Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2007 January 15

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January 15

Duplicate Entries

Quick question: what should one do when finding articles that are exact duplicates but have different titles? Thanks, Xnuala 00:41, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

You'll probably want to merge them (see Wikipedia:Merging and moving pages), and have one become a redirect to the other. -- Natalya 00:49, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Thanks!Xnuala 00:50, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

What should I do if I think an article has been vandalised?

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=The_Noisettes&diff=100775168&oldid=100775082

I thought the best thing to do would be to revert it (so I did) and then I came here to ask what to do next, would anyone mind explaining please? ^^ -Painezor 01:26, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

I just took a look at the person's userpage and it appears that the anti-vandal bot has already been to his page once about vandalising the same page. -Painezor 01:32, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

You can find instructions for warning potential vandals here, basically just add {{testx}} to the users talk page, with x=1 for the first time, x=2 for the second, ect, until you get to test4. Then you can report the vandal at WP:AIV. Prodego ^talk 01:35, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

I reported another vandal who replaced an entire section with ... expletives, and since he had a {{Test-5n}} warning I figured that it was the best idea to put it on the WP:AIV page... did I do right or wrong... hopefully right because I'm scared of what might happen if I did wrong :( -Painezor 02:06, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Nothing will happen if you do anything wrong, except someone would probably explain your mistake to you. If the test5 was recent, then that was the correct thing to do. Prodego ^talk 02:07, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Sorry for all the questions, but two more just sprang to mind. Firstly, do I have to start at {{test}} or should I start with the blatant vandalism (if the case may be) warnings? Also, the 3 Revert Rule thingy. If I'm reverting blatant vandalism this rule surely shouldn't apply right? -Painezor 02:22, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

See WP:UTM for choice of template. The choice depends on how much good faith you are prepared to assume - usually as much as possible. WP:3RR explains that it does not apply to blatant vandalism. -- zzuuzz ^(talk) 02:58, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

contacting users

how do i contact users?? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Merlot70 (talk • contribs) 01:50, 15 January 2007 (UTC).

You can contact them on their talk pages, simply type [[User talk: <Name of user>]] in the search bar, and you will be able to leave a message there, that they will receive. For example, your talk page is located at User talk:Merlot70. Note that this page is public, and everyone can see your message. Prodego ^talk 01:52, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

If you want to send private messages, some people allow you to send them e-mail messages from Wikipedia. You can check if someone has an "E-mail this user" link on their user page. --Kjoonlee 02:15, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

How do I delete the "you have a new message" notification?

Hello, I am a sporatic Wikipedia editor and I have received a message. The notification for this message is orange and appears as a band on top of every page that I access. When I click on the message, I am sent through to a link but I have found no where on that link or elsewhere that will enable me to hide this orange band. It is a page about "Talk," or "Wikipedia:Talk." This band is especially pestering as it is from another editor accusing me of vandalizing an article. I would also like to contest such an accusation. As I did edit the page in question, but only to correct a place name (which actually had to do with my high school). Thank you for any help. ~`FrancesCFrancesC

You don't seem to have any messages on your talk page. Are you sure you're logged in when you're receiving this message? Either way, it ought to disappear when you visit your user talk page. --Sopoforic 01:58, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

No, I am not logged in when it appears, it appears when I just go to Wikipedia. Would a good option be to always be signed in as a user?

Yes, you should just stay signed in, otherwise you'll get messages intended for other users who have the same IP (such as people using the same public computer, or people on the same dial-up ISP that uses dynamic IPs). That's one of the main benefits of making and using an account: it makes it easy for people to contact you while making sure the right person gets the message. --Sopoforic 02:19, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Medical Disclaimer or Warning

Hi, There is some freakishly biased/outdated medical information on wikipedia. Is there a warning template to place on top of such pages warning readers to seek medical advice elsewhere? (At the risk of underestimating the Wikipedia reader's intelligence.--Hollerbackgril 02:16, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Well, it is in Wikipedia:Medical disclaimer. Wikipedia is not a medical reference, and should not be used as such, regardless of whether the page is superbly accurate, or awful. Prodego ^talk 02:19, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

As Prodego said. Plus, see Wikipedia:No disclaimer templates for info. --Sopoforic 02:21, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Thanks, exactly what I was looking for. I pity the fool! --Hollerbackgril 02:40, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Indenting bulleted lists consisting of multiple paragraphs

Hi there,

Let's say I have the following in an article:

Something or another can consist of these two things:

• Blah blah blah, blah blah blah. Blah blah blah blah, blah blah, blah.
• A second bulleted item, but consisting of two (or more) paragraphs, which all actually belong under the same (second) bulleted item.

