User talk:Isabelle Belato/Archive 12
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Talk page protection
Hi, some obsessed user immediately spammed my talk page again after the previous protection expired https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:FMSky&diff=prev&oldid=1202750277 could you maybe protect it again? thx --FMSky (talk) 12:24, 3 February 2024 (UTC)
- @FMSky: Protected for 6 months. Thanks for the heads up. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 13:11, 3 February 2024 (UTC)
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Block
Is there any way to appeal your block?
This guy deletes huge chunks of work out of spite and thats okay? no question on the merit of his deletions? how is that fair? that just enables bullying. 51.149.8.67 (talk) 13:12, 13 February 2024 (UTC)
- On your own talk page, using the {{unblock}} template. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 13:17, 13 February 2024 (UTC)
Thank you — Preceding unsigned comment added by 51.149.8.67 (talk) 18:26, 13 February 2024 (UTC)
Draft:Destin Conrad
Hi, I need to recover the data entered on the page you deleted not too long ago. Draft:Destin Conrad
I have no connection to him, I am just a fan of music. I spent a lot of time this morning collecting all of that data and typing it all out. As I was adding more "notable" sources of info and articles, you deleted my article. That's really odd especially since I hadn't submitted the article for review yet. It was only a draft.
Again, I have no connection to him. I work in MarTech. I am not in the music industry at all. I just noticed many of his peers like Kehlani and Ambre, people he's been on tour with, people he's written for have Wikipedia pages, but he does not. I found that to be really strange. I was collection links on him from Live Nation, Tidal, Apple, Genius, Fader and the like. Please at least allow me to recover this data and continue to work on the entry before I submit again. I would hate that all that time spent has to go to waste.
Thanks in advance for your consideration!
NOLALADY504 (talk) 18:49, 17 February 2024 (UTC)
- @NOLALADY504: The article read as an advertisement, and every single source was unreliable, either to user-generated websites (Wikipedia) or to commercial websites (Apple Music). I recommend you acquaint yourself with our policies on reliable sources before attempting to write a new article. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 13:10, 18 February 2024 (UTC)
- And I will be working with my Wikipedia mentor as I work to create this article moving forward. Thanks again for your consideration… even if you could just copy and paste the source code here, it’d be greatly appreciated. NOLALADY504 (talk) 13:52, 18 February 2024 (UTC)
- I was still working on the article, learning the ropes. I hadn’t even submitted for review. I was literally adding notable sources while you were deleting. It took me a lot of time to create those tables. Is there any way you can allow me to recover the code so that I can move to my sandbox? NOLALADY504 (talk) 13:49, 18 February 2024 (UTC)
About removing protection from a Wikipedia page
Hello, I've just seen that you've added protection in this page " https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dhruv_Tara_%E2%80%93_Samay_Sadi_Se_Pare " and also you've literally removed the plot and instead added premise. Can you please unprotect this page. As the fans of this show, we've right to edit this page. Tarapriya (talk) 16:00, 18 February 2024 (UTC)
- I protected the page because editors were adding an inordinate amount of detail to the article's plot section. If you want, you can suggest changes to the article in its talk page. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 16:06, 18 February 2024 (UTC)
- But the details editors had added weren't wrong infact this show gained a lot of audiences by reading the details about the plot of that tv show added by editors and also the details editors had shared weren't wrong.
- I've been a regular viewer of the show so I know that the details were authentic. So please kindly remove protection from this page. It's a humble request. You've literally deleted the plot section. Now how will people know that how the plot of the show is and if it's worth watching show.
- So please let others make changes freely on this page. I'll take care of this matter. If someone adds misinformation regarding the show then I myself will add protection or will ask you. So as of now, I request, please remove protection. Tarapriya (talk) 16:46, 18 February 2024 (UTC)
- Your comments here do not reassure me that unprotecting is a good idea. Please read WP:NOT. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 17:07, 18 February 2024 (UTC)
- Okay thanks I've read WP:NOT and understood about how much amount of information is appreciated on Wikipedia. I myself will give details about the shows plot in short. Now please unprotect the page please it's a request or at least let me edit the page. Tarapriya (talk) 14:13, 19 February 2024 (UTC)
- Your comments here do not reassure me that unprotecting is a good idea. Please read WP:NOT. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 17:07, 18 February 2024 (UTC)
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A barnstar for you!
