User talk:Marchjuly/Archives/2014/December

Jackie Evancho

Hi. I notice that you are proficient in Japanese. Jackie Evancho has a Japanese article, but I suspect that it is out of date and not very complete. Do you think you could translate some (highlights at least) of her English language article into Japanese? Evancho has visited Japan on (I think) three occasions to give concerts there, including benefit concerts, and to appear on Japanese TV (some of these appearances are on YouTube). She has also performed for the Japanese royal family. She says in interviews that Tokyo is her favorite city in the world. Also, some of her albums have charted in Japan. (see Jackie Evancho discography). Thanks for any help. All the best, -- Ssilvers (talk) 21:47, 2 December 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for the message Ssilvers, but I'm not sure how much help I can be. I usually work better from Japanese to English. Also, I am actually going to try and cut back on my Wikipedia editing for a bit so not sure how much time I can devote to something like this.

Anyway, have you seen WP:Translation#Translation from English into a foreign language? There's also a list of translators at Wikipedia:Translators available#Japanese-to-English so you might find someone better able to help you there. You could also post at WT:JAPAN and ask for advice. There is also Wikipedia:Help for Non-Japanese Speakers or "The Embassy" on Japanese Wikipedia where you can post a translation request or find an English speaker with experience using Japanese Wikipedia.

FWIW, Evancho's name in Japanese is so just add the brackets to that if you post on Japanese Wikipedia and it will link to her Japanese article page, if you post on English Wikipedia then use [[ja:ジャッキー・エヴァンコ]]<nowiki>. Likewise, if you want to link to English Wikipedia page from Japanese Wikipedia, then just do <nowiki>[[en:Jackie Evancho]] and it will link there. If you already knew all that, then my bad.

Finally, I saw the post you left at ja:ノート:ジャッキー・エヴァンコ, and also saw that no one has replied so far. Japanese Wikipedia can be hit or miss like that. My impression is that it is not as active as English Wikipedia so you can wait quite a long time for replies. It also can be confusing when it comes to policy/guideline enforcement, so it can be hard to understand what's going on sometimes. - Marchjuly (talk) 01:15, 3 December 2014 (UTC)

WP:REPEATLINK

Hi. Check out WP:REPEATLINK. Once you bluelink something in the body of the article, you don't need to bluelink it again in most cases. -- Ssilvers (talk) 06:31, 3 December 2014 (UTC)

@Ssilvers: Thanks for the feedback. I am aware of "WP:REPEATLINK", but I thought it was acceptable to do so for references per "Generally, a link should appear only once in an article, but if helpful for readers, links may be repeated in infoboxes, tables, image captions, footnotes, hatnotes, and at the first occurrence after the lead." because when you click on a footnote marker, you're taken to the specific reference itself (i.e., outside the body of the article), so in a sense the reference can be viewed as a separate entity. Same thing happens when you hover your cursor over the footnote marker. FWIW, such multiple wikilinks are not flagged by User:Ucucha/duplinks as "duplicate links". Anyway, no big deal either way. If you feel the links aren't needed, then no worries on my end. Thanks again. - Marchjuly (talk) 07:22, 3 December 2014 (UTC)

I see what you mean now. I forgot multiple citations from the same source were being bundled together under a single footnote marker. It's a little different from what I typically see and is kinda hard to pick up in the editing window if you're not exactly looking for it. My bad. - Marchjuly (talk) 07:36, 3 December 2014 (UTC)

Thanks. I think it looks neater to bundle references about the same fact, per WP:BUNDLING, especially when there are more than, say, two refs. Re: Repeatlink, we don't want readers to click away from our article. Where a term or name is of interest, we link it (often in both the Lead and also the body of the article, and maybe also in a footnote) to give readers the opportunity to get more information, but we don't want to keep encouraging them to click away; they might not come back.  :-) -- Ssilvers (talk) 14:39, 3 December 2014 (UTC)

Welcomeen-ja

Hi, Marchjuly. I saw your post about Template:Welcomeen-ja at WikiProject Japan. Gramatically I think ウィキペディア･プロジェクトへの参加ありがとうございます。is OK. Of course your version is also OK. But there may be some other problems, like 満たしておりません? For that I would say "満たしていないようです". I could suggest some other things too, but I've concluded that I'm never going to be as good as native speakers at this stuff. So I thought I'd post it on a translators forum that I read. Would it be OK if they rewrote it however they liked?

