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This page is an Archive of the discussions from Mariah Carey talk page (Discussion page). (August 2008 - September 2009) - Please Do not edit!

STOP MESSING UP HER AGE! I HAVE SOURCES.

She was born in 1970. FIX IT! I went to Amazon and found a couple of books. If you don't believe me, click on the "Click to LOOK INSIDE".

http://www.amazon.com/Mariah-Carey-Real-Life-Reader-Biography/dp/1883845513

Singer Mariah Carey was born March 27, 1970, on Long Island, New York. (page 5)

http://www.amazon.com/Mariah-Carey-Revisited-Unauthorized-Biography/dp/0312195125

Then, in the fall of 1969, Patricia discovered she was pregnant again. And on March 27, 1970, Mariah Carey was born. (page 8)

http://www.amazon.com/Mariah-Carey-Marc-Shapiro/dp/1550224441/ref=pd_sim_b_2

On March 27, 1970, Mariah Carey was born. (page 18)

Now fix it. She's 39. It's a shame that you guys are reporting her age incorrectly, on this site that's supposed to be accurate, just because you "can't find sources", yet you can use an INACCURATE source. ~Christopher

best-selling female pop artist of the millennium does not exist!!!!!!!!

Stop reporting fake facts, the only mention was in the MONACO TOURIST BOARD WEBSITE and the WMA GOT THEM TO REMOVE IT. Ask the WMA, shje received a legend Award in 2000 (given for clout, not sales) and a chippendale Diamond (100m copies sold) many other artists have received them!!!!!!!!! STOP LYING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The editor is a Mariah fan (his own profile says so) and wrote the WMA article too... FUNNY how he doesn't put the WMA website in the links!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! AND avoids any source for the alleged 2000 millemnuium award!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.104.87.45 (talk) 03:49, 28 July 2009 (UTC)

Plus, the WMA are not an official chart... And they always have the same artists...

[1] —Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.104.87.45 (talk) 03:55, 28 July 2009 (UTC)

Age

Listen, you people who are insisting she is 40 are foolish. Her birth date - ever since she's been on the scene throughout the 90s and 2000s - has been known as March 27, 1970. The only reason for the recent confusion is the fact that the media has been pushing the fact that Carey is nearing 40 - and it's rude, crude, merciless and crass to do that to a woman - for the last few years now. She will be 40 in March 2010. She is 39 now. March 27, 1970 was never in dispute for a long time for a reason. The below poster is right, too - Carey's mother, Patricia, has said herself that her daughter was born in the year 1970.

She's 39, not 40! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.196.128.11 (talk) 16:29, 6 April 2009 (UTC)

She's 40 years old. not 39. I got this from http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001014/ and many other websites. An easy way to get one is just to google Mariah carey Age. There's even media stating how she's NOT liking the idea of being 40, and she wants to stay in her 30's forever. Medicca (talk) 02:15, 13 June 2009 (UTC)

She's 39. If she was born on March 27, 1970 she would be 39. Do the math it's not that difficult! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 222.154.104.110 (talk) 10:01, 8 July 2009 (UTC)

Another source that says she is actually born in 1970 is a statement made by her mother, Patricia when she appeared with Mariah on an Oprah episode which discussed multiracial people. I think her mother would know.

Then GET a source! Mariah Carey - Obsessed & Jordin Sparks - Battlefield (talk) 02:13, 21 July 2009 (UTC)

This is madness, she has even said its the 40th aniversary of her 12th birthday because shes always been 12, Wiki is providing obsessed and deluded mariah carey fans incorrect information who then have complete bitch fits when told they are wrong.

—Preceding unsigned comment was left by someone at sometime.

The website source currently used in the article to support 1970 seems to me pretty weak, given the discrepancy among sources. I personally don't care if she's 39, 40, 50, or 57, but for anyone who wants follow this up and provide some reliable sources... Mariah Carey Biography - People.com gives her DOB as March 27, 1969. In 2006, NNDB changed the birth year on their Mariah Carey profile from 1970 to 1969, explaining:

Also given as 1970, but according to People magazine she was actually born in 1969. In response to fan inquiries about the correct date, a spokesperson of the magazine issued a statement, "we have a copy of Ms. Carey's driver's license, which lists her birthday as March 27, 1969. Furthermore, we spoke with the administrators at the high school she attended who confirmed that Ms. Carey's birthday is March 27, 1969, as did her management when we made our initial interview."

Now, I don't have Carey's or Obama's birth certificate, but a quickie free Radaris search yields a record preview which could be hers and could be based on reliable data, that lists an age of 39. So, I don't know. — RVJ (talk) 12:45, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

Public records state her age as 39. There is no record as far as I could see of a Mariah Carey who is 40 years old, and all listings for a Mariah Carey state 39. As far as I am concerned, it is 1970. --24.46.21.197 (talk) 19:48, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

Race Again

However, it's a little strange, because she seems white and not mixed-race as Alicia Keys, Leona Lewis, Rihanna... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.196.30.146 (talk) 23:26, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

Well she's not. PhoenixPrince (talk) 23:16, 3 April 2009 (UTC)

Well what your failing to tell him PhoenixPrince is that unlike Rihanna or alicia keys who are half black(50%)(one of there parents are black)Mariah Carey is one quarter black(25%)black,bc her dad is half black half venezuelan,and her moms white,so her dads half and her moms white making her a quarter black unlike beyonce who is half black.so when you think about it,she is mostly white. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Theoldknight89 (talk • contribs) 05:20, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

Actually her dad is half Afro-Venezuelan and half Afro-American, either way racially he would be classified as "black" or "black hispanic". Lucy2006 (talk) 11:26, 3 June 2009 (UTC)

But doesn't Carey consider herself to be black? In that case, shouldn't the article reflect her wishes? Darkfrog24 (talk) 13:45, 13 June 2009 (UTC)

Does she ? Didn't she used to deny her black parentage ? -- Beardo (talk) 10:15, 16 July 2009 (UTC)

Hey, yeah, Beyonce is 100% black. Just thought I'd mention that. Browncoat101 (talk) 07:57, 26 December 2009 (UTC)

Race

No one ever seems to get it right. *sigh*

Mariah's father was black AND Venezuelan (not a black Venezuelan). Mariah's paternal great grandmother, Margarita Nunez, was Venezuelan. Mariah is not certain of the race of her great grandfather Carey but he had red hair and was possibly part Caucasian (which would mean Mariah could have white blood from both parents). The black comes in later when their son Roberto came to America and married a black woman named Addie (Mariah's grandmother).

So Mariah is between 1/8 and 1/4 Venezuelan, 1/4 black, and half white (possibly more).

It's funny, I have a friend who is white and hispanic, the father of her child is black, and her daughter (whom she named Mariah) came out with blonde hair, very similar facial features to Mariah Carey, and the same alabaster skin tone as well. It's just a matter of which genes are dominant and it's not always the ones you'd think!

To the person who said Beyonce was full black, her mother is creole so that's not true. She has a significant amount of French ancestry.

Xxjennybellaxx (talk) 13:31, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

Carey's Co-Writing

Please keep opinions out on Mariah not really co-writing her music. Yes, there are a couple cited lawsuits, but they are a very small percentage of the hundreds of songs that she has written and co-written. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Wcwnwo17 (talk • contribs) 20:23, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

I agree. I don't know why people keep saying she doesn't co-write her music. In her latest album "Memoirs..." she wrote "It's A Wrap" by herself. She's written Heartbreaker by herself, with the exception of the elements of another song. twinqletwinqle (talk) 05:07, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

Elvis' Record

STOP adding in that some statician still credits Elvis with 18 number 1 singles. ADD THAT TO HIS ARTICLE. It is irrelevant, as Billboard Magazine is the FINAL and ONLY say. Keep opinions out, even if you can cite them. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Wcwnwo20 (talk • contribs) 18:00, 7 December 2008 (UTC)

Voice Section

It is IRRELEVANT to post here that she does not show "emotion" in her songs. Even if you believe that true, and can cite some magazine that shares the same opinion, this section is strictly to be about her voice. Emotion within her songs have nothing to do with actual voice. Keep opinions OUT.

This is an Encyclopedia, not an Opinion Article

1. I removed the little commentaries in parenthesis about how Mariah really isn't the 1st female to occupy both the number 1 and number 2 spots on Billboard. The article is fine as is, and talking about how Alicia Keys was featured on a number 2 song has nothing to do with Mariah. If readers want additional information on Keys, they can look at her article.
2. I also removed the parenthesis about how Mariah really hasn't beat Elvis' record for number 1 singles according to some guy who wrote an article as to why. It's really irrelevant what others think, because Billboard is the final and OFFICIAL say. If people want to argue back and forth, whatever.. but it's Billboard who decides. That's also why the article puts "according to billboard" and not "according to Joe Shmo".
3. Even though most ASSUME that the single "Loverboy" only went number 2 because of a price cut, that cannot be proved. Mariah has dedicated fans, and upon the release of the physical single, the fans all purchased the single. We cannot know if they only bought it because of a price cut.

