Talk:Sonic the Hedgehog (Archie Comics)

"Egg Grapes"

I've been working on rewriting the plot summary, as it's overly detailed and difficult to read without any knowledge of the comic. Case in point, the plot section references "Egg Grapes" several times. This was one of the few parts I couldn't understand/rewrite with the help of context clues. Can someone tell me what an Egg Grape is supposed to be? Sergecross73 msg me 21:01, 24 April 2012 (UTC)

Egg Grapes were devices created by Eggman to siphon off the energy of living things to power his robots. One of the first major storylines Ian Flynn did involved wiping out a bunch of unnecessary characters by putting them into the grapes and having the grapes suck out all their energy 76.21.132.62 (talk) 12:19, 17 July 2017 (UTC)

References

Maintenance tags

I have just added the tags {{tone}} and {{plot}} to the article. Here is a brief run-down of the stuff this article needs for improvement. I'll start working on it later.

• {{Overly detailed}}: We should consider cutting or splitting the "Series and reissues" section. Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of information, and most of the section is just trivia.
• {{tone}}: The plot synopsis section isn't written from a neutral point of view. We shouldn't have flourishes like ellipses in the section, and it should describe events, not make you want to read it.
• {{plot}}: Another thing about the plot: it's way too long. Briefly summarise the premise of the stories. You don't have to include every single event that happens. Pick out the most important ones and briefly touch upon them to paint the big picture.

I'll elaborate more later. Mz7 (talk) 23:06, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Adaptions

Is it really necessary to keep the adaptions section on this article? It's content probably falls under the "excessive amount of intricate detail that may only interest a specific audience" type, and contributes to the unnecessary length and illegibility of the page. I understand it's not the biggest problem with the article, the huge plot summary being the core problem, but just because a comparatively bigger problem exists I do not feel we should ignore smaller issues.

Considering that most of these "adaptions" are so loose in fidelity to the original source material, they could be considered adaptions in name only, and most of the remaining adaptions are non-canonical short advertisements for recently released games it's unlikely this information is useful for casual readers who might be interested anyway. Since all this information can be found on more specialized sites on this subject I implore for the removal of this section. — Preceding unsigned comment added by MegaMuffinMan (talk • contribs) 16:08, 4 April 2014 (UTC)

Series and reissues

On the subject of excessive detail and legibility, there has got to be a better way to list that content without making it so bloated and messy. — Preceding unsigned comment added by MegaMuffinMan (talk • contribs) 16:16, 4 April 2014 (UTC)

Well, if the main concern is the article itself being bloated, I decided to create this page (List of Archie Comics Sonic the Hedgehog publications). Antiyonder (talk) 20:24, 19 August 2014 (UTC)

Characters?

It feels a bit weird to me that the characters are organized into game-exclusive and comic-exclusive. The article is on the comic book series, not the games. One could argue the comic book cast has overall been featured more prominently over the book's 20 year publication history than most of the game characters, second only to Sonic, Tails, and Knuckles. Perhaps the article could be edited to be organized under heroes, villains, and organizations? None of the other articles on video game adaptations separate the characters into "game characters," and characters created exclusively for the spin-offs. Not even the articles on other Sonic media. Seems a bit odd that we'd do that here. It's almost reads as though the game characters have more weight in the series, despite the equal, and in some cases greater, prominence of the characters created exclusively for the comics or who carried over from the 1990s animated series. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.29.5.146 (talk) 04:35, 21 June 2015 (UTC)

I agree; my guess is that it's the way it is because physical media releases are seen as more substantive on Wikipedia than in-universe importance, with the games holding similar privilege over alternate media. No question about it, though - four out of the six original Freedom Fighters have never appeared in a game, and the ratio dwindles only further in 25YL. (It'd be hilarious if we kept it this way, but, like, Manik, Sonia, Melody, and Skye got their own section halfway between the game characters and the comic ones.) Tezero (talk) 04:44, 23 June 2015 (UTC)

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External link request!