Also, this is going to be posted to User pages, right? Say when an edit patroller comes across some obviously hopeless English. Just thought I should check on that before asking. Thanks. – Margin1522 (talk) 18:13, 12 December 2014 (UTC)

@Margin1522: Thanks for the message. Yes, I think the template is for posting on user pages as a welcome message. I think it can be posted by anyone who thinks it might be helpful, but I'm not sure.

I'm also still not sure about the grammar of "参加ありがとうございます". Nouns like "参加" are typically turned into verbs by adding "する", which in this case would be "参加する". In (very) polite speech, however, the prefix "ご" can be added to these noun-verbs to show respect towards the other person. When this is done, the "する" is dropped so you get the grammatically correct "ご参加", but even "ご参加ありがとうございます" might be seen as still a little weird sounding by certain native speakers. Not as weird as without the "ご", but you probably still need a form of "いただく" or "くださる" to be totally correct and polite. At least that's my understanding, and that's pretty much how I hear the "ご" + "noun" construction being used everyday. This template is attempting to use polite Japanese when referring to the other person's participation as if you are politely asking them to participate in something in the future (that is why "ありがとうございます" and not "ありがとうございました" is appropriate). In this case, the person placing the template (i.e., Wikipedia) is showing respect to the reader (or editor) by placing them in a position higher than themselves ("目上"). If I wanted to thank you for politely posting on my talk page, I could say "ご返事ありがとうございました", "ご返事いただきありがとうございした" or "ご返事いただきましてありがとうございした", but I wouldn't say "返事ありがとうございました". The meaning would be understood for sure, but it literally wouldn't feel right phrasing it that way. As for "満たしておりません", the way of thinking is the exact opposite. The person placing the template is humbling themselves before the reader by using the humble version of the verb "いる". Wikipedia is essentially saying "Unfortunately, we regret to say that you edit does not satisfy our humble standards" which is why I think "おりません" is OK.

Anyway, I too am not a native speaker and my post was just meant to get feedback from others. I believe that WP:BOLD also applies to templates, but it might be a good idea to post on the template's talk page before changing it just as a way of making sure. I'm not sure how changing the wording of a template affects stuff. - Marchjuly (talk) 23:06, 12 December 2014 (UTC)

Note: I think we should move this to WT:JAPAN#Template:Welcomeen-ja to keep all discussion related to this in the same place to make it easier for others to comment and follow.- Marchjuly (talk)

Oh, I see. So they didn't specifically ask to have it improved. In that case maybe we shouldn't try to make it perfect. That way when the user gets it, they can think "My English may not be very good, but their Japanese isn't so great either." :) About the missing words, yes, they are missing, but you do often see this kind of expression online. I've quit worrying about whether these things are verbs or nouns. They just are what they are and you're supposed to be able to deal with it. About the おりません, I would say that belongs together with 満たして, which is theirs, so you want to be careful with the おりません. – Margin1522 (talk) 17:56, 13 December 2014 (UTC)

@Margin1522: Thanks for another reply. Nobody asked me to improve the template; I just came across it by accident and felt the the Japanese being used could be improved. I'm not sure what "missing words" you're referring to, but I was simply referring to the the grammatical construction "ご" + "noun-verb", which is used in polite Japanese. If I want to turn the noun "参加" into a verb, I can added "する" and conjugate it like any other "する" verb. If I want to say "Please join in (participate)", I could say "参加してください", but not really "参加ください". The meaning would be understood, but grammatically it is incorrect; It would be like saying "Participation please" in English. Same thinking applies for "ありがとうございます": the meaning of "参加ありがとうございます" is understood, but it's not really grammatically correct.On the other hand, "ご参加ください", which is a little politer than "参加してください", is used a lot depending upon the situation, but even then many people add a form of "いただく" or "くださる" before the "ありがとうございます" to make it less rough sounding. Regarding　"おる" as in "ておる" is the humble form of "いる", so "満たしておりません" is the humble way of saying "満たしていません", which is why I think it is OK as used in the template. Anyway, thanks for the comments. As you say, the meaning of the template is understand as it is currently written so there's no pressing need to change it. - Marchjuly (talk) 11:24, 14 December 2014 (UTC)

