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Wikipedia talk:Vital articles/Level/5/People/Archive 8

< Wikipedia talk:Vital articles | Level/5 | People
Latest comment: 1 month ago by Makkool in topic Add Walter Mondale  5
Archive 5Archive 6Archive 7Archive 8Archive 9

Add Allen Klein

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
PASSED
Added 4-0. Makkool (talk) 16:09, 25 August 2024 (UTC)

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An extremely controversial manager. Associated with Sam Cooke   5, The Beatles   3, and The Rolling Stones   4.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 23:40, 5 March 2024 (UTC)
  2. Interstellarity (talk) 13:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. "one of the most powerful individuals in the music industry during his era" Makkool (talk) 09:44, 21 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. 49p (talk) 02:57, 12 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Swap Leopoldo Galtieri for Javier Milei

Latest comment: 3 months ago4 comments3 people in discussion
NO CONSENSUS
Not swapped 1-1. No new votes in 138 days. Makkool (talk) 17:42, 19 August 2024 (UTC)

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There's little of note in Galtieri's biography besides the Falklands War, which is already a vital article, so there would be overlap. Milei, the current president of Argentina, got international notice as part of the recent international trend of right-wing leaders. Cambalachero (talk) 16:54, 3 April 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nominator Cambalachero (talk) 16:54, 3 April 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. We now subject world leaders to the "head of lettuce" test. Revisit this fall when he has served a year. pbp 17:06, 3 April 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Add Anton Pannekoek

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments5 people in discussion
PASSED
Added to Scientists 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 01:48, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

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Managed to be a major figure both in astronomy and Marxist theory, I think he could go in either section in terms of position,

Support
  1. As nom. Iostn (talk) 21:24, 24 April 2024 (UTC)
  2. --Thi (talk) 13:40, 25 April 2024 (UTC)
  3. SailorGardevoir (talk) 06:20, 26 April 2024 (UTC)
  4. Support addition to astronomy section. Going by Google Scholar results, out of 11,200 total results, he is referenced in relation to astronomy 7,740 times, while he is referenced in relation to Marxism 1,270 times. His influence on astronomy is a lot greater than his influence on Marxism, what with his ideas on council communism being a lot more niche compared to other tendencies. --Grnrchst (talk) 12:24, 22 June 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Talha ibn 'Ubayd Allah and Sa'id ibn Zayd

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
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Added 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 04:03, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

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To make up for my recent requests, let me advocate for the addition of these guys. There are the only people who were a part of the ten to whom Paradise was promised who are not on here. In comparison (which is admittedly imperfect since the whole ten list is strictly a Sunni thing), we have all twelve Apostles on here, plus Matthais.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 10:39, 14 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 15:42, 17 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 13:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 06:28, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Casualties of the September 11 attacks

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 02:59, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

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Or just move it to history. I hate to remove an article based on how it fits into this project, but this one just sticks out like a sore thumb being on the people pages. Even the articles based on a group of people don't really resemble what is essentially a statistic page.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 01:54, 23 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 15:03, 24 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Seems way too specific. 49p (talk) 06:09, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 18:03, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Budai

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments5 people in discussion
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Added 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:02, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

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AKA The Laughing Buddha. Favorite subject for East Asian artists and the reason why a lot of Westerners picture the founder of Buddhism as a fat Chinese man. (Nominating him here since the general consensus appears to be that he was originally an actual Chinese monk who later got deified.)

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 06:38, 25 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 08:36, 25 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 16:53, 25 May 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 08:00, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Nehru–Gandhi family and/or remove Kennedy family

Latest comment: 3 months ago7 comments6 people in discussion
PASSED
Added 5-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 02:57, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

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The former is clearly more vital than the latter, IMO. A removal may be in order given how both are just glorified lists at the minute, but I reckon more could be written of them. J947 ‡ edits 04:11, 24 May 2024 (UTC)

Support both
Support addition; oppose removal
  1. Tentatively, as nom. J947 ‡ edits 04:11, 24 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. pbp 12:46, 24 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. SailorGardevoir (talk) 06:19, 25 May 2024 (UTC)
  4. Iostn (talk) 16:57, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
  5. TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 13:11, 27 May 2024 (UTC)
Support removal; oppose addition
Oppose both
Discussion
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Murderer clean-up

Latest comment: 3 months ago67 comments6 people in discussion

Before subsection quotas were abolished there was a supported proposal to reduce the number of spaces under "Murder, serial killing, mass murder" in favour of those responsible for more societally impactful crimes (such as assassination, crimes against humanity and terrorism). While this was rendered moot by the removal of quotas, I still think the murder section needs to be cleaned up as it has quite a big US bias and also many of the spree killers also have the sprees they were responsible for listed under history, which makes a better case for cleaning up spaces here.

