if you're not satisfied with "drama", then you're perfectly free to find the sourcing needed to move it from "drama" to a different genre label. But both of the principles I listed above are mandatory principles that must be followed and are not options that you're free to ignore or overrule — so if you can't be bothered to invest the time needed, then your only other option is "drop the stick, leave the categories alone and move on". Bearcat (talk) 14:47, 17 September 2022 (UTC)

I'm not the one who came in and added genres. So per WP:BURDEN, "All content must be verifiable. The burden to demonstrate verifiability lies with the editor who adds or restores material, and it is satisfied by providing an inline citation to a reliable source that directly supports the contribution." So that is on you and you shouldn't be just applying IMDb as a go to here or anywhere.Andrzejbanas (talk) 22:03, 17 September 2022 (UTC)

You are the one who removed nationalities, so you don't get to disclaim any responsibility in this. Again: if you don't like the genre categories that another editor has selected, then you're perfectly free to replace them with other genre categories — but you are not entitled to strip nationality-based categorization entirely out of the article at all. The article must be in a category that has the word "Italian" in it, and a category that has the word "Japanese" in it, and a category that has the word "Swiss" in it, but those cannot just be "Nationality films" without at least one additional word between the nationality and the word "films", and neither of those are suggestions that you're free to just ignore or overrule — so if you don't like the genre that one person has applied, your only acceptable option is replacing it with a different genre. Bearcat (talk) 14:43, 27 September 2022 (UTC)

Kinenote (by Kinema Junpo) categorizes it under drama. Nardog (talk) 17:11, 24 September 2022 (UTC)