Reminder that this is not a forum per WP:FORUM

1. Discussion forums. Please try to stay on the task of creating an encyclopedia. You can chat with folks about Wikipedia-related topics on their user talk pages, and should resolve problems with articles on the relevant talk pages, but please do not take discussion into articles. Also, bear in mind that talk pages exist for the purpose of discussing how to improve articles; they are not mere general discussion pages about the subject of the article, nor are they a helpdesk for obtaining instructions or technical assistance. If you wish to ask a specific question on a topic, Wikipedia has a Reference Desk, and questions should be asked there rather than on talk pages. Wikipedians who wish to hold casual discussions with fellow Wikipedians can use the IRC channels, such as #wikipedia. Note that this is an IRC channel, not a message board. There are also a number of early-stage projects that attempt to use a wiki for discussion and debate.
2. Journalism. Wikipedia should not offer first-hand news reports on breaking stories. Wikipedia is not a primary source. However, our sister project Wikinews does exactly that, and is intended to be a primary source. Wikipedia does have many encyclopedia articles on topics of historical significance that are currently in the news, and can be updated with recent verified information.

Any posts or discussions which do not contribute to improving the prose or quality of this article can and will be deleted per Wikipedia:FORUM#Wikipedia_is_not_a_publisher_of_original_thought and Wikipedia:SOAP#Wikipedia_is_not_a_soapbox. The Bookkeeper (of the Occult) 00:15, 11 August 2008 (UTC)

Intergrate

I think the "Acting career" and "Philanthropy and other activities" sections need to be intergrated into the biography. A more recent FA article, Michael Jackson, might be a wise moddle to follow. - Realist² 02:54, 14 August 2008 (UTC)

2005-Present section needs updating and cleanup

Firstly,

Carey's singles have, collectively, topped the charts for seventy-nine weeks, which places her just behind Presley, who topped the combined charts for eighty weeks.[85] Carey has also had notable success on international charts, though not to the same degree as her native America. Thus far, she has had two number-one singles in Britain, two in Australia, and six in Canada. Her highest-charting single in Japan peaked at number two.[86][87][88]

Has little to do with that time period, it's a sum up of her career so should be in the legacy section or something.

Secondly, more info on her new album needs adding. First week sales, current total sales and info on the singles after "Touch my body". — Realist² 03:13, 14 August 2008 (UTC)

Mariah is an alto! She said so herself

Stop changing Mariah's vocie type to soprano. She ahs stated herself that she is AN ALTO! Here is one link: http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,317869,00.html Here is another: http://www.mariahdaily.com/infozone/magazines/1998/vibe/index.shtml —Preceding unsigned comment added by 5 octaves (talk • contribs) 03:37, 13 September 2008 (UTC)

I got sources stating she's a soprano. Yes, she can sing alto, but she can hit the 5 octave (B2-G#7)-(E3-C6) notes of a full soprano. http://209.85.165.104/search?q=cache:vSZ-Cbu9fEMJ:www.musicnotes.com/sheetmusic/mtd.asp%3Fppn%3DMN0054121+Mariah+Carey+full+soprano&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=7&gl=us&client=firefox-a Tribal44 (talk) 18:16, 29 September 2008 (UTC)Tribal44

A music sheet is not proof that Carey is a soprano. It merely shows that her song can be sang (as demonstrated in the sheet) as a chorus using one alto voice and two soprano voices. As said by Carey herself, she is NATURALLY an alto who can utilize the higher parts of her range to exceed that.119.94.0.187 (talk) 06:59, 2 October 2008 (UTC)Ed

Change of Name

{{editsemiprotected}}

Her name should be Mariah Carey Cannon since she's married to Nick Cannon now... (Medicca (talk) 08:21, 15 September 2008 (UTC))

There is no indication that she has choosen to legally change her name. In addition, her being married to Cannon is irrelevant since she is known as Mariah Carey. Even if we had a verifiable source indicating she has legally changed her name, we wouldn't necessarily adjust article because of it. See Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style_(biographies)#Maiden_names. The Bookkeeper (of the Occult) 08:50, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

 Not done Per Bookkeeperoftheoccult.--Aervanath lives in the Orphanage 18:48, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

Perhaps she`s a soprano sfogato - these are alto voices who really like to sing soprano - wartch soprano sfogato here at wikipedia. Also her larynx looks big - that also shows, that shes got a deep voice - real high sopranos have got a small laynx. And also her speaking voice sounds very deep. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.218.218.214 (talk) 11:39, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

Date of Birth

you have Mariah as being born in 1970 but IMDB has the year as 1969. 190.58.202.122 (talk) 13:12, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

---

She was born March 27, 1969 in Huntington, New York.

Can we find a solution for this matter? Reidlos (talk) 19:05, 4 April 2009 (UTC)

no. mariah's birthdate is CONFIRMED to be March 27, 1970. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dnaeducated (talk • contribs) 02:53, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

We've found a solution for this a long time ago. Most reliable sources confirm her birth year to 1970 not 1969. See the archive section for more information. 76.217.33.177 (talk) 03:32, 8 April 2009 (UTC)

Imdb is just wrong...

Diva

{{editsemiprotected}} I think we should have a part in this article about Mariah's divarish behaviour as she is known as the "Diva Queen" so this should be a part of the article of MC, for example we could have a list of things she's requests when staying in a hotel room or something such as her request for her to have someone to dispose of her chewing gum.

Wikipedia is not a tabloid. The Bookkeeper (of the Occult) 01:28, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

Rumored Pregnancy

I heard that Mariah Carey cancelled an appearance on Oprah because she's pregnant (although Oprah herself denied this).http://www.mtv.co.uk/channel/mtvuk/news/448311-mariah-carey-pregnant-with-nick-cannons-child Crackthewhip775 (talk) 20:25, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

We don't report rumors unless its creates a serious/dramatic impact on the individuals total biography. The Bookkeeper (of the Occult) 01:30, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

World Hunger Ambassador

Mariah has been recently named World Hunger Ambassador of From Hunger to Hope (source: http://www.fromhungertohope.com/ambassador/default.asp). She is providing a free download of her song, "Love Story," for everyone who donates. Please include this in the section, "Philanthropy". 119.94.0.187 (talk) 06:30, 29 September 2008 (UTC) Ed

She can't possibly be an alto

According to the book of "Idiot's guide to singing," Mariah Carey is known to be a Soprano singer, not an alto. An alto is someone considered for chorus or choral music with no particular significance for voice type or voice timbre. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Waraujo20 (talk • contribs) 17:37, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

this is not true. to find a true contralto is much more difficult than to find a soprano! real altos are very rare and they have a beautiful rich and soulful voice.--93.146.217.139 (talk) 14:59, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

My point exactly. Tribal44 (talk) 17:43, 30 September 2008 (UTC)Tribal44

The Alto article is broadly in agreement with you, but it also says that it has a meaning in common usage quite separately. Clearly Carey doesn't sing choral music, so we should interpret her use as meaning the "common usage". However, this is all academic, our interpretation is not relevant. Unless there's a good solid cite from a reputable source, and preferable an authoritative one, there is no reason to over-ride what Carey has said herself. --Escape Orbit ^(Talk) 18:04, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

I don't think any source, regardless of how "reputable" it is, can override the existing one. Carey, a singer who writes her own music, says she is an alto with a five octave vocal range. End of story. It's Carey's voice; she's been singing with it for 40 years. She should know her own vocal fach. Orane (talk) 05:28, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

Correction- its not responsible to take anything an artist says at face value. They aren't considered a neutral party when it comes to the subject of themselves in certain cases. For classification, its better to use a reputable source and then if Carey contradicts that classification, then mention her contradiction in the appropriate section of the article. The Bookkeeper (of the Occult) 00:02, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

Perhaps she`s a soprano sfogato - these are alto voices who really like to sing soprano - watch soprano sfogato here at wikipedia: By definition, the soprano sfogato was linked to the contralto. She possessed a dark timbre with a rich and strong low register as well as the high notes of a soprano and occasionally a coloratura soprano. Those voices were typically large, dramatic and agile, supported by an excellent bel canto technique and an ability to sing in the soprano tessitura as well as in the contralto tessitura with great ease.

Also her larynx looks big - that also shows, that shes got a deep voice - real high sopranos have got a small laynx. And also her speaking voice sounds very deep.