So in other words, this second paragraph also belongs to the second bulleted item, but now its indentation is all screwy and messed up.

And this third paragraph is also supposed to belong to the second bulleted item.

• Blah blah blah, blah blah blah.

My question is, is it possible to also indent the second and third paragraphs of the second bullet item, without turning them into new bullet items?

Thanks in advance for any help.

—Xhantar^Talk 02:47, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

• Foo
• Bar
  Baz
  Quux
• Quuux

--Kjoonlee 02:58, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. I've ended up using <p> instead of <br /> though, as that keeps the spacing in between the paragraphs intact, as well as the indentation. —Xhantar^Talk 03:20, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

I think you should note that in general prose is preferable to lists. I don't know about your particular situation, but I'd say that if you have a list whose members are paragraphs, it's probably possible to convert it into prose. --Sopoforic 02:59, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

I'm in the process of wikifying Linux color management, and the section in question was written to expand quite a bit on its mentioned "two approaches" (see the first bullet item).

What is your thoughts in a case such as this? —Xhantar^Talk 03:20, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Well, I don't really like the way that section reads, but I'd probably just say something like "one method is to ... foo bar baz" and "An alternative method, which does not modify the video card LUT..." to replace the bullets. Then again, I'm not sure that that'd make it sound much better, so use your own judgment. --Sopoforic 03:28, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for your input. —Xhantar^Talk 03:39, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

On the subject of lists (Sorry to hijack this but you just reminded me...). I've noticed that in certain subjects the original writer may put something like "Other magazines in this style are Mad, Sick, and Cracked", whereupon someone else comes along and adds "Also Crazy, and Wacko". A little later some smartarse looks at this and adds seventeen more titles to the list. At this point an individual with a more educated backside decides that he's going to add the number of issues that each magazine ran for to the list...

The result makes for unpleasant reading. Would it not be better by this point to have turned the line into a vertical list? I often think I'll do it, but I don't want to step on anyone's toes or break any rules. Deke42 04:12, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Responding to Deke42: My own stylistic feeling, FWIW, is that in a case like that -- assuming all that information really does belong at that point in the article -- a list would make more sense than running text. --Tkynerd 04:31, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Yes, there are times when a list is better. Wikipedia:Embedded list gives some tips on what to do. If information of the sort you mentioned does belong in an article, probably a list or table is more appropriate. But, it's a decision that really needs to be made on a case-by-case basis. If you come across this sort of thing, the best thing to do is to use your best judgment and be bold. After all, if things look worse afterward, we can always change it back. --Sopoforic 07:03, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Question about WP:REVERT

WP:REVERT says not to revert content dispute edits unless it's vandalism. I've noticed that quite a few users, though (including some administrators) revert immediately when new content is put in or old content rephrased in a way they don't like. This seems to directly contradict the "don'ts" section of the policy. I've sent messages to the users and administrators which I've noticed tend to do this. I've noticed that others have also posted on their talk pages complaining of similar behavior. It doesn't seem to change their actions in the least. I won't name names because I don't want to cause anyone any undue grief, but what can be done about this situation? It's clear they're don't care about the revert policy, but the only solid revert rule seems to be 3RR. Is this the kind of thing that you just "have to put up with"? .V. (talk) 06:11, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

WP:REVERT is copied from Meta-wiki. Unfortunately, Meta has a strong mindset of "to hell with neutrality", even in help files. Most editors I know do not view reverts so stringently. -Amarkov ^blah_edits 06:18, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Hmm. I always favor discussion on a talk page rather than revert wars. I find it's more polite. So the "unwritten" policy is not to follow WP:REVERT? .V. (talk) 06:20, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

That particular part, yes. But help pages aren't official policy, anyway. -Amarkov ^blah_edits 06:32, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Interesting. I wonder why it's not an official policy. .V. (talk) 06:37, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Because it's a technical assistance page providing general, common sense advice, not hard and fast rules.Circeus 06:40, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