Remove Gameel Al-Batouti

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Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:10, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

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Aside from anything else, it doesn't even seem clear, nor is there any way to conclusively determine, whether he deliberately caused deaths or not. I suppose EgyptAir Flight 990 could be listed but I'm not sure how much it stands out compared to other plane crashes.

Support
  1. As nom. Iostn (talk) 20:42, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 05:55, 25 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. SailorGardevoir (talk) 23:53, 9 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Interstellarity (talk) 13:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Martin Bryant

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Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 01:55, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

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Port Arthur massacre (Australia)   5 is already listed.

Support
  1. As nom. Iostn (talk) 20:42, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 05:55, 25 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 13:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 00:32, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Swap Seung-Hui Cho for Virginia Tech shooting

PASSED
Swapped 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 01:55, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

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Based on the principle of the vent itself being more important than the person who is solely notable because of it.

Support
  1. As nom. Iostn (talk) 20:42, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 05:55, 25 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 13:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 00:32, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Belle Gunness

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Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 01:55, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

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Not among the most well-known serial killers. The article does say that "some sources speculate her involvement in as many as 40 murders making her one of the most prolific female serial killers in history", but that is well, speculative.

Support
  1. As nom. Iostn (talk) 20:42, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 05:55, 25 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 13:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 18:02, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Richard Hauptmann

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Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 01:55, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

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Lindbergh kidnapping   5 is already listed, and he is not known to have been responsible for any other murders.

Support
  1. As nom. Iostn (talk) 20:42, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 05:55, 25 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 13:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 18:02, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Richard Hickock and Perry Edward Smith

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Removed 5-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:10, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

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These two are seemingly only listed for their involvement in a murder case which inspired the writing of In Cold Blood   5, which was influential on the True crime   5 genre. The book is already listed and their actual crime doesn't seem to stand out on a broader level.

Support
  1. As nom. Iostn (talk) 20:42, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 05:55, 25 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 13:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per nom Mathwriter2718 (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 12:37, 20 July 2024 (UTC)
  5. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 18:02, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Swap Andrew Kehoe for Bath School disaster

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Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 01:55, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

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Same rationale as Seung-Hui Cho.

Support
  1. As nom. Iostn (talk) 20:42, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 05:55, 25 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 13:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 18:02, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Marc Lépine

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 01:55, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

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École Polytechnique massacre   5 is already listed.

Support
  1. As nom. Iostn (talk) 20:42, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 05:55, 25 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 13:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 18:02, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Earle Nelson

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 01:55, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

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"considered the first known serial sex murderer of the twentieth century". Other than that doesn't really seem to stand out compared to other serial killers.

Support
  1. As nom. Iostn (talk) 20:42, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 05:55, 25 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 13:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 18:02, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Stephen Paddock

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 01:55, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

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2017 Las Vegas shooting is already listed.

Support
  1. As nom. Iostn (talk) 20:42, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 05:55, 25 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 13:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 18:02, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Jane Toppan

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:10, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

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Doesn't stand out compared to other serial killers.

Support
  1. As nom. Iostn (talk) 20:42, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 05:55, 25 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 13:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Support Mathwriter2718 (talk) 12:39, 20 July 2024 (UTC)
  5. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 18:02, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Pedro López (serial killer)

PASSED
Added 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 01:55, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

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One of the most prolific serial killers in history, and is second only to Luis Garavito   5 on List of serial killers by number of victims.

Support
  1. As nom. Iostn (talk) 20:42, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. Interstellarity (talk) 13:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. Per nom Mathwriter2718 (talk) 12:42, 20 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 18:02, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Howard Unruh

PASSED
Added 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 01:55, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

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Initially didn't propose this as I was under the impression it was relatively well-remembered, but the low number of interwikis and pageviews compared to many of the others here indicates otherwise.