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The Admin's Barnstar |
| Thank you for your service as an admin. Hope everything is well with you and yours. Queen of Hearts talk she/they stalk 03:57, 27 February 2024 (UTC) |
- Thanks for the message and barnstar, Queen of Hearts! I simply haven't had the time or energy to dedicate to Wikipedia, so I thought I'd take a break, at least from administrative matters. I'll likely stick around doing content, for a change. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 11:26, 27 February 2024 (UTC)
- Hello, Isabelle,
- I was sorry to see that you were resigning as an admin. I hope you feel free to resysop should the interest return. I know when I moved cross-country (and was going through cancer treatments), I let my admin status lapse for two years. But, ultimately, I decided to return to the project. I hope you enjoy working on content again instead of referring disputes. But there will always be a need for competent admins! Take care. Liz Read! Talk! 07:51, 28 February 2024 (UTC)
- Thanks for the kind words, Liz. I recently moved to a new city for a job offer and things have been very chaotic, so I thought a break from the more stressful sections of the Wikipedia would be nice. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 15:31, 29 February 2024 (UTC)
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Unlblocking request
Please unblock me from editing in the article "Dhruv Tara Samay Sadi Se Pare". I don't know why did you felt that I was doing wrong. I always tries to do the right. Still if you think that I was wrong, then I am sorry and I will definitely be aware next time. I wasn't too much experienced. I assure you that I will definitely made my editing better. Please, its a humble request. Just forgive me once atleast. Banda12345 (talk) 23:33, 17 March 2024 (UTC)
- Your gaming of the system to acquire ECP, despite my warning you not to do so, does not fill me with confidence. But that's not up to me, since I currently do not have the tools to unblock you. I recommend you read our guide on appealing blocks and request an unblock on your talk page. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 23:35, 17 March 2024 (UTC)
- But you was the one who partially blocked me from editing. It was a pure case of misunderstanding. I don't know what to do now. Can you please help me in unblocking me ? Also tell me who can help me.Please its an humble request. Banda12345 (talk) 12:03, 18 March 2024 (UTC)
- Please read Wikipedia:Guide to appealing blocks for more information on how to request an unblock. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 12:06, 18 March 2024 (UTC)
- But you was the one who partially blocked me from editing. It was a pure case of misunderstanding. I don't know what to do now. Can you please help me in unblocking me ? Also tell me who can help me.Please its an humble request. Banda12345 (talk) 12:03, 18 March 2024 (UTC)
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2a02:c7c::/32's block at AN
Hi Isabelle Belato, I found 2a02:c7c::/32's block settings interesting enough to start a discussion about it; it's at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard § 2a02:c7c::/32 and your input would be welcome. I'm notifying everyone whose name appears in the block log as this is practically a review of a series of admin actions yours was a part of. I hope that, due to the amount of (then-)administrators who built the block to the current state, discussing this in a central location directly rather than asking everyone for input on their own talk page is okay. And perhaps there was a past discussion and this is completely unnecessary silliness of me; I apologize in advance if that's the case. Best regards, ~ ToBeFree (talk) 00:11, 25 March 2024 (UTC)
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Editor experience invitation
Hi Isabelle Belato :) I'm a bit suprised I haven't asked you yet, but would you be interested at pitching in at User:Clovermoss/Editor reflections? No worries if not, I understand not everyone is comfortable doing so. Cheers, Clovermoss🍀 (talk) 01:10, 14 April 2024 (UTC)
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Re: Protection Decision of Abdelrahman ElGendy Page
Hello,
I was attempting to move a draft of an Egyptian writer and public speaker, and recent winner of the Samir Kassir Press Freedom award, a major Press Freedom award in the Middle East, Abdelrahman ElGendy. However, I noticed that the protection log indicates you have protected this page from being moved. I'm not familiar with the history of the page, but based on my research, it meets the notability guidelines. I am writing to inquire about the reason for the protection and the possibility of reconsidering it, as instructed by Wikipedia guidelines.
