Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2019 December 22

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December 22

Creating a WikiProject

I would like to start a WikiProject that helps younger editors become productive editors. I believe that younger editors are an important part of Wikipedia because they can do great things for the project. However, some potential young editors get blocked for various reasons. The reason why I am proposing this is because I feel that younger editors are often overlooked when it comes to editing Wikipedia. We need to be sure that they can understand the way Wikipedia works. I would like other editors to help me start this WikiProject because a WikiProject is not just the work of one person. It's a group of editors working together for a goal. My question is how do I start a WikiProject? Please ping me in your reply. Interstellarity (talk) 00:31, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

​See Wikipedia:WikiProject_Council/Guide#Creating_a_WikiProject, you just start a proposal and if enough people support it, it can be created. They do recommend creating a taskforce under an already existing project when possible, in this case you could start a sub-project under WikiProject Editor Retention. – Thjarkur (talk) 01:48, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

@Thjarkur: This must be handled carefully. I general, it's a bad idea to ask younger editors to identify themselves by age. -Arch dude (talk) 02:22, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

True, many do identify as "young" though without specifying it further. I do quite like Interstellarity's goal here, perhaps this could be achieved by reviving the adopt-a-user program and directing young editors there without directly mentioning age. – Thjarkur (talk) 04:28, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

@Þjarkur: I have created Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Proposals/Editor Retention/Younger Editors. Can you please make sure that I did this correctly? Interstellarity (talk) 13:11, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

​You don't need to propose it there if it's only a sub-project, instead you can just draft a sub-page of WP:WikiProject Editor Retention and get the opinion of the people at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Editor Retention. – Thjarkur (talk) 13:17, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

@Þjarkur: I'm not sure how to draft a subpage on this WikiProject, but I did leave a message on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Editor Retention to get some help with this. How long will it take before I get a response? Interstellarity (talk) 13:23, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

Citing a source where the original video is missing but is backed up on youtube

Moved to Wikipedia:Teahouse § Citing a source where the original video is missing but is backed up on youtube

 – Duplicate thread – Thjarkur (talk) 01:59, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

What is this? Unintentional visit to Tajik Wikipedia site.

I received an email at my personal email address. It came from wiki@wikimedia.org as the sender. The subject line says: SamakBot‬ left you a message on Википедиа. It stated that I have a message on Wikipedia. I went to my Talk Page. There was no message. I went back to the email. I clicked where it said "View Message". And it brought me to this page: [1]. Does anyone know what this is all about? I have no idea. Needless to say, it's in some foreign language that I don't understand. And I can't think of any activity that I did on the "normal" (English) Wikipedia that would have led to this ...? Thanks. Joseph A. Spadaro (talk) 05:45, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

@Joseph A. Spadaro: I just got one of those too. Perhaps the bot is welcoming every single user. Suffusion of Yellow (talk) 05:55, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

But, if you want to (partly or fully) disable e-mail notifications on all wikis, visit Special:GlobalPreferences#mw-prefsection-echo. Suffusion of Yellow (talk) 06:05, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

The language is Tajik and the site is tg.wikipedia.org. Both of your global logs show that you've visited that site and thus autocreated an account previously (JAS on 13 Dec 2017, SoY on 8 Nov 2019); the bot is probably sending a welcome message to every account-holder there to remind them that tg-wiki still exists. ‑ Iridescent 08:18, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

Thanks. How strange and odd. Why would I ever visit a "Tajik" Wikipedia, that I never even heard of? Is there some type of "normal activity" on this English Wikipedia, that might somehow "transport" me over to that strange "Tajik" Wikipedia site? I can't think of any reason that I would deliberately or intentionally visit such an unfamiliar site. Thanks. Joseph A. Spadaro (talk) 15:11, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

​If you're like me then you will have clicked on it in the interwiki language sidebar, reasons being: interest for other unfamiliar languages, checking out interwiki links before nominating for deletion, or mis-clicking. Way too many of them send every visitor automatic messages... – Thjarkur (talk) 15:29, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

I also got one and my account there was created in 2015. I don't like when wikis send automatic welcome messages so users who have no edits and didn't originally create an account there. PrimeHunter (talk) 19:46, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