Support
  1. As nom. Iostn (talk) 22:46, 3 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Interstellarity (talk) 13:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. Not that important Mathwriter2718 (talk) 12:40, 20 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 18:02, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove AXXo

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:00, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

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Unknown individual known for movie rips. Extremely popular during the era, but I feel like there are other groups and people known for piracy that aren't included. We don't include Razor 1911 which has been software cracking since 1985 compared to aXXo whose career is from 2005 to 2009.

Support
  1. per nom. I would support a swap for Razor 1911 if that gets enough votes. 49p (talk) 05:54, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. per above. starship.paint (RUN) 08:00, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. pbp 13:51, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 23:20, 27 May 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Islam Makhachev

Latest comment: 3 months ago7 comments5 people in discussion
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Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:16, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

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Good fighter but way too early to tell if he will be vital. He is only 32. Nothing on his article suggests any lasting vitality. He is overshadowed in almost every way by his trainer Khabib Nurmagomedov   5. Aurangzebra (talk) 00:42, 30 May 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. as nom. Aurangzebra (talk) 00:42, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. Recentism. starship.paint (RUN) 01:46, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Too many MMA personalities pbp 07:00, 4 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. In my opinion, he will become vital in a couple years. Just not now. 49p (talk) 07:12, 7 June 2024 (UTC)
    I agree. Aurangzebra (talk) 02:26, 8 June 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Anonymous (hacker group)  5

Latest comment: 3 months ago11 comments9 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 7-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:01, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

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Popular for their cyberattacks and prescene in the 2010s. Quite literally listed as "100 most influential people" per Time magazine in 2012 according to the article. I don't think this one needs much explaining, considering we also include LulzSec   5.

Support
  1. 49p (talk) 06:03, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. Important enough, if needed we could swap with Lulzsec. Kevinishere15 (talk) 06:19, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Plenty of real-world influence.--LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 07:29, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
  4. per above. starship.paint (RUN) 08:00, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
  5. Iostn (talk) 16:57, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
  6. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 00:13, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
  7. Per nom Mathwriter2718 (talk) 12:45, 20 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss

I WILL say this, though: making the TIME 100 just once isn't a good criteria for inclusion. We don't even have all the TIME People of the Year. pbp 13:53, 26 May 2024 (UTC)

I made this late at night haha. I was trying to say that the group itself has undoubtedly enough influence in the real world. not just because it's specifically in "time 100" 49p (talk) 14:54, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
We likely will never have the 2006 Time Person of the Year :) Aurangzebra (talk) 00:13, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
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Remove Caroline Lee Hentz

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:36, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

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Only claim to vitality is writing a somewhat famous anti-Tom novel. She did not start the short-lived anti-Tom movement and Anti-Tom literature is not listed as vital. Only 6 interwikis.

Support
  1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 16:54, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 15:51, 27 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Per nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 23:19, 27 May 2024 (UTC)
  4. SailorGardevoir (talk) 10:13, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discuss
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Remove Lars Hall

Latest comment: 3 months ago4 comments4 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:15, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

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Stub (as in three sentences) on here and on Swedish Wikipedia.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 07:39, 7 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Not every Olympic gold medalist is vital. Ping me if anything more substantial is found. QuicoleJR (talk) 22:08, 7 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint 02:08, 14 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Iostn (talk) 11:12, 15 June 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Philip Farkas

Latest comment: 3 months ago4 comments3 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 11:33, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

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Only five interwikis and no RYM page.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 01:07, 9 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 18:06, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint 02:08, 14 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 06:25, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Matt Mattox

Latest comment: 3 months ago4 comments4 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:59, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

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Stub. Only has seven interwikis.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 03:25, 9 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 18:06, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint 02:08, 14 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Hard to convince myself he is more notable than Seven Brides for Seven Brothers, which isn't a VA. Mathwriter2718 (talk) 12:50, 20 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Johann Christian Fischer

Latest comment: 3 months ago6 comments5 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 4-1. Makkool (talk) 11:33, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

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Do we really need an oboe player?