Thank you. Breakaleg123 (talk) 00:07, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
- The page was protected due to repeated recreation of an article that was previously deleted bua AFD. While I can no longer unprotect the article, I'd suggest you wait for the draft to go through the articles for creation process, where an experienced editor will assess the article's notability and quality. If it is accepted, the article will likely be moved the reviewer, as the protection is at WP:ECP level. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 00:21, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
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User keeps replying in a closed thread; gets mad when I revert them
1 2 the thread was by all accounts legitimately closed by an uninvolved bureaucrat and I don’t think you are supposed to be replying in a closed thread. Dronebogus (talk) 12:56, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
- Hi Dronebogus. While I agree with you that one should not add comments to a closed thread, even if they edit conflicted, I don't think you are the one who should be undoing those comments, since you are as involved as one can be. In this case, I think it best to just let it be to not cause further issues for all involved editors. Next time, I recommend contacting the closing admin and asking them to deal with the issue. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 13:05, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Isabelle Belato, Hi! This page is being vandalizing by same sockfarm (TSJ) from a long time now new sock (Gokulwasi)[1] & was also disrupted by related socks see (ShivaniLocks),[2][3][4] (Karnam Singh Rana)[5][6], even after last page protection[7] was expired page may required protection for more months or extend in protection if applies per the wiki_policies. Many edits of these socks were reversed many times by diff editors but they continued their socking.[8][9][10] 223.123.18.8 (talk) 18:05, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
- I've protected the page for a month and added to my watchlist. Thanks for bringing this to my attention. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 18:24, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Isabelle Belato Thanks for the input happy editing.223.123.7.11 (talk) 18:35, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
- I've protected the page for a month and added to my watchlist. Thanks for bringing this to my attention. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 18:24, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Isabelle Belato, Hi! This page is being vandalizing by same sockfarm (TSJ) from a long time now new sock (Gokulwasi)[1] & was also disrupted by related socks see (ShivaniLocks),[2][3][4] (Karnam Singh Rana)[5][6], even after last page protection[7] was expired page may required protection for more months or extend in protection if applies per the wiki_policies. Many edits of these socks were reversed many times by diff editors but they continued their socking.[8][9][10] 223.123.18.8 (talk) 18:05, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
Welcome back
Just wanted to say I'm glad to see you picked the mop back up. Best, HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 20:28, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
- Thanks, HJ! I'm happy to finally have the time again to dedicate to the project. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 20:37, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
Recreated
Now it has again been recreated. 106.194.43.27 (talk) 18:17, 16 July 2024 (UTC)
- I noticed that. It has already been nominated for deletion, though, so best wait for the result. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 18:20, 16 July 2024 (UTC)
Assassin's Creed Shadows
Shouldn't the protection expire until somepoint after the release of the game? This feels rather counterproductive Trade (talk) 14:17, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
- If the problem persists after protection is over we can extend it. It's also unlikely that the release of the game will result in less vandalism over this subject. Isabelle Belato 🏴☠️ 17:17, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