And I. While I have never knowingly contributed at tg.wiki, my Special:Contributions page there makes it look like I have. I'm pretty sure those 'contributions' are the result of someone else importing those pages from en.wiki. That suggests that Editor Joseph A. Spadaro's 'contribution' to tg.wiki was also an import because it matches this en.wiki edit. Perhaps for Editor PrimeHunter as well: tg:Вижа:Ҳиссагузориҳо/PrimeHunter.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 20:08, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

Thanks, all. Makes sense. Thank you. Joseph A. Spadaro (talk) 16:42, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

@Joseph A. Spadaro: Apparently you have contributed to Tadjik Wikipedia - by creating tg:Template:Age as of date/doc. --CiaPan (talk) 20:11, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

That page was imported (oddly, by upload) on 16 Aug 2015. I, however, have no imported edits on that wiki, so I have no idea why the bot welcomed me. Suffusion of Yellow (talk) 20:19, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

That's an artefact of MediaWiki, not an actual contribution; when material is copied from one WMF wiki to another, the edit history is also copied across for copyright purposes (your edits are copyright to you and licenced to the WMF, not owned by the WMF). If you check your global contributions you'll find all kinds of edits made by you to languages you didn't even know existed. It looks like the bot has been on a spree of adding "welcome" messages to every account's talkpage which in turn has triggered email alerts; this would be forbidden on en-wiki but I've no idea what their policy is there. ‑ Iridescent 20:28, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

@Joseph A. Spadaro: You are probably right that you have never visited tgwiki before. tg:Special:Logs/Joseph A. Spadaro claims you created the account 13 December 2017. That's the date an automated process created thousands of tgwiki accounts within nine minutes for users who had edits imported in the past without having an account there. The same happened for other wikis during a few days. It was discussed at Wikipedia:Village pump (technical)/Archive 162#Edits (rather than the text of edits) being imported into Wikipedias of other languages. The user creation log falsily shows the user as the performer. tg:Special:Logs/Trappist the monk was one minute earlier. tg:Special:Logs/PrimeHunter really was me visiting the wiki in 2015 but the log looks exactly the same as the false logs. It's possible for MediaWiki to give another account as account creator, e.g. my main account [2] for my alternative accounts which have empty user creation logs as performer [3][4] because I was deliberately logged in as PrimeHunter when I created the accounts. I think a bot with an explanatory username should have been credited for the account creations in December 2017. There must also be many retired or deceased users who suddenly got log entries. PrimeHunter (talk) 21:58, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

Thanks, all. Very helpful. Joseph A. Spadaro (talk) 07:22, 27 December 2019 (UTC)

Resolved

George Kennedy

Why in the world would you delete my post about George Kennedy? I was his best friend for many years and married to his daughter for 10 years. I feel the public should know the truth. He had no daughter named Betty and his daughter Shannon and his adopted daughter Taylor as well as his love for his grandchildren should be mentioned. He moved to Eagle Idaho because myself and his daughter Shannon moved here. That is why he moved here to be closer to his family. How dare Wikipedia or anyone for that matter not show how he was passionate about his family. I sure hope you do not remove the latest post I placed....Any issues? Then contact me. His daughter Shannon and grand kids wold be appalled by this not being on their grandfathers page.

Dan Landis — Preceding unsigned comment added by Daniel Landis (talk • contribs) 06:12, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

@Daniel Landis: Did you cite a professionally-published mainstream academic or journalistic source that supported a neutral claim, letting the page history handle any credit for your contributions? Or did you post hagiography while bragging about yourself in the article? Gosh, it's almost like we're an encyclopedia and not a social media site or something. Ian.thomson (talk) 06:30, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

(edit conflict) @Daniel Landis: Hello, your 'post' was removed for several reasons. Firstly, it was unencyclopedic, (I.e. not written in an appropriate style or tone). It was misplaced in the Kennedy article and contained no references – Wikipedia reports upon what has been written about a subject in independent reliable sources and cannot accept uncorroborated information from persons claiming or stating a connection with the subject. In relation to that point, please see WP:COI and make any necessary declarations. Wikipedia is not a form of social media where connected persons can add content expressing an opinion; sourcing of the information and the opportunity for the reader to verify the information are absolutely crucial to the project. The Various social media sites are more suited to that purpose. In case you would like to contribute further to the overall project, some important information will be left at your talk page. Thank you. Eagleash (talk) 06:36, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

I've removed the alleged adopted daughter/actress Betty Kennedy, as she is unsourced. Clarityfiend (talk) 09:53, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

Deleted article

East Bengal the Real Power this article was deleted last month. Is it possible to get a copy of the article, so that it can be modified and make it suitable to re-publish? I asked the admin who deleted it, but I didnt get any reply...  S A H A  07:09, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

@Arnabsaha2212: In all honesty, re-writing that draft to be good enough to publish is just going to be more work than writing it from scratch. The actual text was promotional and contained copyright violations. Most of the sources were not reliable, except for maybe this one, this one, and maybe this one.