To Triball44

I am not arguing this one, nor will I even try to. You seem like an experienced teacher. I just didn't know that she could be an alto. That is just so strange. Oh well, I didn't mean to be a nuisance. (waraujo20) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Waraujo20 (talk • contribs) 15:45, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

Thats ok :} I understand you wanted to prove your point. No hard feelings :} Tribal44 (talk) 17:13, 2 October 2008 (UTC)Tribal44

Push

I don't know if this is relevant, but just an FYI... The movie that Carey is supposed to star in is based on the novel of the same name by Sapphire. There isn't a Wikipedia page on the novel, but it does appear in the disambiguation page. Here are more details on the novel: http://litmed.med.nyu.edu/Annotation?action=view&annid=1049 It should be noted that this film is different from the other Push (2009 film), starring Dakota Fanning.119.94.0.187 (talk) 09:18, 3 October 2008 (UTC)Ed

The best way to deal with seemed to be to create a new article: Push (film based on the novel by Sapphire).--Larrybob (talk) 01:21, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

Article has been renamed Push (2009 drama film).--Larrybob (talk) 06:54, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

Corrections on Tennessee

Carey plays an aspiring singer (not a waitress) who meets two brothers on a journey in search of their father when she flees from her husband. Please see Tennessee (film).119.94.0.187 (talk) 09:32, 3 October 2008 (UTC)Ed

pd —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.240.176.3 (talk) 16:19, 9 October 2008 (UTC)

• • • Actually, she plays Krystal, a waitress who also is an aspiring singer.*** —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.172.203.77 (talk) 01:48, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

Childhood

Her childhood and youth section needs to be added again. I'm not sure why this page has been unlocked seeing as it's a featured article but is now susceptible to vandalism and unneccesary editing. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.161.169.184 (talk) 15:28, 26 October 2008 (UTC)

It appears that 158.143.240.29 found the information useless and took the liberty of removing it all and no one noticed. I've restored the sections and made another request for protection. Pinkadelica ^{Say it...} 21:38, 26 October 2008 (UTC)

Five Octave Vocal Range

It should be noted somewhere in the article that she does not have a Five octave vocal range - this is frankly humanly impossible. At the moment, the article brushes the fact, saying that the Claims to have a five octave vocal range, but noting nothing else about it - someone has obviously just taken the phrase "She has a five octave vocal range" and tacked a "She claims to have" onto it. Sorry to the fans who belive that nonsense, but if she had a five octave vocal range, she'd be able to go from as high as she can sing now all the way down past Tay Zonday. 80.6.147.110 (talk) 08:00, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

That is a ctually VERY possible. Her lowest note is a G#2 and her highest is a G#7. Mariah has a VERY LOW range also. This is why]Italic text she said she si an alto. There are many videos on youtube showing this. Eigh octaves may be impossible, but not five.5 octaves (talk) 01:15, 9 November 2008 (UTC)

This is not true, boy. a g#2 is naturally impossible for her voice. her LIVE lowest note is a c3.--93.146.217.121 (talk) 13:12, 10 November 2008 (UTC)

Watch this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s0aH_DCsHcg —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.31.185.69 (talk) 14:49, 17 November 2008 (UTC)

And so? this is a video on you tube. her lowest note is MAYBE a C3, more probably a D3.--93.151.245.5 (talk) 16:00, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e7nXIwGjWMI shes goes incredibly low in that song. she does have five octaves. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.146.37.249 (talk) 16:40, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

No way range should be counted as CONTINUOUS AND CONFIDENT COVERAGE OF ALL NOTES. Mariah has about 1.5 + 3 or 4 falsetto notes, the lowest notes are not sung butt recitato and vbreathless, not confident at all. Plus, she never managed them live (no, even in concerts she mimes the high notes, you can see it from the way she bends her neck backwards- tyo go high you need to project in your head and keep a straight l;line from your lungs to your ears...) In fact, when she can't cheat (sorry) like at live 8, or at the MJ funeral-concert, or the dIVAS, where other artists are around, that is, she s PAINFUL. Any singer can tell you that she is miming with the high notes, no trained singer can ever hit high notes usibending backwards, look at eline Dione, Aretha FRanklin, Barbarah Streisand, Pavarotti, Michael Jackson, James Brown, Freddie mercury, Mariah Callas, Mina Mazzini and Anna Oxa... all straight necks whebn they go high, Mariah uses her nhands to 'show' she's going high, and bends backwards, anmd never manages when she doesn't have her team behind... Plus, even if she had 5 octaves, she just hits notes, she can't actually sing well. Singing is mesured by range, emotion, glide, projection, breath and flexibility. She can't glide, has little emotion, her projection is weak and discontinued, she can't keep a note for more than a few seconds and can only sing ballads.... She scores under a GCSE in all!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.104.87.45 (talk) 03:21, 28 July 2009 (UTC)

PLUS, she has too short a neck to have five octaves...any singer knows that the longer the neck the wider the range, just feel your thyroid moving along your neck hen you mdo the scales.... The range starts at the bottom of the neck and ends between your ears... Ironically, Madonna at Live 8 hit a much higher note, and wonderfully strong and projected llive at live 8 thn Mariah, and in the Divas, Mariah has the smallest range of all, smaller than hania, and no wherenear comparable to old Aretha's.

yeah but those performances refer to the time when she already was in decline

Mariah between 85?(weakness of the body)-96 could hit all those notes with emotion without effort could glide easy between them and we should mention that to, but we shouldn't deny the fact her voice has gone through the shitter now and she struggles harder than before. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.21.60.224 (talk) 17:31, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

Voice type

sorry but saying that she's alto/soprano isn't correct. actually it has no sense. if her voice naturally is a contralto, she can't be a soprano! it means that she has a deep speaking voice! --93.146.217.139 (talk) 14:57, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

The first mention of "alto" is in the infobox, where it is slashed with "soprano", giving cite (3) after alto - it is summarising the section which next mentions the word, where you find that in context - she identifies as "an alto with a five-octave range" (using cite 3 also), the next piece of data is that she has "a range wide enough to cover all the octaves between an alto and a soprano"... and "her vocal trademark is her ability to sing in the whistle register".--Alf ^melmac 20:02, 20 November 2008 (UTC)

yes but you can't say that her voice type is Alto/Soprano. this has no sense at all.--93.151.245.5 (talk) 16:01, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

Let's not forget that alto and soprano terms actually refer to trained opera voices and have little to do with modern music standards.

She is what she is and that's a freak of nature, her vocal cords are very unique as stated in one interview that her doctor uses het throat photo's for his lectures.

She has nodules since she was little(stated herself)wich permitted her voice to be so big, but as time went by they restricted her voice and she should have them removed but it could cost her her whistle register part of her voice and that's why she doesn't do it, she said it herself in interviews but i haven't got time to look them up try mariahdaily.com —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.21.60.224 (talk) 18:11, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

Recording artist

I disagree with the over generalization that Mariah Carey is a "recording artist", and it is unsuitable for use as the lead sentence. That term is too vague and ambiguous. Who is a recording artist? Someone who is a singer-songwriter, or someone who sings other people's songs? How would we know in a case like this? Is a "recording artist" automatically a music video director? What genre does a recording artist sing? The poorly sourced article about "recording artist" states that they also conduct music. Does Carey conduct music too? Is a reader, who knows nothing about the subject, automatically supposed to consider these things? Whitney Houston is also a recording artist. Does she do the exact same thing that Mariah does?

The defense that the info box compensates for these things is unacceptable. An infobox summarizes information that is supposed to appear in the article, and the last thing it's supposed to do is to explain or expand vague generalizations in the intro.

The fact remains that the guideline and the convention for lead section in music articles is to include who the person is and the things that he/she does. If it's not broken, don't fix it. Orane (talk) 06:22, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

Mariah Carey is a recording artist, she's paid by a record label to release music. Generalization is exactly what the lead of any article is supposed to entail. WP:LEAD: The lead section should briefly summarize the most important points covered in an article in such a way that it can stand on its own as a concise version of the article... In general, specialized terminology should be avoided in an introduction. using the info box to list any and all occupations she may have been labeled over the course of her career is perfectly acceptable since that is the purpose it serves. The LEAD is meant to summarize the entire article, not the other way around. The Bookkeeper (of the Occult) 09:20, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

Well, my argument would be that "American pop-R&B singer-songwriter, record producer, music video director and actress" is too detailed and "recording artist" possibly to vague. Something along the lines of what Michael Jackson has would be more appropriate "recording artist, entertainer, and businessman". He has done a bit of everything (see his info box, BTW he directs videos too, so I need to add that :-)). Other details like genre, music video stuff could come further down the lead. Personally, the long list of job titles looks a little fan crufty, unintentional as it is. I think a middle ground would be suitable, nothing too detailed, nothing to vague. — Realist² 12:44, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

You also have to keep in mind what the person is notable for. MJ is not notable for being a video director, the general public would not know he has done that. Same for Carey, her notability is her singing and to a lessor extent acting. "Recording artist" covers all non-notable aspect of her music career. The Bookkeeper (of the Occult) 22:26, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

So basically, you introduce this broad concept into the article(s), and you're telling us what we should get from the term "recording artist". You can't tell that it covers all bases, because I don't think it does. She is just as notable for being a songwriter and music producer, and these terms are not inherently identifiable in "recording artist". But you know what, I don't have the strength to engage in a long circular discussion on such a trivial topic. I've done that too many times in the last few weeks here....Orane (talk) 23:33, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