Katherine Delmar Burke page
Hello, I made a new section on the talk page [1] to discuss the noteability. . I am new to this, so am just posting this message here to invite you to the talk page so we can reach consensus. Thanks! 2601:645:8A81:F8B0:15B5:2895:9F87:6281 (talk) 23:28, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
- Thanks for starting a discussion on the talk page. I recommend you ping the other involved editors, who might want to chime in. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 00:19, 18 July 2024 (UTC)
- They didn't last long on the Talk page and now edited the article with even more disruptive material. I still think the best thing to do is protect the page. The article has a history of disruption from San Francisco IPv6 ranges. Not sure if they're all the same person.--Bbb23 (talk) 13:49, 18 July 2024 (UTC)
- I've blocked the range for a week for the disruptive editing and continued edit war. I have the article on my watchlist, if the disruptive editing return under a different range, I will protect the page. Thanks. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 14:11, 18 July 2024 (UTC)
- Thanks, more work for you (smile), but it makes sense.--Bbb23 (talk) 14:40, 18 July 2024 (UTC)
- I've blocked the range for a week for the disruptive editing and continued edit war. I have the article on my watchlist, if the disruptive editing return under a different range, I will protect the page. Thanks. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 14:11, 18 July 2024 (UTC)
- They didn't last long on the Talk page and now edited the article with even more disruptive material. I still think the best thing to do is protect the page. The article has a history of disruption from San Francisco IPv6 ranges. Not sure if they're all the same person.--Bbb23 (talk) 13:49, 18 July 2024 (UTC)
Page protection declined, Talk page did not help
I made a page protection request yesterday on Greek football clubs in European competitions and was declined. Suggested me to use Talk page and try to resolve this dispute. I did but I think it's impossible to reason together with an IP user who comments stuff like your reasoning is ridiculous and speaks ironically all the time making accusations. What else can I do? Report to an admin? Ask again for page protection? Ask for someone to dissolve this? Thank you Abudabanas (talk) 13:13, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
Good Evening. I am the anonymous user who has a dispute with Mr. Abudabanas. Initially there is no fix war to protect the page. I don't make objections or write there until other opinions are heard on the talk page of the entry. Now if my style seems ironic, it is not. Indignation is expressed as the user has no arguments and simply came to spoil the entry by introducing personal beliefs. You can read our conversation here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Greek_football_clubs_in_European_competitions#Table_of_the_top_4_Greek_teams_in_the_European_cups — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:586:813D:2A91:806C:F772:DF06:AECA (talk) 16:31, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
- @Abudabanas: First thing you need to do is stop reverting the IP. If they refuse to engage on the talk page, or is otherwise stonewalling the discussion or making personal attacks, consider reporting them to ANI. Aside from that, both are warned that if you continue reverting each other, you will be blocked for edit warring. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 16:39, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
- Thank you for your help. Abudabanas (talk) 16:53, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
- Keeps reverting despite your warning though. Abudabanas (talk) 08:27, 20 July 2024 (UTC)
- I didn't do any reversals. I simply added some facts that you had arbitrarily dismissed. Your edits were not tampered with. 2A02:586:813D:2A91:C4FA:FBB9:E10B:3E9 (talk) 10:21, 20 July 2024 (UTC)
- Keeps reverting despite your warning though. Abudabanas (talk) 08:27, 20 July 2024 (UTC)
- Thank you for your help. Abudabanas (talk) 16:53, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
A kitten for you!