I have several computer/video game articles on my watchlist. Users frequently add unsourced information, rumours, commentary, nonsense, spammy external links, etc. These things aren't vandalism exactly, but they do damage the article. Having to talk before reverting them would honestly not be helpful at all. -- Consumed Crustacean (talk) 06:41, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Hmm, maybe if it wasn't patently inappropriate (unsourced, speculation, etc.) I've noticed a lot of people using reverts very liberally in content disputes, and that kind of bothers me. .V. (talk) 06:47, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

I hope it at least doesn't surprise. usually, WP:3RR is what you want then.Circeus 06:49, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Heh, it certainly doesn't surprise at all. .V. (talk) 06:54, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Wikiquette certainly allows a single revert of basically anything that's unsourced - beyond that you can become rude, and hit WP:3RR. But talking out every edit that's bad by some editor who's probably not even watching the article? Sounds like a big waste of time. WilyD 18:59, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

When I first got reverted I read WP:REVERT and agreed with it. Ans so thought that many editors were uncivil at least. Some even go so far as to state "any edit by a new(or unregistered or single issue) user will be reverted on sight unless they discuss it first." I still think such actions are uncivil. However I'd like to know more about what pushes editors to such a position on reverting. Maybe there are very good reasons. And if there are maybe we could find a more civil way to meet those editors needs. SmithBlue 06:04, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

How to include a diff in a template?

User:SebastianHelm/sandbox/diff is a simple sample template that contains just one parameter. I'd like to pass a diff, such as http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Politics_of_Sri_Lanka&diff=100146801&oldid=97860683, to the template and have it display it as a hyperlink.

The problem seems to be that the equal signs mess the URL up. Of course, I can ask the user to not enter the URL, but <nowiki>URL</nowiki>. But how can I make the template recognize that as a URL and display a hyperlink?

Code is always {{User:SebastianHelm/sandbox/diff|URL}}, where URL varies as follows:

URL	result
http://en.wikipedia.org	Here is the template, which says that http://en.wikipedia.org is the URL. With brackets, it looks like this: [1].
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Politics_of_Sri_Lanka&diff=100146801&oldid=97860683	Here is the template, which says that {{{1}}} is the URL. With brackets, it looks like this: [{{{1}}}].
"http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Politics_of_Sri_Lanka&diff=100146801&oldid=97860683"	User:SebastianHelm/sandbox/diff
<nowiki>http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Politics_of_Sri_Lanka&diff=100146801&oldid=97860683</nowiki>	Here is the template, which says that http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Politics_of_Sri_Lanka&diff=100146801&oldid=97860683 is the URL. With brackets, it looks like this: [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Politics_of_Sri_Lanka&diff=100146801&oldid=97860683].

I need this for vandalism templates, so your help really helps Wikipedia in general. Thank you! — Sebastian 08:00, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

You can also use, for example, {{unblock|1=difflink}}. Luna Santin 11:40, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Found the solution: Use names, as in User:SebastianHelm/sandbox/diffa. — Sebastian 08:09, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Don't know if you're aware, but there is a similar template: {{Wp-diff}}.-NMajdan•talk 16:52, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Doubled-up page

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenshiro Somebody has edited the entry for the Fist of the North Star character Kenshiro to have completely unrelated information about a hip-hop producer also named Kenshiro into it. How would one go about splitting this to remove the unrelated content to its own page? ZaininOmega 12:20, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

• Start a new page at for example Kenshiro (hip-hop) and move the relevant material to the new article, making a note of where it came from in your edit sunmmary. - Mgm|^(talk) 12:49, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
  • Moved to Kenshiro (Musician). --Kjoonlee 13:38, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
• And I moved it to Kenshiro (musician). Make sure you watch your capitalization. Don't use them if the word doesn't require it. - Mgm|^(talk) 14:00, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

how to get smart while sitting in home

how to get smart while sitting in home —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 202.125.143.69 (talk) 12:48, 15 January 2007 (UTC).

• The only way to get smarter is by actually doing something. Sitting alone is not gonna work. Reading Wikipedia, doing puzzles and watching educational documentaries may improve your knowledge, but not your intelligence. - Mgm|^(talk) 13:05, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Search links

Pretty new to Wikipedia. Just wrote an article, but when I searched the title of it, it didn't appear, even though I think my article is the only one on that subject. What am I doing wrong?