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 03:36, 9 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 18:06, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint 02:08, 14 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 06:25, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. I think we do to be honest, and he's not crazy obscure. J947 ‡ edits 05:37, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Add Sai Baba of Shirdi

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
PASSED
Added 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:58, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

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This is the guy who Sathya Sai Baba   5 claims to be a reincarnation of. Seems like he was a very popular religious figure in India for both Hindus and Muslims (although note that it's not clear what religion he actually belonged to), his article is B-tier, he got 35 interwikis, and he's rated high-importance in a lot of WikiProjects.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 21:11, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 08:58, 12 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 11:12, 15 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 00:35, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Josef Gusikov

Latest comment: 3 months ago4 comments3 people in discussion
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Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 11:33, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

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A while back, I moved the klezmer musicians from the non-European art music section to the popular music section. (I don't know why that genre got placed there either; I have never heard anyone refer klezmer as a form of art music.) This has resulted in Gusikov here being the only person listed under popular musicians to predate recorded music. By a couple of decades actually. Since he only has nine interwikis, I suggest we just remove him.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 01:21, 13 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint 02:08, 14 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 11:12, 15 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Makkool (talk) 12:56, 15 June 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Leonid Brekhovskikh

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
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Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:14, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

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Just five paragraphs (of which only three are actually paragraph-length) and four interwikis.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 03:08, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Not even 100 pageviews in the past month Iostn (talk) 00:24, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 00:27, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Tao Lin

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
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Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 01:41, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

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We still have way too many authors from the U.S. and Canada, and this guy does not seem to have had any amount of influence.

Support
  1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 20:19, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 18:16, 18 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 00:34, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discuss
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Remove Harry Glicken

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments5 people in discussion
REMOVED
4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:16, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

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Hate to remove a featured article, but he only has six interwikis.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 01:45, 17 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. No indication of vitality. QuicoleJR (talk) 12:10, 17 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. His mentor David A. Johnston   5 was much more vital than him. Makkool (talk) 06:01, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Bruce C. Heezen

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
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Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:17, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

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Stub. He did worked with Marie Tharp   4 and he does have a ship named after him, but I'm not sure if his article can be improved.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 03:15, 17 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Low pageviews Iostn (talk) 00:24, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 11:47, 21 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Nicolas Appert

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments5 people in discussion
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Added 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 01:48, 22 August 2024 (UTC)

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Known as the father of food science. Invented airtight food preservation, has 84 interwikis, and is the only person rated top-importance in the Food Wikiproject.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 20:16, 18 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 20:58, 18 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makkool (talk) 06:01, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Iostn (talk) 00:24, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Solomon Linda

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
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Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:41, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

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To make up for the drastic cuts I was proposing for the African music section, here's the original singer/writer for The Lion Sleeps Tonight   5.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 00:43, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 06:01, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 00:24, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 00:26, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Yoshiko Yamaguchi

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
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Added 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:45, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

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She's the only Seven Great Singing Stars we don't have on here. I understand the unusual conditions regarding her, but she has the second highest amount of interwikis amongst the seven.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 00:55, 19 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 06:01, 20 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 00:24, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 00:42, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Tunka Manin

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments5 people in discussion
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Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:23, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

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I hate to say this, but I think the Ghana Empire   4 is just going to have to be one of those countries where we don't list any of its leaders. Only three paragraphs and three interwikis.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 07:53, 21 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 05:59, 22 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 00:24, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
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Discuss

Remove John Luther Long

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
Last comment 23 days ago. Removed 4-0. QuicoleJR (talk) 13:42, 29 July 2024 (UTC)

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Wrote one decently popular short story that inspired a few other works. I could maybe see including the story, although even that would be a stretch, but this guy has no reason to be on the list, especially when we have this many modern American/Canadian authors. Only 8 interwikis.

Support
  1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 15:01, 21 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 05:59, 22 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. SailorGardevoir (talk) 06:07, 22 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discuss
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Remove KondZilla

Latest comment: 3 months ago6 comments5 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 4-1. Makkool (talk) 11:33, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

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I do want someone to represent funk carioca, and he does look like he has a pretty big YouTube career, but he only has four interwikis.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 21:41, 21 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 05:59, 22 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Support swap with Brazilian funk. The Blue Rider   10:58, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Not really convinced by judging this solely on interwikis, especially for someone from a Global South country which don't normally get the same level of cultural attention internationally. That aside, having the third largest music YouTube channel shouldn't be dismissed. Iostn (talk) 21:55, 31 July 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Remove Anangabhima Deva III and Suhungmung

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
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Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:49, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