I've just noticed you doing a lot of (possibly quite tedious) admin cleanup work lately and I wanted you to know that it is appreciated :+)
AntiDionysius (talk) 23:55, 21 July 2024 (UTC)
- Thanks AntiDionysius, that's very much appreciated :) Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 00:00, 22 July 2024 (UTC)
sad
no one really seems able to save this cat https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fat_Freddy%27s_Cat - yet as a cultural icon only surpassed by the cockroaches, it sits in an almost pirate-like- walking the plank suspended in space and time - I am sure there are phds and more somehwere that deal with fat freddy, but... JarrahTree 02:20, 21 July 2024 (UTC)
- apologies - if it didnt make sense, your cat edits on your user page set the association with fat freddy JarrahTree 02:01, 22 July 2024 (UTC)
User:Altartattoostudio
Hi! I noticed you used Template:Uw-uhblock when blocking this user. Since the account is promotional, wouldn't Template:Uw-spamublock be more appropriate? Thanks for your hard work. Helpful Raccoon (talk) 02:07, 22 July 2024 (UTC)
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Talk:Kimberly Cheatle
Hi, do you mind keeping an eye on the talk page for potential BLP issues? Trade (talk) 01:52, 23 July 2024 (UTC)
- I've added to my watchlist and will be looking into it. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 11:18, 23 July 2024 (UTC)
For your info, I've filed an SPI request here Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Architect 134. First time (I think) using Twinkle for SPI. Knitsey (talk) 00:22, 25 July 2024 (UTC)
- Seems good, thanks. I'm not familiar with this LTA, so I can't be of much help here. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 00:27, 25 July 2024 (UTC)
Thank you
Hello,
Thank you for your swift intervention on the Gino Jennings article. But, how can edits be proposed with full protection, please? - TheLionHasSeen (talk) 14:56, 25 July 2024 (UTC)
- Will reply at WP:ANI. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 14:57, 25 July 2024 (UTC)
- Thanks! - TheLionHasSeen (talk) 15:01, 25 July 2024 (UTC)
Hello, you recently deleted this category under G4 in what I'm assuming is a reference to This discussion, however I do not believe the specific intersection any longer fails WP:BEFORE for the WP:OCEGRS guideline mentioned in the original discussion, see potential sources below. Could you restore the page, or would you prefer I go through an undeletion review for the original discussion?
- Krishner, Yonah. 10 Jewish YouTube Channels for Teaching Judaic Studies, Jewish Education Project.
- Lakritz, Talia. 5 ‘JewTubers’ To Watch, Jewish Telegraphic Agency.
- Miller, Jason. Jews in the Digital Age: The Off-the-Derech YouTuber, Detroit Jewish News.
Orchastrattor (talk) 18:33, 25 July 2024 (UTC)
- Hi Orchastrattor. I was simply enforcing the consensus found in that discussion. If you want to change the outcome, I suggest opening a review at WP:DRV. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 18:44, 25 July 2024 (UTC)
The deletion of Bertan Asllani page.
Hello, you recently deleted the English page for a Turkish actor named Bertan Asllani. You deleted it because you said the page was advertising or promoting even though no where on the page was there any advertising or promoting. We simply stated the history of the actor and works he has been in. Narcen99 (talk) 16:23, 25 July 2024 (UTC)
- If you have a conflict of interest with the subject, you should declare it on your userpage. In addition to that, the article was again nominated for speedy deletion. I won't act on it, but it's likely it will be deleted either speedily or through WP:AFD. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 19:07, 25 July 2024 (UTC)
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Please use the template
I think the problem here is that the template is ill-suited for the issue.
Can't we WP:IAR it just this once?
jps (talk) 22:37, 25 July 2024 (UTC)
- @jps: That noticeboard has a very strict threaded format so that discussions don't become a mess as they usually do at AN(I). If you believe that format is no good for the discussion you want to start, then ANI should be a fine place to start it, though I think your complaint should be doable with the template. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 22:46, 25 July 2024 (UTC)
- I definitely tried, but most of the sections just don't apply. The template seems like it is tuned towards a barrier to entry rather than getting help. I'm pretty sure there is no hard and fast rule that this template is necessarily the best. jps (talk) 23:39, 25 July 2024 (UTC)
Totally spies
Unlock totally spies editing 75.105.232.44 (talk) 20:57, 31 July 2024 (UTC)
Totally spies Wikipedia
I promise not to do anymore vandalism 75.105.232.44 (talk) 20:59, 31 July 2024 (UTC)
- Sure thing. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 21:00, 31 July 2024 (UTC)
Nirmala college,Muvattupuzha
Hello in the article,Nirmala College, Muvattupuzha, in the controversy section ,there appears to be an edit war with the user അദ്വൈതൻ. The said user seems to present the article targetting the Muslim community in a bad light.So I had changed the tone without changing the meaning to present it in a more neutral point of view.Also he is not allowing me to complete the story.After the incident have happened,the Muslim community have apologized for the incident.Also State SFI president and other polital leaders have clarified they were not involved in the protests.He is not allowing me to put both these sentences in the article.They are credible sources that I have added for the both these sources.If you go through the contributions page and talk page it’s understandable the said used അദ്വൈതൻ have been repeatedly involved in edit wars , have been warned of edit wars in the past and have been blocked for it.