The term "recording artist" has been circulating in the English language for quite some time, so its not as if I personally created a broad concept. Secondly, I disagree she is equally as notable for being a songwriter or a record producer-she isn't. In fact, no artist who writes or produces will ever be equally recognized for being writers/producers if their notability is centered specifically around their singing. As Realist2 pointed out, shoving every career move the individual has ever made into the opening sentence is WP:FANCRUFT. The lead is meant to be a brief introduction to the individual, not excessively detailed. The Bookkeeper (of the Occult) 05:52, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

A recording artist is anyone who vocalizes or plays and instrument on a recording that is released (CD, vinyl, cassette, 8-track, whatever) regardless of the genre, and as long as the person's skill is prominent in the recording. It doesn't matter if the person writes songs or not, so long as their vocals or skills are prominent. The person may be singing, rapping, playing an instrument, or talking (as in the case of comedian albums). Producers, record executives, songwriters, etc are not recording artists unless they have also met the above criteria. So that means, for example, Bruce Springsteen (rock singer), Luther Vandross (R&B singer), Richard Pryor (comedian), and Kenny G (saxophonist who has released recordings of his work) are all recording artists. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.192.176.30 (talk) 00:07, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Mariah's influence

I think that Mariah should have a section which highlights her influence on todays music. I believe that she plays a key role in the business and there are many singers out there who cited Mariah as their main influence or inspiration. This section is included in many other artists pages, so I think that Mariah definitely deserves one. --Skye 0913 (talk) 23:01, 30 December 2008 (UTC)

I agree, I'll start compiling some sources. PhoenixPrince (talk) 23:06, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

I think that if your are making a section on Mariah legacy then this should be included that in the remix to Poppin' by Chris Brown, which features Juelz Santana and Lil' Wayne(?), Juelz raps I leave you on a higher note/Then when Mariah Carey hit her highest note. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.80.138.106 (talk) 04:34, 20 January 2009 (UTC)

This is gonna make this article look like a fanpage. Just leave it as it is. Dswhite85 (talk) 03:35, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

It doesnt necessarily have to be an article about, say, "people praising Mariah Carey". Its just that there are dozens upon dozens of young stars who have take after her. We could possibly add this to the "Artistry" or "Musical Style" section to make it blend in. If Beyonce and Cher are able to have an "influence" section, then Mariah deserves one also...just sayin' ;) --99.235.133.218 (talk) 16:38, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

I really can't see who Mariah has influenced. She was influenced by Whitney Houston as evident on her first few albums when she released more quality music. Then she herself switched to a more teenage-youthful driven style of music in the late 1990s to keep up with Britney Spears, Christina Aguilera, Beyonce, Justin Timberlake (N'Sync), and the Backstreet Boys, whom were already doing their thing. And being sexual in music videos and out in public was already done by Madonna since the 1980s, so I don't see who she influenced. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.192.176.30 (talk) 00:16, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

"Alto"

What is this term that pop singers describe themselves as? Is it a "mezzo soprano"? If it is, then the voice is set at a high range anyway. Anne-Sophie von Otter, Christa Ludwig, Cecilia Bartoli and Edith Mathis are all mezzo sopranos. All can sing very high sustained notes, if reqiired. I do not think that Mariah's voice is soprano, an example is Edda Moser or Joan Sutherland.

• Here is a clip of Edith Mathis (mezzo soprano) singing: play

• Here is an example of Edda Moser (soprano). Could Mariah do this?: play

• Here are some really high examples: play

Wallie (talk) 08:52, 15 January 2009 (UTC)

Most weeks at number one

Mariah Carey is now the lead artist in Billboards history with the most weeks at number one. They have recently revamped there rules so more then 7 of Elvis's singles are no longer credited as hot 100 number ones. PhoenixPrince (talk) 07:52, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

Why can't she be an Alto/Soprano

If Anita Baker's profile can say she's a Contralto & a Soprano why can't Mariahs? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.80.138.106 (talk) 23:57, 7 February 2009 (UTC)

200 million albums

In the beginning of the article it says: To date,Mariah Carey has sold over 200 million albums worldwide.

But the source for it is this website, which is an dead end, so I think we should remove it. Reidlos (talk) 12:17, 9 February 2009 (UTC)

I've removed it. Balto9902 doesn't appear to be sure of the exact URL either. I've looked, but the website is unhelpfully structured and I can't find what might be the proper URL for the page, if indeed it exists. Based on other recent edits, I ask if he/she would please spend some time reading;

• how to cite
• Wikipedia guidelines on reliable sources
• the feedback other editors have put on his/her talk page

before continuing to add information about Carey to articles. This would save everyone time and effort and prevent things becoming an edit war. --Escape Orbit ^(Talk) 14:32, 9 February 2009 (UTC)

• http://www.sonymusic.com/artists/MariahCarey/

That site contains a PRESS RELEASE for her CD, THE BALLADS. "Mariah Carey has sold over 200 million albums worldwide. She made her recording debut in 1990 with Columbia records, becoming the first recording artist to have her first five singles top the U.S. Billboard Hot 100 chart."

All you have to do is scroll down Wcwnwo20 (talk) 07:16, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

PURELY FANCRUFT!

The line she has sold more than 200 million albums is a total hoax! This claim has come from her fan website, obviously. Just in May 2008 on American Idol, Ryan Seacrest announced she has sold 160 million albums worldwide and who would ever believe she has sold 40 million albums more since then. In just a span of 9 months, that’s really hard to believe when her recent album E=MC2 barely sold 2 million copies worldwide? Do we have any RELIABLE sources to prove this? No claims from her recording company or fan websites, pls!

One more thing, who changed the line “she is the THIRD best-selling female recording artist in the U.S” to “one of the best-selling female?” It should be put back in the original phrase since this rule should be applied to all American recording artists (e.g., Barbra being the first, Madonna being the 2nd, Whitney being the 4th, Britney the 8th, Janet the 11th). We should be fair to every artist and not make Wikipedia seem like a cheap fan website. Ikabod08 (talk) 02:32, 14 February 2009 (UTC)

Her web companies source is more reliable than Ryan Seacrest...He does not track record sales lol.PhoenixPrince (talk) 04:57, 14 February 2009 (UTC)

Agreed!!! She has sold AT MOST 200 million RECORDS (albums, singles, EPs, videos, DVD), but def not albums. Reidlos (talk) 13:37, 14 February 2009 (UTC)

I'm a Mariah fan myself but to say that she has sold 200 million albums worldwide is NOT factual at all. Do we have a breakdown of her worldwide sales for each album? I just think we need this article cleaned up once and for all. I know Celine Dion and Madonna each has sold 200 million albums worldwide, but we Mariah fans should not feel our idol is being left behind at all and put whatever silly things on this article. Diphosphate8 (talk) 17:11, 14 February 2009 (UTC)

The problem is, not even Dion or Madonna has sold 200m albums, but obviously the editors of these two articles feel the need to mention it (even if an offical source says it). Even if you add up album shippments for countries with the biggest sales rates, it doesn't reach the 200m albums mark.Reidlos (talk) 21:35, 14 February 2009 (UTC)

Regardless of how you all feel about whether it is possible for her to have sold 200 million RECORDS or not, that's what the source says and the source is more reliable than your personal opinions. There is nothing wrong with including that information in the article, if that's the case then we need to go and delete every single sales figure for every single artist just because it comes from a source we may not like. Sony BMG > your personal opinions. PhoenixPrince (talk) 00:56, 15 February 2009 (UTC)

It's not about being biased against Sony BMG. I for myself think that we shouldn't include info which we can't be sure about or is illogical. Reidlos (talk) 01:09, 15 February 2009 (UTC)

Record companies are more reliable than anyone else, they do kept track of what they ship. Even if they inflate sales, they would know better than anyone else, especially Ryan Seacrest like the gentleman mentioned above. All sources have some bias in them and can twist the truth. If she has not sold 200 mil records it is more than likely very close. For instance, mariah daily journal, who compile their sources from press releases and reliable articles like billboard bbc etc, have figures that equal 185.5 million. PhoenixPrince (talk) 01:16, 15 February 2009 (UTC)

Exactly! It's ok if it would say "she sold 200 million record", but it say 200 million album and according to Mariah Daily Journal (IMO they have the most right info of Carey's record sales) she has sold about 140million album. Reidlos (talk) 01:55, 15 February 2009 (UTC)

Well...yes techinically that's right...but one must assume that they include the singles and albums in the press release despite there misuse of the term. I mean consider how they generally state that Musicbox has sold 32 million albums worldwide, they generally mean the album and the singles. PhoenixPrince (talk) 05:28, 15 February 2009 (UTC)

Yeah, but you can't expect people to know that. Reidlos (talk) 06:08, 15 February 2009 (UTC)

You know what after doing a little reading I realized, that there is nothing wrong with using the term Album to describe all releases such as singles and cds. Album actually refers to the meduim, it can be either a cd or a cassete or a gramophone record whatever. It just refers to the storage type...not specifically whether it's a single or a full length cd. PhoenixPrince (talk) 20:38, 16 February 2009 (UTC)

An albums is a collection of audio tracks, which is not a single. If you say "Music Box sold 26 million albums to date" that number does not represent only CDs of that album, bur also digital albums, cassetes, vinyl etc. A single is a song from an album, that gets released for promoting reasons. Reidlos (talk) 23:12, 16 February 2009 (UTC)

According to Encarta and Webster an Album is a mudic recording. PhoenixPrince (talk) 01:51, 17 February 2009 (UTC)

I only looked it up on Wikipedia. I couldn't find entries about "albums" on Encarta etc. Could you give me the links? Thanks in advance! Regards, Reidlos (talk) 15:46, 17 February 2009 (UTC)

In the dictionary. http://encarta.msn.com/dictionary_/album.html PhoenixPrince (talk) 23:32, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

If you think they haven't reached the 200 million mark, then why should we tolerate this "junk" on Mariah's article? I bet this entry wouldn't pass being a featured article anymore too soon. I know Mariah is famous in the U.S. and Japan, but she is nobody in the rest of the world so how should you make us believe she has sold 200 million albums???