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Both figures have only three interwikis.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 05:19, 22 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 05:59, 22 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 00:43, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
Oppose
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Remove Gyalsey Tenzin Rabgye

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments5 people in discussion
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Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:25, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

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Stub. We also have Ngawang Namgyal   5 on here, who is probably the only Bhutanese figure we need for this period.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 08:02, 22 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 12:50, 23 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. Low page views, and ruler of a country that to this day has a population of under a million Iostn (talk) 00:24, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove The Great Lester

Latest comment: 3 months ago4 comments3 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:04, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

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Stub. Only has three interwikis.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 03:12, 9 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 18:06, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint 02:08, 14 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 06:25, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Dua Lipa

Latest comment: 2 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 19:05, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

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For basically the exact same reasons as why I proposed Billie Eilish for removal from this list. Beyond some listings from blogs, a few awards, wax statues and an increase in rates of babies named after her (how the hell are these considered "legacy" / "impact"??), she's had no proven long term impact on the music industry yet and her career only spans a decade. This listing is blatant WP:RECENTISM in a section currently over quota. Same as with Billie, if this impact changes in the future, we can always revisit.

Support
  1. As nom. λ NegativeMP1 01:06, 23 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 12:50, 23 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom 49p (talk) 04:11, 20 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Add Elliot Page

Latest comment: 3 months ago6 comments6 people in discussion
FAILED
Not added 3-2. Makkool (talk) 11:33, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

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Although Page has not won an Academy Award/BAFTA like some other actors listed, Page is unarguably one of the most notable transgender actors and beats plenty of other listed actors in terms of notability.

Support
  1. As nom. B3251(talk) 04:18, 10 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. SailorGardevoir (talk) 05:34, 10 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Regardless of how much work he has done since coming out, I think that just adds another dimension to someone who was already influential beforehand, regardless of wherever they were selected for an award or not. Iostn (talk) 17:09, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. I am tentatively here because I feel that he hasn't done a huge amount since publicly coming out in 2020. Most of his success was when he was not yet publicly transgender. starship.paint (RUN) 14:29, 10 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. per starship.paint. I can see him becoming VA5 at some point but not just yet. Aurangzebra (talk) 23:01, 13 July 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Remove Gosamaru

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
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Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:53, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

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Barely a start article. Only three interwikis.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 05:36, 10 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 23:01, 13 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 04:22, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 06:25, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Stephen Rodefer

Latest comment: 3 months ago6 comments6 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 5-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:31, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

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One interwiki.

Support
  1. As nom. B3251(talk) 17:43, 10 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. pbp 18:17, 10 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. No indication of vitality. QuicoleJR (talk) 22:06, 10 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Makkool (talk) 11:31, 13 July 2024 (UTC)
  5. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 23:02, 13 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Ned Brooks

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments5 people in discussion
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Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:29, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

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Only listed as the second-longest tenured moderator of Meet the Press. That claim is unsourced, the longest tenured presenter is also only VA5, and this man does not seem to have had an influence on anything.

Support
  1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 22:04, 10 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 04:22, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makkool (talk) 19:54, 16 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 06:11, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discuss
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Remove Roger Williams (soldier)

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments5 people in discussion
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Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:51, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

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Only one interwiki.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 06:53, 12 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 04:22, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Does not seem important enough. QuicoleJR (talk) 11:26, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 06:05, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Noël Jourda de Vaux

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
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Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:52, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

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Only four interwikis.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 23:42, 12 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 04:22, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 06:05, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 06:35, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add IShowSpeed

Latest comment: 3 months ago9 comments6 people in discussion
FAILED
Not added 2-2. Makkool (talk) 17:59, 1 August 2024 (UTC)

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Undoubtedly the most popular 2020s internet live streamer. Has a whopping 82 interwikis, even more than other significant YouTube/internet personalities like MrBeast   5 and PewDiePie   5.