Could you please see the section yourself?
Actually I also believe such an incident shouldn't be given so much importance as this page is on a college, and one lone incident can't take up so much space, however controversial it may be. The section is too detailed and WP:UNDUE.
If you believe that I am correct, please revert to the version before him i.e to version written by me.If I am at fault you can correct me.I am still new to this and I totally understand that I can make mistakes. Tmanthara (talk) 14:48, 1 August 2024 (UTC)
- This should be discussed at the article's talk page. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 14:49, 1 August 2024 (UTC)
- Yes.But he is not replying.Thats why I am asking your help. Tmanthara (talk) 14:53, 1 August 2024 (UTC)
- The discussion started today on the talk page and the article is protected for a week. Give it some time. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 14:56, 1 August 2024 (UTC)
- Okay Thanks. Tmanthara (talk) 15:00, 1 August 2024 (UTC)
- The discussion started today on the talk page and the article is protected for a week. Give it some time. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 14:56, 1 August 2024 (UTC)
- Yes.But he is not replying.Thats why I am asking your help. Tmanthara (talk) 14:53, 1 August 2024 (UTC)
Revoke TPA of this IP
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/5.14.150.51 needs TPA revoked now. All IPs from this LTA need it done as soon as they get blocked. Jdcomix (talk) 15:11, 1 August 2024 (UTC)
Couch nonsense
I was in the process of AfDing it, but I cannot argue at all with the G10. Good call. 28bytes (talk) 23:46, 1 August 2024 (UTC)
- Thanks goes to JPxG for the bold CSD'ing. Agree that it was a good call. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 23:47, 1 August 2024 (UTC)
Talk:Imane Khelif
Making the first ever protection of a talk page Extended protected rather than Semi protected feels a bit overkill
What were newly registered accounts saying that was so bad as to necessitate this? Can't be too egregious given there is no revision deletions Trade (talk) 07:22, 2 August 2024 (UTC)
- @Trade: I'm not sure I know what you mean. The talk page is currently semi-protected, while the article itself was semi-protected before I upgraded it to ECP. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 08:43, 2 August 2024 (UTC)
- I just wanted to know why protecting the talk page was necessary. Was it the comments calling her a "biological male"`? Trade (talk) 03:00, 3 August 2024 (UTC)
- Yeah, lots of BLP violations disguised as edit requests flooding the talk page. Isabelle Belato 🏴☠️ 11:12, 3 August 2024 (UTC)
- I just wanted to know why protecting the talk page was necessary. Was it the comments calling her a "biological male"`? Trade (talk) 03:00, 3 August 2024 (UTC)
RRR
Both edit-warriors were out of line, but the question of whether to include a section on international recognition was a valid content dispute, and so was a proper subject for an RFC. In this case, as is often the case, it was necessary to think about the improvement of the encyclopedia as a separate issue from the conduct of either editor. Robert McClenon (talk) 23:48, 3 August 2024 (UTC)
Adminship
Congrats, glad you're back :-) Lotje (talk) 16:16, 6 August 2024 (UTC)
- Thanks, it's good to be back! Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 16:48, 6 August 2024 (UTC)
Best me to it
See Lexarike (talk · contribs). I knew it was familiar! ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 19:17, 11 August 2024 (UTC)
- When you posted on ANI, I searched the archives and saw the ANI thread on this editor, but I was pretty sure I ran into a similar case way more recently than that. I wish my memory was better to better deal with these socks. Isabelle Belato 🏳🌈 19:28, 11 August 2024 (UTC)
- Or that searching noticeboards worked better. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 19:41, 11 August 2024 (UTC)