And why did you remove "she is the THIRD best-selling female artist in the U.S." line in the intro? We don't want to hide the facts here, do we? Diphosphate8 (talk) 19:19, 14 February 2009 (UTC)

If the primary source of an artist's record sales is the record company itself, wouldn't anyone stating that they don't think it's possible be considered WP:OR? There seems to be a movement here to diminish the accomplishment of this artist by any means even remotely logical. However, an encyclopedia should just represent the verifiable information. It's not WP's job to rationalize whether the information is reasonable, or even rational. Its job is to record the information as accurately as it can from as many verifiable sources as it can. Until some credible organization discredits the source, then the numbers should be in the article as they have been reported. Anti-fan speculation isn't anymore appropriate then fan speculation. — Digital Jedi Master (talk) 00:42, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

Primary Picture

I think that you should change her primary pic to a better looking Mariah. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ninawilliams (talk • contribs) 12:10, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

I agree with you. Cause she looks like Ru Paul in this picture. There must be a better looking Mariah pic. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.225.92.93 (talk) 03:28, 27 February 2009 (UTC)

Agreed. What happened to the previous picture anyway? Reidlos (talk) 19:01, 1 March 2009 (UTC)

I think that it shold be updated with a more recent photo? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jamol96 (talk • contribs) 02:06, 13 December 2009 (UTC)

Category:Americans of mixed Black African-European ethnicity

{{editsemiprotected}}

I suggest the following category be added to Carey's Wikipedia entry:

Category:Americans of mixed Black African-European ethnicity

The aforementioned category has a meager amount of articles linked to it, and Carey is one of the most well known Americans of mixed Black/African and European ancestry

Ehhviin (talk) 12:41, 5 March 2009 (UTC)

 Done. Thanks, — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 16:34, 5 March 2009 (UTC)

3rd best-selling female recording artist in the U.S.

Mariah is not just one of those best-selling female in the U.S. but she is the THIRD. Why removed this line in the intro, wherein it is stated in the entries of Barbara Streisand, Janet Jackson, Madonna, Britney Spears, Whitney Houston? We should treat this entry as the same w/ the aformentioned artists, to be FAIR. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.225.92.93 (talk) 23:27, 11 March 2009 (UTC)

I know THIS ENTRY IS PLAIN STUPID!!!! 200 million albums is different from 200 million records. Records may refer to singles or albums. I'm a fan of Mariah but some fans there keep on inserting "fansite" links that make her sales look obviously inflated. Any moderator out there that is brave enough to rectify the apparent boo-boos in this article??????? Diphosphate8 (talk) 21:16, 21 March 2009 (UTC)

Oh by the way, if you try to look at her Discography, it shows she has sold 140-150 million albums worldwide but discrepancy with this article is so so obvious! Please correct this entry on our idol, once and for all!!! Diphosphate8 (talk) 21:18, 21 March 2009 (UTC)

Well the discography isnt 100% correct, clearly the album sales are right to the full extent so you cant base it off that!

And I believe that "THIRD BEST SELLING FEMALE" is way better than just saying "one of the best selling female" in the U.S. Mariah deserves a credit for this. Diphosphate8 (talk) 21:19, 21 March 2009 (UTC)

suggestion for claims from fan websites be removed

i don't think it's appropriate for fansites to be used as sources for statements regarding sales figures and the like. They're prone to bias so aren't reliable sources. They give misleading information to readers. anyone from Wikipedia please remove this crap on her intro regarding sales based on fansites, otherwise this website would never be relied upon. one more thing, mariah's entry should be treated the same way as the other U.S. divas. thoughts? Ikabod08 (talk) 21:30, 21 March 2009 (UTC)

I agree. The problem though, is stopping other users from adding unreliable wesbites. It is almost impossible, unless there is a vote to ban fansites. Also, to others; fansites are not reputable sources to use, especially when the articles integrity is at stake. Too many references that have either false statements or inflated sales are being added. It's getting to the point of ridiculousness. Something needs to be done to keep this article within the realms of actuality.BalticPat22 (talk)Pat 23:19, 21 March 2009 (UTC)

It's disgusting how some users take control of articles and no one really does something (e.g. E=MC²). JuStar and LauraAndrade88 "own" the article E=MC² and edit/revert without any control. Stupid lambs! (Sry for that, it's just so frustrating at times...). Regards, Reidlos (talk) 01:46, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

Taking control of articles cannot be tolerated. If users revert and delete neccessary or reliable information to suite their personal taste or opinion, I will call them out on their judegement and revert their edits. There is a discussion forum on here for a reason, people. BalticPat22Pat 03:45, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

But the big problem is this entry on Mariah Carey has become more of a FAN WEBSITE already! It is no longer a credible nor reliable source. I am a fan of her but I know what a fact is and I know when it needs to be neutral. But other fans keep on inserting links from her fansites that claim she has sold this and that and that she is the best-selling female... but God, can we believe a crappy award show, such as World Music Awards? When did this award show ever become reliable? LOL! Anyways, hope this intro is fixed soon. Diphosphate8 (talk) 04:24, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

No vote is needed to ban fan websites. They are not reliable sources, so if anyone has issue with facts they are supporting they are within their rights to remove them. Besides that, it seems to me that the facts disputed are very difficult to prove and tend to revolve around pointless bragging. The article and cites makes it quite clear that Carey is a very successful artist. Is her position on some kind of music league table that significant? --Escape Orbit ^(Talk) 13:42, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

Escape, no one is doubting Mariah Carey's unprecedented success. The problem is that users are adding websites that are not only questionable, but give an overly biased viewpoint that isn't visible in any other reputable source. Websites like MariahDaily.com and others as well as statements that give no source at all are the ones that need to be changed. People must be reminded that Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a gossip site. Standards need to be enforced, or else the credibility of this article will cease to exist. I think something needs to be done about these users adding fan websites, most of which aren't even registered. BalticPat22Pat 16:14, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

So enforce them. I personally don't care about Mariah Carey (her articles are on my watchlist because I do care about chart vandalism in general), but if you make changes and flag them as due to unreliable sourcing in your edit summary, I'll help make sure they stick if I agree that the sourcing was dodgy.—Kww(talk) 16:30, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

I think you misunderstood what I was saying. What I mean is that the article doesn't need the cites that make various unverifiable claims about millions of sales, or compares those sales with other artists. The point is made is that she is very successful. Little else needs to be added, and particularly not from dubious sources. I think these kind of facts are exactly the kind of fan-mania you'd expect from fan-sites. For them it's not enough that Carey be recognised as very successful; she has to be the most successful, ever, and if the facts aren't hand that prove that, they'll produce some. --Escape Orbit ^(Talk) 23:01, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

So are we gonna allow this OBVIOUS MESS to exist in this article? This is nuts and it's so apparent that some lambs (I am an absolute lamb too) there are putting this crappy fan website link just to suit them and put claims that she is the blah blah blah! Correct this once and for all, pls! It's not 200 million albums but it's records (albums and singles combined), just an FYI! Refer to her discography with links to justify how much she has really sold worldwide. And she is the THIRD best-selling female, not just one of those best-selling in the US. Ikabod08 (talk) 23:28, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

2009 Filmography updates

Hi! :) Just thought I'd let you know that "Precious" does have a release date set;if you check the Wiki article on this movie, it's November 6th,2009. Also, "Tennessee" will not be released until later this year; no date has been given yet. --Freespirit1981 (talk) 18:31, 28 March 2009 (UTC)

We have a new release date for Tennessee! According to Mariah Daily Journal, it's June 5th,2009! [[2]] --Freespirit1981 (talk) 18:29, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

Changed it! Reidlos (talk) 22:17, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

Impact/Influence

I think the "Artistry" section should have a subsection named Influence or Impact.