• You're not reading the VFAQ. ;) It takes time for articles to be indexed by the search engine. - Mgm|^(talk) 13:56, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

3rr "Previous version reverted to: VersionTime"

What do I need to do to fill in the "Previous version reverted to: VersionTime" line in the 3rr Admin noticeboard? To put it another way; where do I go to find this information? SmithBlue 13:51, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

What is meant by that is the original verison of the page that the editor in question kept revering the page to. You will want to provide a link to the diff of this version, which you can find from looking in the edit history (also where you will have to look to show the evidence of four reverts). -- Natalya 13:57, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

This is at the edge of my tech know how and the instructions on the page are less than explanatory) If the editor did just edit out the offending phrase and not actually "revert" what is the appropriate info to be added in "Previous version reverted to: VersionTime"? SmithBlue 14:26, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Bar chart template

Is there a template that generates bar or pie charts? I've been unable to find anything in my searches, but this seems like a useful need. Thanks.

—  Jim Dunning  talk  : 15:30, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Ew. That would be a reeealy hard template to code. I might be able to do it, but I recall some reason about server load saying it's a bad idea, and anything I hacked up would look ugly and wouldn't show enough detail. Just upload a picture of a bar chart. -Amarkov ^blah_edits 15:33, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Could it be generated with the extended ASCII character set? .V. (talk) 16:28, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

It could probably be done with a little creative coding in a standard table. Well, a bar chart at least, not pie chart.--NMajdan•talk 16:50, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

dixie square mall

why do you keep erasing my posts ?

i am the person who has the sign from the mall , i have pictures video and witnesses to prove it .

i am not a vandal , but appearently you have a problem with posting the truth , you rather print half assed lies and stolen material .

no wonder nobody uses this shit for any real use except to laugh at it —The preceding unsigned comment was added by I have the sign (talk • contribs) 15:39, 15 January 2007 (UTC).

Because this is an encyclopedia, not a blog or MySpace. Even if you had something encyclopedic to add to the article based on your possession of the sign, it would constitute original research, which is not allowed here. Please read WP:NOT. Thanks. And BTW, I'm not the one who reverted your edits; I just try to answer questions here on the Help desk. --Tkynerd 15:45, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Add de.wikipedia article to en.wikipedia?

Is there a way I can automatically add an existing Wiki German language article of Carl Ludwig Nietzsche to an English version of the same article,which does not exist? Daytrivia 16:00, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Automatically? No, how would that work? Translation (or at least good translation) can't be done automatically. You're welcome to translate the article and add it to the English Wikipedia, though, if you like. Even if you're not a native speaker of English, you're welcome to do this and add a tag to request cleanup of the language, if you feel the need for that. --Tkynerd 16:18, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

how do i............

hey how do i make a wiki page. not on wikipedia, but sorta like the homestar wiki or the WoW wiki, except i want to make one for kingdom hearts. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Lord kame0 (talk • contribs) 17:12, 15 January 2007 (UTC).

Upload the MediaWiki software to a server. --Wooty Woot? contribs 05:29, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

Admin

How exactly do you become an admin on WikiPedia? Saintjimmy777 17:30, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

See Wikipedia:Administrators. Friday (talk) 17:32, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Pictures

isnt there a way to drag ur pictures to where u want them on the page...some easy method? i have difficulties shaping the pages so the pictures and the text are in the right spot and i get a nice balanced page design...thanks...user:benjiwolf

You are not making page layouts in Wikipedia, so that wouldn't really apply. Notice how, if you make your browser wider or smaller, or change the text size, everything moves around anyway. So don't put too much time into it, that's the nature of web page design: it isn't like paper. Notinasnaid 19:10, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Colours in Signatures

How do I add colours to my signature?Sam 18:23, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Easy enough to do if you know some wiki and html mark-up. Here's an example —

[[User:Sam ov the blue sand|<span style="padding : 1px 3px 1px 3px; border : 2px solid #BFDF9F;background: #660066 ; color: #BFDF9F">'''''Joe Schmoe'''''</span>]] <sup>[[User talk:Sam ov the blue sand|Say]]</sup>•<sub>[[Special:Contributions/Sam ov the blue sand|Do]]</sub>

That produces —

Joe Schmoe ^Say•_Do

The code attributes allow you to set font size, type and color, as well as putting background colors and borders around parts of your signature. Placing 5 tildes (~~~~~, not 4) at the end will produce the date/time stamp you want for contributions. If you want, you can go to my preferences and store the code you come up with as your signature so you don't have to copy/paste it everytime you sign something. Just remember to not use images, templates, or external links in your signature — they're not permitted.