See User:Ian.thomson/Howto for a much surer way to get an article published. You just need to find another source like the ones I just shared and summarize them. Ian.thomson (talk) 07:20, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

@Ian.thomson: my exams are going on, thats why I am not getting enough time. If I get the previous one, it will be easy for me to atleast chalk out the main points. and I will use reliable sources.  S A H A  10:08, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

@Arnabsaha2212: The approach you're trying to go would require you to:

1) Re-write the parts that violate copyright (entire sections).

2) Re-write the parts that are promotional (most of the article).

3) Replace unreliable sources where possible (most of the sources).

4) Remove unreliable sources when no reliable replacements can be found.

5) Find another reliable source to confirm notability because after you remove the unreliable sources the article will not have enough to establish notability.

The approach I'm suggesting is:

1) Find at least one more reliable source (maybe this one or this one)

2) Summarize that source and these, two.

1) Summarize these four sources: [5], [6], [7], [8]

The old version is only going to get in your way and cause trouble. Ian.thomson (talk) 11:26, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

@Ian.thomson: OK. thanks for helping :)  S A H A  12:55, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

Watchlist

Where do I ask a question about the content of the watchlist as it is currently displayed? Jmar67 (talk) 09:20, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

Jmar67, I would imagine that the Wikipedia:Village pump (technical) would be suitable. ~~ OxonAlex - talk 10:48, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

Thank you. Jmar67 (talk) 12:21, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

Transferring templates from this project to another project and where I can learn coding in this site

Hi, so I dont know where to ask this question but will ask it here. In the past few months I was trying to build a new Wikimedia project (it is still in the incubator) but I needed to have the templates there like the infoboxes and other stuff which are here. How can I transfer them to there? Would that be copyright violation? Also if I want to learn how to code in this site, where should I start learning? I am new in the internet and I learned few information about how to code in PHP (I have created telegram bots using that language and that's it).--SharabSalam (talk) 09:35, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

​You just copy the enwiki templates over to aynwiki one by one. You write in the edit summary either "Copying from enwiki" or a more detailed "Copying the contents of [[:en:Template:Example]]. See that page for attribution history.". If you mention where the material is from (preferably with a link to the original page) it's not a copyright violation. You can also use Special:Export to import the entire edit history but that's not really necessary (dewiki prefers that method).
Regarding coding, what functionality are you interested in adding? If it's userscripts, I'd recommend Googling "jquery tutorial". If it's Wikipedia templates, you just slowly learn it by imitating existing templates and trying to glue together the explanations in mw:ParserFunctions or mw:Extension:Scribunto/Lua reference manual.
– Thjarkur (talk) 12:46, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

Þjarkur, I want to learn both the userscripts and the templates. Thank you so much for this informative answer!--SharabSalam (talk) 13:06, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

​Since you need to localize your templates, it might be easier to copy the infobox templates from the Arabic Wikipedia (switching infoboxes to right-to-left is rather time consuming). I'd recommend looking into copying what the Spanish Wikipedia does (I don't know who else does it) where the infoboxes pull in information from Wikidata. It's time consuming to set up, but might be worth it for getting a new project going. – Thjarkur (talk) 13:14, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

Þjarkur, that is a great idea. There is a Wikidata infobox here Template:Wikidata Infobox which I can learn from how to import Wikidata information to an infobox. I think Arabic Wikipedia uses the same method as the Spanish Wikipedia. I have seen articles with infoboxes that pulls the data from Wikidata. I will see what I can do tomorrow. Thank you so much for your help.--SharabSalam (talk) 13:35, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

List defined references

Hi, I'm looking for the bot that can be used to automatically remove errors that arise from when references are removed from articles that use list defined references. Thanks. Onetwothreeip (talk) 11:48, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