• Her mastery of melisma, the fluttering strings of notes that decorate songs like "Vision of Love," inspired the entire American Idol vocal school, for better or worse, and virtually every other female R&B singer since the Nineties. But technical skill alone doesn't make for hits, and Carey's radiant, sweetly sexy presence has been knocking them out of the park for two decades. She's scored more Number One singles than any solo artist — 18 and counting.[3]

• Influenced: Brandy, Christina Aguilera, Leona Lewis[4]

Christina Aguilera

• It's nü-Mariah on mood stabilizers, extended with pseudo-pastiches of semi-popular songs. Carey on, my wayward daughter.[...]And then comes "Beautiful," the kind of ballad Mariah made back when she was a natural.[5]

• It looks like a Mariah Carey album, it sounds like a Mariah Carey album. Bloody hell, it is a Mariah Carey album. More specifically Christina Aguilera's premature mature album sounds like the hip-hop infused 'Rainbow' which famously bought Mariah clubland credibility at the expense of her sanity.[6]

Leona Lewis

• Rightly impressed by Lewis' multi-octave voice -- reminiscent of a warmer, earthbound Mariah Carey -- Cowell continued his mentorship [...] Then again, this was also true of Mariah Carey on her 1990 debut, which Spirit greatly resembles in how the handful of R&B-oriented songs camouflages how this is almost entirely a stuffy middle-of-the-road pop record. Not only that, but Spirit is so old-fashioned it sounds as if it could have been released in 1990 and compete with Carey's debut for the top of the charts; her first single, "Bleeding Love," opens with a crawling organ that recalls the muted gospel of "Vision of Love," even if the skin-crawling lyric "you cut me open and I keep bleeding love" wouldn't have suited the Top 40 in 1990.[7]

• If all goes according to Cowell's plan, however, Lewis's career trajectory will be a little more like Mariah Carey's. Not only does Lewis share with Carey a multiracial heritage, but she's also got the voice—albeit, one with a slightly less impressive range and timbre.[8]

• With that track, she manages to dovetail classic '90s Mariah-isms with a sleek, Timbaland-style modernity.[9]

• Moments after performing her breakout hit, “Bleeding Love,” on “The Oprah Winfrey Show” last month, the British R&B singer Leona Lewis fielded a question from the admiring host. “Obviously everybody compares you to, you know, all the greats,” Ms. Winfrey said, citing Mariah Carey and Whitney Houston. [...] So what if she sounds like a second-tier Mariah on “Forgive Me,” a shuffle produced by Akon? As Ms. Carey keeps reminding us, that isn’t the worst thing in the world.[10]

• The next Mariah Carey, high-pitched squealing and all, is what she's going for, and what for the most part she gets.[11]

Kelly Clarkson

• This debut has her trilling like Mariah Carey on fluffy R&B tunes. [Q Magazine; Oct 2003, p.103]

We really do NEED to put a Legacy section in the article. Here are some people who have cited Mariah as an influence or the media have compared them to her: Christina Aguilera (Said she idolzed MC as a kid), Britney Spears (said WH and MC have been big influences on her), Beyonce (First time she heard VOL, she knew she had to sing), Mary J. Blige (Big inspiration to her, sang LTT at a club, which got her a record deal), Carrie Underwood (said that Shania Twain & MC have influenced her music), Leona Lewis (obviously), Brandy (included in Mariahs "influenced" section in Rolling Stones 100 Best singers), Ashanti, Kelly Clarkson & Jessica Simpson. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.235.133.218 (talk) 22:39, 7 May 2009 (UTC)

Most of those quotes that you gave don't neccessarily talk about Mariah as a musical influence, per say. They just mention the artists in comparison to Mariah's vocals; which many authors and critics do for a number of different artists. It's not like Mariah is the only artist to compare everyone to.

Also, just because you say all these singers cite Mariah as a musical influence, doesn't mean it's actually true. We need reputable verification from sources and not just hearsay from someone who says that x, y, or z singers have been influenced by Mariah. BalticPat22Pat 20:17, 13 May 2009 (UTC)

I got all these names from reading articles. That was just a guideline for anyone who wants to look up the actual quotes. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.235.133.218 (talk) 15:48, 17 May 2009 (UTC)

GOT SOME! Okay here: Beyonce-http://www.newyorker.com/archive/2006/04/03/060403crmu_music Rihanna-http://www.artistdirect.com/nad/news/article/0,,3655378,00.html Mary J. Blige-http://popdirt.com/mary-j-blige-credits-mariah-carey-as-her-musical-inspiration/45169/ Britney Spears-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iuGLKh3uVoA Christina Aguilera-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OgYacj5AS6g Leona Lewis-http://www.teenhollywood.com/printerversion.asp?r=172655

...I know that some are videos, but still, I hope I helped guys! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Skye 0913 (talk • contribs) 20:50, 29 May 2009 (UTC)

Don't ignore the fan website request be removed!!!

Why is the campaign against putting unverifiable claims from fan websites be removed being totally ignored here? Calling Wikipedia administrators! Could you clean up the so obvious MESS in this entry. Somebody should do his/her job here, really. Ikabod08 (talk) 19:16, 4 April 2009 (UTC)

Maybe because "the campaign" consists of screaming claims followed by lots of exclamation marks, rather than any real explanation about what's wrong and suggestions about what can be done to fix it. --Escape Orbit ^(Talk) 21:54, 4 April 2009 (UTC)

Or maybe you haven't read what was being discussed over the past month. Please scroll up to read about campaign to delete unverifiable claims coming from Mariah's fan websites -- inflating album sales (e.g., 200 million albums, instead of the verified "200 million records (albums and singles combined)"; one of the best-selling female instead of the verified "third best-selling female in the U.S." This entry should be treated the same way it does to other U.S. recording artists. It has simply become a fankruft. Ikabod08 (talk) 23:11, 4 April 2009 (UTC)

The discussion above is equally unhelpful, as it contains the same unspecific claims. I can only see one mention of 200 million albums on the article, and that is cited from Sony Music, who ought to know. Please identify exactly which parts you wish to contest and exactly what is wrong with the cite.

Wikipedia content also isn't determined by 'campaign', but by consensus. --Escape Orbit ^(Talk) 15:36, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

I guess what Ikabod was trying to point out is that albums should have been rephrased w/ records and that Mariah is the third best-selling female recording artist in the America, as it used to show in this entry. I dunno why changed it all of a sudden. One moderator just changed it to "one of the best-selling female" which is absurd, when Mariah deserves more credit than that. I checked the RIAA website and she is, indeed, the third best selling among female artists. And just to be fair to all female US artists, their ranking in the RIAA standing are mentioned in their entries (e.g., Barbra Streisand being the 1st, Madonna being the 2nd, Whitney the 4th, Janet the 11th, Britney the 8th). The thing is why not specify what Mariah's ranking is -- the third female best-seller in the U.S.? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.225.92.93 (talk) 18:53, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

Calling Wiki moderators. Hope the suggestion here won't fall on deaf ears. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.225.92.93 (talk) 02:05, 17 April 2009 (UTC)

Incorrect quote

The Voice section includes a misquote in its first sentence as 'which many other mezzo sopranos can also achieve' is not part of the original and is likely to be vandalisim. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.157.92.171 (talk) 01:00, 14 April 2009 (UTC)

Mariah was born 27th March 1969, it was everywhere that she recentley celebrated her 40th birthday.... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 60.242.69.208 (talk) 10:45, 14 April 2009 (UTC)

Yup I read some articles from reliable sources stating "Mariah has celebrated her 40th birthday" and some pics of a birthday cake showing 40th birthday indeed. But knowing some Mariah fans who control this entry, I doubt if they will rectify this mistake from 1970 to 1969. They even would not want to state she's the THIRD BEST-SELLING FEMALE in the U.S. here. This entry has become more of a fanwebsite, really. We're certainly hiding FACTS, in favor of what the Lambs would just want to see and hear. Me and my 2 cents.

Years Active

Since she sang back up for Brenda K. Starr since 1987, shouldnt we change her "years active" to 1987-present? Ive noticed that on Whitney, Aretha, Celine's wiki page, they put the earliest year possible that the person has been active somehow in the music industry. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.235.133.218 (talk) 20:53, 21 April 2009 (UTC)

You should put 1985 then cuz weakness of the body( you know the infamous song mariah sung as demo for someone,((even if she doesn't sing the song(((she does:p))) she still does te backing vocals)))was recorded at her being 15 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.21.60.224 (talk) 23:39, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

Picture!