Robert S. Nelsen Wiki page

Hi Marchjuly,

Thank you for taking the time to share your expertise in fixing the page I had created for Robert S. Nelsen. I have made several changes as suggested by you. Can you please review it one more time and let me know if you can now remove the banner that shows up on top of it. This is the direct link to the page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_S._Nelsen

Thank you TrueBRONC (talk) 22:36, 16 December 2014 (UTC)

@TrueBRONC: Thank you for the message. No one is really an "expert" when it comes to Wikipedia, some of us have just been around a little longer than others and are a little more familiar with how things work. Those maintenance templates are just meant as guides to point out possible problems with an article. Any editor can pretty much add a template whenever they feel doing so is warranted and any editor can remove a template whenever they feel the relevant problem has been corrected. I do suggest that you leave either an edit sum or even better a talk page post explaining your reasoning whenever you decide to remove a template because it makes it easier for others to follow and helps reduce the chance of another editor mistaking your edit for vandalism.

FWIW, I didn't add either of the two remaining templates: The {{orphan}} template was added by Ijon with this edit and the {{overlinked}} template was added by Randykitty with this edit. The {{Cleanup-bare URLs}} template that I did add with this edit was removed here by another editor who fixed the problem. The article is still an orphan because there are no other Wikipedia articles linking to it (See Special:WhatLinksHere/Robert S. Nelsen), so I don't suggest removing that template. As for the overlinked issue, it would probably be best to ask "Randykitty" directly if you want to know why the template was added. For a more general review, you can ask at WP:TEAHOUSE, WP:ACAD, WP:UNI, or WP:PR.

Finally, I have noticed from you contribution history that you have been pretty much only editing articles related to "UTPA" such as Robert S. Nelsen, Havidan Rodriguez, and the university's page itself. There's nothing wrong with this per se, but it does make it seem like you are only here for a single-purpose. SPA's are sometimes viewed suspiciously because of the possibility that a conflict of interest may exist. In addition, your username "TrueBRONC" includes the nickname for UTPA which might also cause some other editors to become suspicious. So, if you are connected in any way to the subjects of the any of the articles you have been editing, then I suggest that you read WP:PSCOI, WP:COS and WP:COIADVICE just to familiarize yourself with Wikipedia's policy and guidelines on the matter. Please understand that I am not accusing you of doing anything improper; I am just trying to give you some additional information that you may find helpful. - Marchjuly (talk) 01:17, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

December 2014

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Slednecks and sockpuppets

Thanks for your efforts at Slednecks. I just thought I'd let you know, in case you weren't aware, that ISeahawk has been confirmed by Checkuser to be a sockpuppet of Andrewwikiedit and is now indefinitely blocked. Andrewwikiedit, who created the article, is now blocked for a week. --AussieLegend (✉) 10:57, 15 December 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for the update AussieLegend. I was aware of the sock investigation, but I try to assume good faith to the very end. - Marchjuly (talk) 11:01, 15 December 2014 (UTC)

That was fairly apparent, which is why I didn't say anything earlier. --AussieLegend (✉) 11:02, 15 December 2014 (UTC)

@AussieLegend: Probably this is just a coincidence, but the editing histories do somewhat overlap and some of the edit sums seem similar. I'm not too familiar with this type of thing, so maybe it's nothing at all. - Marchjuly (talk) 02:21, 18 December 2014 (UTC)

I don't think it's a coincidence at all. Drmargi has noticed it too.[1] --AussieLegend (✉) 03:47, 18 December 2014 (UTC)

Welcoming

March, did you know that you welcomed someone that was already welcomed? Oiyarbepsy (talk) 15:50, 19 December 2014 (UTC)

@Oiyarbepsy: Yes, I did, but I did not know there was a limit on the number of times a user could be welcomed to Wikipedia. Your welcome was more of a general one, but mine was related to a more specific issue (i.e., possible coi editing) and contained links to Wikipedia page related to that subject. I could've added a {{uw-coi}} instead, but I thought {{welcome-coi}} was more appropriate at this point. - Marchjuly (talk) 22:30, 19 December 2014 (UTC)

OK - I just thought it was a goof. Oiyarbepsy (talk) 23:30, 19 December 2014 (UTC)