I think you're looking for AnomieBOT. —[AlanM1(talk)]— 12:25, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

AlanM1 AnomieBOT doesn't perform this task unfortunately. Are there any others? Onetwothreeip (talk) 03:16, 23 December 2019 (UTC)

I do that by hand, just by searching the page. When I have created articles using LDR, I have kept them alphabetized, which makes it even easier to deal with them. -- BullRangifer (talk) 05:10, 23 December 2019 (UTC)

Unfortunately there's too many to reasonably expect this to be done manually. Onetwothreeip (talk) 05:31, 23 December 2019 (UTC)

Onetwothreeip, where is the article? -- BullRangifer (talk) 06:47, 23 December 2019 (UTC)

I think I found it: Timeline of American-led intervention in the Syrian Civil War. That's a 30 minute job. Go for it. -- BullRangifer (talk) 06:55, 23 December 2019 (UTC)

 Done @Onetwothreeip and BullRangifer: I moved the 226 unused refs to the end and HTML-commented them out. Feel free to remove them entirely if not needed. The unused refs were mostly in big groups, so it was reasonably fast by hand. It shouldn't come up much (should it?) or I'd probably write some code to do it next time (import refs into a list, import list of unused ref errors, remove those refs from list, export list). —[AlanM1(talk)]— 10:22, 23 December 2019 (UTC)

This is really good, thank you for your contribution. Unfortunately my background is more in writing than in things like programming. I would strongly encourage you to write some program for this, if that wouldn't be too burdensome and if you think it would be worth your time, since this would greatly assist in the splitting of articles that use this style of references. In particular, my main concern was the American-led intervention in the Syrian Civil War article, although I'm glad the timeline article has now been fixed as well. Onetwothreeip (talk) 23:09, 23 December 2019 (UTC)

Bet lynch

I'm quite dissapointed the bet lynch page was returned as there are rumours that she will make a final return to coronation street. I'm not the only one to have edited the page.

Unless I can find out from Corrie that they are looking into it it should go up — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dartslady180! (talk • contribs) 16:41, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

This is about Bet Lynch. Wikipedia aims to base its articles on verifiable facts, not on "rumours and reports". Maproom (talk) 17:00, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

A tv show's title with ruby characters

I had a chat off wiki about if a tv show used ruby characters and one thinks we shouldn't use the spelling and the other does. But I don't remember that well. If this is already mentioned on a MoS? Unblue box (talk) 20:40, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

The word Furigana has this. But it's not a MoS. Do you mean what do you do when you see, 師団(バトラ)の挑戦, this spelling is Shidan no Chōsen. Are you asking that when using words like these were you confused if your using Shidan (師団) or Batora (バトラ). As I see it it's Shidan no Chōsen. Also the episode 12 from Welcome to Demon School! Iruma-kun is using this too. 2601:640:C680:2E10:8143:74A7:1F28:E107 (talk) 02:38, 23 December 2019 (UTC)

I would go and fix that. But a problem appeared to that of; fixed some word spelling and the next person says no. So there's a conflict and the person who changed it back, hasn't told their reason yet. So usually at 3 or 4 edits then its edit warring. But not really after one edit. Then there's nothing wrong with asking first. Unblue box (talk) 02:58, 23 December 2019 (UTC)

Walled garden template

Is the {{Walled garden}} template broken or am I missing something? There seems to be no usage information and it looks like the [[{{{articles}}}]] bit is supposed to list the names of the other pages in the walled garden but I can’t see how to do that as a simple piped name as a parameter does nothing (in preview). Lineslarge (talk) 20:48, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

​It's an unfinished and unused template. This would probably be unnecessary template clutter on articles in any case. – Thjarkur (talk) 21:36, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

Fair enough, thanks for checking. I was going to ask if there is a draftify process for templates, but I see you’ve already dealt with this. Good work! Lineslarge (talk) 21:59, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

Pings

If I copy and paste my barnstars to a new page, will it ping the users who gave it to me? Willbb234^Talk (please {{ping}} me in replies) 22:10, 22 December 2019 (UTC)

@Willbb234: One of the requirements for pinging is that the edit contains your own signature. Copying text with an old signature can be enough to cause pings but if you make sure there are no own signatures then you are fine. PrimeHunter (talk) 22:30, 22 December 2019 (UTC)