The picture is horrible,she looks tired sad and its a dull photo,surely we can put one,even from the same evening,but a nice one,one where shes at least smiling and looks good —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.84.118.134 (talk) 05:35, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

Might I suggest this one? It's hi-res, but hopefully you Wikipedia admins can slim down pics. Here's the url: http://www.music.com/artist-images/artist/P%20%20%20%2062404/Mariah_bio_image.jpg Thanks. Hopefully Wikipedia reconsiders. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.120.75.198 (talk) 05:56, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

Pictures for living people have to be free. It's all in Wikipedia's image policy, but basically, the only way to get a better picture if is someone takes a better picture and either uploads it here (and waives their copyright to it) or uploads it to a site that allows it to be used "free"ly (like flickr). Promotional/news/"official" images generally aren't allowed here, unfortunately. 06:14, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

Jeez! Mariah definitely looks like the tranvestite Ru Paul in this picture. Please change it once and for all! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.225.92.93 (talk) 19:57, 10 May 2009 (UTC)

• Hi, thanks for the comments. I restored what had been the lead previously, taken at a good angle and with what was then her headline-making engagement ring (we were one of the first to have a photo of that). Because of our strict adherence to free content that you, or anyone, can reproduce without our permission, and even alter, we can not use copyrighted material. That is why you see some relatively poor shots on some articles (not this one). If any fan has the opportunity to take a better head shot, by all means let us know and we will help you upload it under a free use license.

Several series of head shots were taken at the 2008 Tribeca festival. Below is a gallery of them, with "A" being the usual lead.

• 
  A
• 
  B
• 
  C
• 
  D
• 
  E

I'm unsure why "D" was chosen; perhaps because it shows a little more boob? Anyway, that's the story behind the lead images. -->David Shankbone 13:29, 13 May 2009 (UTC)

We need a new picture! The current one is horrible, she looks tired and looks like she just isn't there mentally. The picture I had up is more current. and compliments her MUCH more. Te picture is VIA Getty Images where they share pictures FOR free. Not sure why that isn't able to be used. If I upload it VIA Flickr then could we use it?

No. Please read comments on the image you uploaded. The image is copyright and not free to use on Wikipedia under its licensing. --Escape Orbit ^(Talk) 22:43, 17 May 2009 (UTC)

Equal weight on RIAA and Soudscan

I just noticed ONE obvious thing here. Wouldn't it be fair to state what Mariah's standing is in RIAA, being the third-best selling female recording artist vs. her standing in Soundscan era where it should also be noted that Soundscan only took into existence in late 1991. It has just gone worse and worse and worse that we tend to forget that Wikipedia is not a fan website. Help Wikipedia moderators. Ikabod08 (talk) 00:33, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

Associated Acts (WTF?)

Whoever edited this needs to learn to use Google or something. It says: Associated acts: The Dream, Whitney Houston, Boyz to Men, Snoop Dogg, Bone Thugs and Harmony, Jermaine Dupri

When it should look more like: The-Dream, Whitney Houston, Boyz II Men, Snoop Dogg, Bone Thugs-n-Harmony, Jermaine Dupri

EHRLT (talk) 07:17, 1 June 2009 (UTC)

She is 40 years old. This dare is in imdb.com and before week in all Germany was interview that she hate being 40 years old: MARIAH CAREY will nicht 40 sein! Mariah Carey will nicht länger 40 sein! Obwohl die Sängerin im März 40 Jahre alt wurde, will sie zurück in ihre 30er - und zwar für den Rest ihres Lebens. Man solle ihr gegenüber das "V-Wort" nicht mehr erwähnen, so Carey laut "contactmusic.com". Weiter sagte sie: "Lest meine Biografie noch mal. Diese Lügen dürfen nicht mehr verbreitet werden... Es ist nur eine Zahl, aber ich sehe nicht, warum Frauen das erfüllen sollten, was von einer 40-jährigen erwartet wird - was immer das ist."

Mariah is 40 years old

Please correct Mariah's real age and she was born in the year of 1969. People magazine, along w/ numerous newspapers and tabloids had featured articles on her recent 40th birthday and a picture showing a cake w/ 40 years old candles on it. Why can't you correct this one? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.136.228.193 (talk) 03:12, 30 June 2009 (UTC) IMDB has her listed as being born in 1969. They updated also after many sources showed her birthdate being 1969. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.51.80.147 (talk) 16:16, 8 November 2009 (UTC)

Chart achievements and records

What happened to this section? Why was it deleted? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.26.188.254 (talk) 19:46, 2 July 2009 (UTC)

Age

She is 40. Just check www.imdb.com —Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.105.12.18 (talk) 21:36, 8 July 2009 (UTC)

IMDB can be edited by anyone, basically, so it can't exactly be considered a reliable source. Her age has been debated by various sources, due to an apparent discrepancy in government records or something. But Mariah stated earlier in her career that she was born in 1970, so unless someone thoroughly disputes it (via birth certificate or whatever), 1970 is more appropriate. (In other words, the singer's own words have more value than a site like imdb or people.com.) SKS (talk) 22:15, 8 July 2009 (UTC)

Too add to that (and I similarly posted in the other age section) -- Another reliable source that says she is actually born in 1970 is a clear statement made by her mother, Patricia when she appeared with Mariah on an Oprah episode which discussed multiracial people. She said "when Mariah was born in 1970..."

Unless we have cites for what Carey said "earlier in her career", or what her mother said on Oprah, the claims that she was born in 1969 are every bit as valid as those for 1970. Right now the only thing backing up 1970 is the AllMusic article, which is a good, but no better than many of those that say 1969. --Escape Orbit ^(Talk) 05:16, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

Citation: The Oprah Winfrey Show episode is titled "Mariah talks to biracial teens" and originally aired on November 9, 1999. I will try to find somewhere to download it, but I don't feel like that's necessary in order to cite my source...is it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.3.132.35 (talk) 08:11, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

Mariah is 40 years OLD in real life. She can always claim she's 39 just to make it appear she's still in her 30s. That's the reason why they called her a cougar by having a way younger hubby, almost like her son. Judging by the way she horribly dresses, it goes to show how she wants to stay young, despite her face shows she's in her 40s yet. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.136.228.193 (talk) 02:56, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

Time 100 Influental Addition

I think it is significant to add Stevie Wonder as her nominator. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jhan01 (talk • contribs) 02:41, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

INFLATED SALES

actual SHIPMENTS (sales are actually even lower)

• Mariah Carey: 13 million

• Emotions: 7.5 million

• MTV Unplugged: 6 million

• Music Box: 24 million

• Merry Christmas: 8 million

• Daydream: 19 million

• Butterfly: 8 million

• #1's: 15 million

• Rainbow: 6.5 million

• Glitter: 2 million

• Greatest hits: 2.5 million

• Charmbracelet: 2.5 million

• The Remixes: 0.5 million

• The Emancipation of Mimi: 8 million

• E=MC2: 2.5 million

• The Ballads: 0.5 million

Album shipments: 125.500.000 SHIPPED (actual sales are way less, these figures are still inflated in other words)

Single shipments stand at less than 30.000.000 copies worldwide.

Total records sold: 155.000.000 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.167.114.164 (talk • contribs)

First of all your sales are totally wrong and you have no reliable source for your claims nor for your sales figures.

• Mariah Carey-sold 18M-WIKI says 15M(thats the only source we could find)

• Emotions-sold 12M-WIKI says 10M(thats the only source we could find)

• MTV Unplugged-sold 10M-WIKI says 7M(thats the only source we could find)

• Music Box-sold 32M-WIKI says 28M(thats the only source we could find)

• Merry Christmas-sold 16M w/singles-WIKI says 12 (actual albums)

• Daydream-sold 30M-WIKI says 22-25M(thats the only source we could find)

• Butterfly-sold 17M-WIKI says 15.5M(thats the only source we could find)

• #1s-sold 20M-WIKI says 17.5M(thats the only source we could find)

• Rainbow-sold 12M-WIKI says 10M(thats the only source we could find)

• Glitter-sold 4M-WIKI says 3.5M(thats the only source we could find)

• Greatest Hits-sold 5M-WIKI says 4M(thats the only source we could find)

• Charmbracelet-sold 5M-WIKI says 5M

• The Remixes-sold 1M+-WIKI says 1M

• The Emancipation Of Mimi-sold 13.5M+-WIKI says 10+ as of 2006

• E=MC2-sold 3.5-4M-WIKI says 3M

• The Ballads-sold 1M-WIKI has no sales on this.

=201+ Million albums sold worldwide --Petergriffin9901 (talk) 21:48, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

  And where is your source? My Love - The Dream & Mariah Carey (talk) 18:31, 11 July 2009 (UTC)

Agreed, 125.5M albums and 30m singles. And considering she sold 53m in the US (by far her biggest market) second to Madonna (yes, sorry to mention her) whho is much bigger worldwide than Mariah (by miles)and Madonna is around 210M (allegedly, maybe 190M) albums and 150m singles.... But Island's numbers have always been bosted... They never match Mt and IFPI... And the 'Best recording singer of the millemnium' never existed, it was a Legend Award, not given for sales but for clout, other artists got it as well, just ask the WMA... or check their website. The only mention of that Millemnium award was in the MONACO TOURIST BOARD WEBSITE!!! and the WMA have had that website REMOVED from the Tourist Board Website..... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.104.87.45 (talk) 03:41, 28 July 2009 (UTC)

PLUS the 'soundscan era' bit is misleading... She ranks third after arbara Streisand and Madonna in US Certifications, end of... Why introduce a 'soundscan era' that means nothing?????????? 'era' !!!! DO ME A FAVOUR!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Picture vote

Hello everyone, it seems that there are different opinions as to which picture is best for the article. these are the two most popular pics.