Could I keep this: entire world of the book being rebooted and altered with hundreds of characters cut here, or no? — 73.47.37.131 (talk) 23:55, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Edit-warring anon IP

Almost immediately after I asked the anon IP at User talk:104.181.85.104 not to edit-war, and to follow WP:BRD and discuss his issues on this article's talk page, he violated WP:3RR before I had a chance to give him a 3RR warning. I ask that he restore the version before his edit-warring began. If he does not do so by the time I compile evidence to report him, this will have to go to an admin as a bright-line violation. --Tenebrae (talk) 00:04, 24 March 2017 (UTC)

Undid the edit to your last version. I still don't agree but not my wiki not my rules and I don't want you to get in trouble for going over 4 edits. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 104.181.85.104 (talk) 00:24, 24 March 2017 (UTC)

That's fine. Now, please tell me and any other editor who comes to this talk page what edits you want to make and why. I have to tell you, edit summaries like "It's to have characters of non Human race be people which they can only do if they have Human souls. We aren't animals because of our souls not because of our form" and "despite them not being innocent creatures incapable of sin" makes it sound as if you are pushing a religious POV and reading things into the comics that you are personally interpreting. --Tenebrae (talk) 00:28, 24 March 2017 (UTC)

I just am of the belief that when the series was founded on the principle that the Sonic characters are the same as Humans are (Sonic and Madonna and the entirety of the one sided love story in Sonic 2006) that it wouldn't be fair to call these characters animals. Yes, they are called Hedgehogs and the like but they aren't comparable to an animal hedgehog. It's the same logic as the Zora from The Legend of Zelda being "Fish people" but not being any actual animal because they're people. I don't see why if he isn't any different from us then a double standard or labeling of him as an animal should exist. Is it because of the knee jerk reaction some people had to the Sonic Elise thing from 2006? I know it frequently gets called bestiality but I don't think it's reasonable to call it that because of the fact that animals can't consent, he can consent so that would make him a person and not an animal wouldn't it?

Calling him an animal (and not in the mammal classification way that Humans are sometimes called by) or that saying such a relationship is inherently evil because of bestiality which is only as such if they are an animal, it being between two people of different species (He's called a hedgehog but he barely resembles one and he acts nothing like one and is treated in universe as a person as he was arrested and sent to prison in Sonic Adventure 2) which even if they call him a hedgehog he's not an animal hedgehog but a person in another form that got classified the same thing just doesn't seem right to me. Other franchises and fandoms ship characters of two different Species (Although of note they often call them by other races which even this series did with Tails' billboard wanted poster in SA2 saying race fox) and don't get a negative stigma or treated like they're supporting bestiality for it so I don't think Sonic should be considering ever having been or ever being an animal, rather he's the same as a Human and is just a person in another form. However I understand that a wiki information is about putting down information given rather than philosophical reasoning and it should be done without coming from a huge fan of the series POV.

I'm glad you didn't get in trouble for my edits. I'll leave this article alone regardless of whatever changes are made to it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 104.181.85.104 (talk) 00:41, 24 March 2017 (UTC)

Thank you for discussing. I appreciate all the analysis you give, and surely you realize that you're doing personal analysis and interpretation. And just as a simple grammatical and English-language point, these creatures are, objectively speaking, anthropomorphic animals. "Anthropomorphic" means "human-like." So "anthropomorphic humans" or "anthropomorphic people" makes no sense. Mickey Mouse is an anthropomorphic mouse. Bugs Bunny is an anthropomorphic rabbit. Discussion of whether they have souls is completely tangential to an encyclopedia article describing them and their fictional world. Does that make sense? I'm getting the feeling English may not be your first language? --Tenebrae (talk) 00:50, 24 March 2017 (UTC)

Oh, I was never saying animals don't have souls. But animals go to Heaven no matter what because they have sinless souls. Humans are people because their souls can sin and be evil. The characters in this series fall into the later so they are people like any other fictional race rather than animals.