Play with the code in a Sandbox and see what you come up with. Learn more about Wikitext markup here. Have fun being creative.

—  Jim Dunning  talk  : 20:36, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Unsure of deletion criteria

I came across Armenian phrases while editing...surely this falls under some deletion criteria, but I'm unsure of what that is. Ideas? DoomsDay349 18:54, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

I've redirected to Armenian language. Tell me if that is correct or not. DoomsDay349 18:55, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Proverb: Hay Is For Horses And Grass Is Cheaper...

Dear Wikipedia,

I've tried searching WWW for this particular proverb, "Hay is for horses and grass is cheaper."

I can't seem to find anything in regards to this saying origin or its complete content and I've been hearing my children say it a lot.

Can you tell me what does "Hay is for horses and grass is cheaper" mean and where does the saying come from?

Thank you kindly, email removed Cobh, Ireland —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.215.239.142 (talk) 19:18, 15 January 2007 (UTC).

You'd probably want to ask this on the Reference desk. The Help desk is for questions about Wikipedia itself. -- Kesh 23:10, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

We use this saying in Texas. "Hay is for Horses but Grass is Cheaper" It's used to politely let someone know not to address you by saying "hey!"' (which is considered rude in some parts of Texas).

Palm

Is there a palm version of Wikipedia?

Roselyn Feliciano

If, by palm, you mean a PDA, the answer is no. You'll have to squint a bit. Adrian M. H. 20:29, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

There is a PDA version of the Main Page, though not the whole site. 24.20.69.240 09:29, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

flagging articles

if there is a statement in an article that needs a citation how do i indicate this requirement? in this case the article on erlotinib the section on "side effects" under "rash" states: "Interestingly, some clinical studies have indicated a correlation between the severity of the skin reactions and increased survival though this has not been quantatively assessed." this has no citation listed and therefore it has little to no real value. is there a way for me to flag it as "needs citation" ? 19:54, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Look at the {{fact}} and {{cn}} tags. ~ BigrTex 20:06, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

I prefer the {{citation-needed}} tag. Although it is exactly the same thing as {{fact}} and {{cn}}, it is more gentle than the former (which I would use only for something that looked pretty dubious), and more comprehensible than the latter. It has the advantage of having the exact words an editor might be looking for. Notinasnaid 20:12, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

if you come across statements about living figures that you feel need sources - don't tag them, delete them. Best to have little or no information rather than unsourced crap. --Larry laptop 20:43, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

putting a {{POV}} without explanation

What should I do if somebody puts a {{POV}} on top of the page without giving any explanation in the discussion page? Should I see that as vandalism and revert?

• Check to see if there's a reason in the page's history and see if you can find a reason yourself. If neither helps, feel free to remove it. - Mgm|^(talk) 23:55, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Uploading artice/Formats

I am creating an article in Microsoft Word, but Wikipedia won't let me upoad it as Web, Text or Word (Doc) formats. How may I upload it? Thanks Dr Robert Lewy —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Kingseason (talk • contribs) 21:41, 15 January 2007 (UTC).

what article is it you wish to create ? --Larry laptop 21:49, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

You can highlight all the text, right click, and choose copy, then right click in the edit window of your article and choose paste. You might find these pages helpful: Wikipedia:Tutorial, Wikipedia:Article development and Wikipedia:Manual of Style. Be sure your article meets notability and verifiability criteria or it may be deleted. Let me know on my talk page if you have any questions or want to discuss anything.. delldot | talk 22:25, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Editing Germaine Greer

Hello, I am not sure if it is a caching problem at my end but on the page on Germaine Greer there is a rather offensive sentence in the Recent Section.

I went in to edit and couldnt find the html to remove the setence. So I went back to the main page, hit refresh and I could still see it.

Can someone more familiar with editing the wikipedia site check that it is really gone?

Many thanks AA —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 148.182.25.4 (talk) 23:03, 15 January 2007 (UTC).

I think the negative info has been removed. Thank you. Xiner (talk, email) 23:39, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

WAP or Mobile Phone Access?

I'd like to know if there is a Mobile (or Wireless) access point? for a user to be able to access it through a mobile phone or such things like that?

Thanks —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.207.89.159 (talk) 23:08, 15 January 2007 (UTC).

• See WP:WAP. - Mgm|^(talk) 23:53, 15 January 2007 (UTC)