Mariah Carey

Mariah Carey 2

So if everybody could express their opinion as to which they think is the best and most flattering.

Thanks--Petergriffin9901 (talk) 21:19, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

None is good. Mariah looks old and looks like Ru Paul in both of these pictures. I know she has far better pictures than these two. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.136.228.193 (talk) 23:03, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

Well these are the best two that are available for wiki use, so if you can just say which of the two you prefer, that would be great. I prefer the 1st Picture...(#1)--Petergriffin9901 (talk) 05:27, 13 July 2009 (UTC)

I prefer the second picture, without that awful hand gesture... again!!! The first picture looks so GAY!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.136.228.193 (talk) 03:13, 14 July 2009 (UTC)

Hand Gestures

Mariah has recieved alot of critizism from fans for her riduculous attention grabbing hand gestures while performing "I'll Be There" at the Michael Jackson Memorial. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.217.205.250 (talk) 15:02, 13 July 2009 (UTC)

Yeah she looks so old like in her 50s in that memorial. Pls help us improve the picture by giving us options, other than these two pics. They looks so gay and more like Ru Paul-like shots. She has far better pics than these. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.136.228.193 (talk) 00:05, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

You want better options? Go take a picture of Mariah Carey that is better than these two, and then release all rights. That's how this works. These "much better pictures" you keep talking about belong to someone, and can't be used. The pictures Petergriffin9901 provided were taken by David Shankbone, and he signed over the rights. The whole gallery of pictures available is here. The reason she looks so much better in most portraits is skillful Photoshopping, by the way. I think these are pretty close to how she really looks.—Kww(talk) 00:38, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

I can say kww that what u said is not true, these photos happen to be really bad, i can show you a hundred pictures that where in different events in the same week that she looks much better in. In all honesty onm this night she looked tired, mariahdaily has hundreds of pictures of her promoting e=mc2 in the same week on like the today show or regis and kelley which has no photoshop and she looks way hotter!!--Petergriffin9901 (talk) 01:49, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

I guess I'm thinking of the cover of Obsessed. That's Photoshopped so heavily she barely looks human anymore. Look at her hands to get a feel for how heavily warped and distorted the image is: her left hand is swollen to the size of her feat, and most of the fingers on her right hand look broken (her index especially) because of poorly done Photoshopping.—Kww(talk) 01:55, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

thats very true, because she has gone through alot of weight problems in her 30s and when shes heavy her face plums up and she looks bad, ill send you a link to a few paparazzi photos of her thin.--Petergriffin9901 (talk) 02:01, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

Thes are just some paparazzi pictures in 2008, as you can see she is gorgeous and has a great body.

http://www.mariahdaily.com/picturegallery/2008/appearances/waverly/12.jpg

http://www.mariahdaily.com/picturegallery/2008/appearances/time100/14.jpg

http://www.mariahdaily.com/picturegallery/2008/appearances/operationsmile/2.jpg

http://www.mariahdaily.com/picturegallery/2008/appearances/narita/2.jpg

http://www.mariahdaily.com/picturegallery/2008/appearances/cipriani/10.jpg

http://www.mariahdaily.com/picturegallery/2008/appearances/rtl_idol2/5.jpg

http://www.mariahdaily.com/picturegallery/2008/performances/gma/3.jpg

http://www.mariahdaily.com/picturegallery/2008/appearances/empirestate/1.jpg

maximize these photos and scroll up and down to see the whole photo.--Petergriffin9901 (talk) 02:26, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

Since its forbidden ,just open up a new internet tab and copy and paste to see the photos.--Petergriffin9901 (talk) 02:28, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

voice type

I'm not sure if you guys are aware that Alto is not actually a voice type, but rather just a designated part in choirs and thus should not be used. Although Carey has a 5 octave range, everyone has their comfortable voice range. The correct term for an alto woman as a voice type is a contralto. However, most women that sing alto in choral music are not actually contraltos, but rather mezzo-sopranos. Contralto is designated only to the lower altos whose range often dips comfortably into the range of a male tenor. Thus, it would either have to be changed to mezzo or contralto, though I am not sure which one she is because in recent years she's been singing so high all of the time.

Compare and contrast - some notable contraltos in pop music:

• Cher
• Annie Lennox
• Alicia Keys

Mezzos:

• Celine Dion

GreekStar12 (talk) 03:31, 23 July 2009 (UTC)

I don't think anyone disputes this, but alto is how she has described herself (using the word in a non-technical context). Without a recognised expert or authority saying otherwise in a reliable source, we have to go with this. --Escape Orbit ^(Talk) 10:04, 23 July 2009 (UTC)

It should be corrected noted under the "Voice" section that Mariah's voice type is alto and the reference of what some music critics say afterwards should be excluded, or at least not taking away from the fact she is an alto. This way the reader isn't led to believe that Mariah sings in a high key, when in fact she naturally sings in a low key. Whitney Houston actually tends to sing the whole duration of a song in a higher key than Mariah would sing it, but Mariah's technique is to stop while singing and hit a high note or a whistle note before going back to her lower register. This actually misleads people into thinking she sings in a high key. -Actually Whitney and Mariah can both sing in low or high registers. But it comes more naturally for Whitney to sing a song in a higher key than Mariah (but not doing whistle notes, although I did see on a few occasions from performances years ago where she did it); and it comes more naturally for Mariah to sing in a lower key. Interestingly though, Mariah, who sings in a lower key than Whitney can hit a higher note than Whitney; and Whitney, who sings in a higher key than Mariah, can hit a lower note than Mariah. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.192.176.30 (talk) 23:53, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

Sounscan sales is not 62 million albums

Please correct the figures in the intro about SOUNDSCAN WITH 62 million albums sold in the U.S. cause that figure is cited by RIAA where, accordingly, Mariah is the THIRD BIGGEST SELLING FEMALE RECORDING ARTIST. Please rectify this obvious mistake or was it intentionally done? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.136.228.193 (talk) 03:30, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

Yes, you're right! I've corrected it Bluesatellite (talk) 07:25, 11 October 2009 (UTC)

Clarification needed on fued with Em

In the section about the fued with Eminem, those comments about looking like her cousin and such are portrayed as to be in response to the Eminem song, although they were made before that. As of 8/2/09, Mariah has yet to officially respond.71.166.14.248 (talk) 05:25, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

I would also like to see someone clarify this... but for a different reason. The current wording reads as if Mariah Carey has a cousin that claims to have sex with her.

...she sings "Why are you obsessed with me...lying that you're sexing me?", while wearing a hooded sweatshirt and a goatee...

...she believes she looks like her cousin in the hooded sweatshirt and goatee.

So.... yeah. I have to admit that I have very little interest in the subject, but what's up with that? *Vendetta* _{(whois talk edits)} 06:26, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

Conflict with Eminem and Voice Section

This section should have the same wording as the section on Eminem's page. Also, shouldn't there be something about her voice deteriorating? I'm a fan, but nobody can deny that she's lost a significant amount of "the voice".

Is this section even nessacary? How is it notable?-TriiipleThreat (talk) 17:22, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

Shouldn't Eminem's new diss "Warning" be added in the conflict portion.

If you can find a reliable source stating a significant deterioration of the voice then post it, otherwise, leave the article as it is.--Petergriffin9901 (talk) 05:27, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

I'm going to go ahead a remove the section about the so called conflict with eminem. A one sided battle about an alledged affair is hardly notable nor is it encyclopedic. Mariah has never said Obsessed or Clown was directed towards Eminemn or anyone for that matter. PhoenixPrince (talk) 21:45, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

I agree with Phoenixprince, Mariah never even commented on the warning or acknowledged that obsessed was directed at him, in fact she even denied it. Even if we can pretty much guess the intentions by the song, i dont think its worthy to be mentioned in the article.--Petergriffin9901 (talk) 10:10, 31 August 2009 (UTC)

Spouses

should her spouses be added in the info box or what ever the thing is called?--Aphordonte (talk) 18:59, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Please fix 'Artistry' section: MC never settled out of court

Despite the fact that Carey is often credited with co-writing her material, she has also been accused of plagiarism on several occasions. Many of these cases were eventually settled out of court.[131][132][133]

Please correect this sentence(last sentence of the section). MC was sued and always won bc the judges dismissed the cases. MC always had proof from her date songwriting journals. MC never settled. Thanks. 64.26.98.90 (talk) 19:44, 21 September 2009 (UTC)

 Not done If you read the source (from foxnews.com), it clearly states that many of these cases were settled. SKS (talk) 19:55, 21 September 2009 (UTC)