Yes, I admit it was coming from both that and the fact that I support HumanxAnthro pairings. I don't like the feeling that some would say it's the same as supporting them and animals because I'm 100% against that and seeing that makes it seem like they'd be saying I'm a bad person for supporting say Sonic Elise or something. Wiki's are supposed to go by an unbiased and face value point of view though and not put down philosophical reasoning regardless of whether it's valid and applicable or not. Thank you for not banning me. Have a nice day. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 104.181.85.104 (talk) 00:57, 24 March 2017 (UTC)

The insanely-enormous Characters section...

I'm a big fan of this series, so I felt pretty embarrassed when I noticed how obscenely huge the Characters section has become. This page is insanity. It talks about each version of Metal Sonic. It talks about Professor Pickle. It talks about the both timeline's backstories for all of the main characters, and even many of the non-main characters.

This page is an entire wiki in its own right. And guess what: This series already has its own wiki at archiesonic.wikia.com, so why does all of this information need to be crammed into this one page?

Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of information.

I would very much appreciate it if others could weigh in on this page. I feel that we need to delete massive amounts of text, but I want to hear others' perspectives first. — Preceding unsigned comment added by FrostedPenguin87 (talk • contribs) 03:06, 12 May 2017 (UTC)

Delete it all. As far as I can see, the section has a link to List of Sonic the Hedgehog characters so there's no reason that relevant material can't be merged there. There doesn't need to be a reboot/preboot segmenting of the information, they all existed at one point. Organisations should be removed entirely. If necessary create a List of Sonic the Hedgehog comics whic would allow you to detail story arcs (Issue #1-10 (2004) "The Eggman whatever" - bit of plot.Darkwarriorblake / SEXY ACTION TALK PAGE! 09:31, 12 May 2017 (UTC)

WP:SIZESPLIT suggests splitting pages when they reach 6,000 to 10,000 words. This article is 20,000. Argento Surfer (talk) 19:14, 15 May 2017 (UTC)

I had actually planned on tackling this enormous cluttered character section at some point, and I've written a much shorter version, only including major or notable characters rather than the entire cast of the comic, though it still needs some major editing and remains a little long. You can view it on my sandbox if you wish to take a look. Evilgidgit (talk) 20:22, 18 May 2017 (UTC)

@Darkwarriorblake: I understand your reasoning. However, merging the section into List of Sonic the Hedgehog characters would be opening a can of worms, imo, as Sonic has many sub-series, each with its own cast of characters.

@Evilgidgit: Hey hey, looking good! It needs some tweaks, but it's loads better than what we have now. Why not go ahead and put it into the real page?  :)

EDIT: Maybe remove "recurring" from "only major, recurring, and notable characters are included in this section." Also, we still might be able to cut out some of those characters, such as Feist and the Secret Freedom Fighters. (It's admittedly hard to quantify what constitutes a major or notable character.) FrostedPenguin87 (talk) 00:34, 22 May 2017 (UTC)

@FrostedPenguin87: I agree with all of your arguments. Noah Kastin (talk) (🖋) 04:08, 8 July 2017 (UTC)

The current version I have on my sandbox still needs some editing and I am in the slow process of adding citations. It'll be ready in time, but not ready for adding to the article. Evilgidgit (talk) 12:10, 8 July 2017 (UTC)

The character section has been added in from my sandbox. Evilgidgit (talk) 21:06, 14 October 2017 (UTC)

Page move?

With the new IDW series starting next year, it doesn't necessarily make sense for the default "Sonic comics" article to be about a series no longer in circulation. I think it might be prudent to move this page to "Sonic the Hedgehog (Archie comics)", then make a separate "Sonic the Hedgehog (IDW comics)" article when that one starts up and we can start gathering sources for production information/reception/etc. Let "Sonic the Hedgehog (comics)" be a redirect until all the existing "Sonic Comics" wikilinks can be properly pointed directly to the moved page. Thoughts? -- 136.181.195.25 (talk) 18:12, 8 August 2017 (UTC)

With the several series that exist, it would be most appropriate to redirect it to List of Sonic the Hedgehog printed media#Comic books, so readers can see which one they may be looking for, or better yet all of them. -DA1 (talk) 10:15, 20 September 2017 (UTC)

I send you the new article. Thank you so much. (Sonic the Hedgehog (IDW Publishing)) Fusionem (talk) 14:08, 27 January 2018 (UTC)

Inofbox: Writers

From my understanding, the series has had multiple head writers over the years. At least 3 or so. Would be much more informative and appropriate to include the names of all of them with the year or issue-span in parenthesis next to the names, respectively. -DA1 (talk) 10:18, 20 September 2017 (UTC)

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Requested move 20 February 2018

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: consensus to move the page, per the discussion below. Dekimasuよ! 00:51, 27 February 2018 (UTC)

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Sonic the Hedgehog (comics) → Sonic the Hedgehog (Archie Comics) – There is a new Sonic comic series dubbed "Sonic the Hedgehog" from another publisher, Sonic the Hedgehog (IDW Publishing). This should become a disambig page and the current page should move to Sonic the Hedgehog (Archie Comics). In addition, there are several other Sonic comic series this could help distinguish it from, including Sonic the Comic and Sonic Universe. TarkusAB^talk 02:48, 20 February 2018 (UTC)

• Is the topic similar enough that both could be within the scope of the current page? Dekimasuよ! 04:24, 20 February 2018 (UTC)
• Oppose - only because WP:TOOSOON - "set to be released on April 4, 2018". We just can't know how long this new series will go. It might turn out to be just a section mentioned on the existing page. Until then, then hatnote does the job, there are only two articles this title could apply to. -- Netoholic @ 05:11, 20 February 2018 (UTC)
  • I forgot to mention there are also other existing Sonic comics that this would help distinguish it from, Sonic the Comic and Sonic Universe. TarkusAB^talk 12:46, 20 February 2018 (UTC)
    • By that token, we already have a List of Sonic the Hedgehog printed media#Comic books, do we need another dab page? -- Netoholic @ 19:00, 20 February 2018 (UTC)
      • @Netoholic: Probably not, I agree. So how about we move Sonic the Hedgehog (comics) to Sonic the Hedgehog (Archie Comics) and make Sonic the Hedgehog (comics) a redirect to List of Sonic the Hedgehog printed media#Comic books. TarkusAB^talk 19:26, 20 February 2018 (UTC)
        • Support this solution. Will require a good bit of link-fixing, but its the best for long-term growth. Someone knowledgeable with the topic should go through Special:WhatLinksHere/Sonic_the_Hedgehog_(comics) and make sure each incoming link points to the correct series. -- Netoholic @ 19:32, 20 February 2018 (UTC)
• Support per nom. JOEBRO64 20:38, 20 February 2018 (UTC)
• Support per above. Sergecross73 msg me 20:51, 20 February 2018 (UTC)
• Support per above. Paintspot Infez (talk) 17:21, 21 February 2018 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Issue Descriptions

Should we add descriptions of each issue? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Advanced Person (talk • contribs) 11:05, 23 December 2018 (UTC)

No TarkusAB^talk 11:22, 23 December 2018 (UTC)

History of the book?

Why is it that there's very little about the book's publication history on the page? It's baffling that there's this huge section about the characters and the history of the book is either relegated to other pages or a heading at the beginning of this one. I would just like to have some opinions on what it can be done about it, other than editing the info in. 2804:D55:48B3:F200:693D:667:9008:906C (talk) 22:56, 16 August 2022 (UTC)

Remove the character section?

Character sections are generally for characters unique to the book, while most of the list are comprised of characters in other media. And the characters that are unique don't seem to have any citations for them that aren't fan sites, so I'm proposing just gutting the character section entirely. Shadowboxer2005 (talk) 09:06, 23 June 2023 (UTC)

Character pages?

Do any of the characters from the Archie comics or SatAM merit their own pages? Just asking. NintenBOUND (talk) 14:05, 23 July 2024 (UTC)