Support
  1. As nom. B3251(talk) 19:51, 16 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. A bit recent, but he is the most famous and prominent streamer of this decade so far. We can remove him later if he's overtaken or fades into obscurity, but at present he's an obvious addition IMO and would be one of the best picks for expanding the internet personalities section. λ NegativeMP1 19:54, 16 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Who? This decade has 4 years, so not that impressive of a feat if that statement is even true. The Blue Rider   21:19, 16 July 2024 (UTC)
    We list other internet personalities like Jeffree Star, who are objectively far less notable. Just because you personally don't know this person doesn't make them any less notable. B3251(talk) 22:14, 16 July 2024 (UTC)
    Two wrongs don't make a right, Jeffree Star should be removed. This YouTuber is a fad; plus being popular alone isn't a strong enough reason for inclusion, it needs to have some sort of impact. Also, that sentence can very well be reversed, just because you know him doesn't make him any more vital; if you go ask the average person who this YouTuber is they will look at you clueless. The Blue Rider   22:47, 16 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Oppose. I do know Speed and I am aware of his popularity but he has not done anything to demonstrate his longevity just yet nor has he been particularly influential to mainstream culture. I don't agree with the sentiment that we should add him now and remove him if he fades into obscurity because streamer longevity is notoriously hard to achieve. Take Adin Ross for example: at his peak, he was extremely popular and was regularly doing streams with big name celebrities; now, he barely makes a blip on the radar. We also don't follow this pattern in other categories where it would make a lot more sense e.g. we don't automatically add the soccer player who wins the Ballon d'Or even though they have more cultural and global influence and cross-generational appeal than streamers do. Aurangzebra (talk) 01:08, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
    If we must include more Internet personalities, I would rather have Kai Cenat who is the most-subscribed Twitch streamer of all time, won the 2023 and 2024 Streamer of the Year awards, and popularized the terms rizz and gyat whose use has spread outside of the streamer-sphere. Fwiw, I would also support removing Jeffree Star. Aurangzebra (talk) 01:48, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
    I would also support adding Kai Cenat. Not many streamers have accidentally started a riot. QuicoleJR (talk) 17:02, 21 July 2024 (UTC)
Neutral
Discuss
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Add System of a Down

Latest comment: 2 months ago7 comments6 people in discussion
FAILED
Not added 1-4. Makkool (talk) 17:40, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

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Surprised they aren't listed, probably one of the most well known and influential metal bands of the 2000s. Their album Toxicity was a major hit, especially the lead single "Chop Suey". They've also had numerous other popular songs across their other albums. Certainly they are a lot bigger and more well known than some of the other acts listed at this level. Maykii (talk) 02:43, 19 July 2024 (UTC)

Support

  1. as nom. Maykii (talk) 02:44, 19 July 2024 (UTC)

Oppose

  1. pbp 03:43, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. You need a more convincing rationale to demonstrate how these guys are V5 worthy, a level that should only have the few hundred most important musicians and bands. Them being "a lot bigger and more well known than some of the other acts listed at this level" really doesn't mean anything when a lot of those acts are probably subject to removal themselves. I don't even see how these guys are more important than the recently removed Bring Me The Horizon. λ NegativeMP1 04:14, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Per NegativeMP1. There are too many popular musicians and we can only really list the really elite ones. starship.paint (RUN) 09:07, 21 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Rage Against the Machine is a better pick imo. I don't think that many people would agree tho 49p (talk) 15:31, 30 July 2024 (UTC)

Discuss

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Remove Andrew Neiderman

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments5 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:29, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

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We have too many recent American authors, and this article does not show any evidence of vitality other than a couple minor film adaptations. Only two of his books even have articles, and neither of those articles have any interwikis.

Support
  1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 12:10, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 13:26, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 14:10, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per nom Mathwriter2718 (talk) 12:55, 20 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discuss
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Remove Giannalberto Bendazzi

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 4-0.. Makkool (talk) 17:59, 1 August 2024 (UTC)

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I looked through the "art historians and critics" section and there are currently listed six film historians or theorists. Of them, three are animation historians. If you'd also think that's excessive, we could cut at least one of them. Bendazzi's recognition seems to come from one book Cartoons − 100 Years of Cinema Animation, which "has been considered the definitive work on the subject for animation students and scholars." Jerry Beck   5 and John Canemaker   5 seem to have had a much more broad output and could be considered more vital than Bendazzi.

Support
  1. Makkool (talk) 13:26, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 14:11, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Seems also less vital than the not-listed Michael Barrier. I've heard of Barrier, Beck and Canemaker but not of Bendazzi (who also has the fewest pageviews, at ~3 a day).--LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 20:58, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. per above. starship.paint (RUN) 09:07, 21 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discuss
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Remove Bill Monroe (journalist)

Latest comment: 2 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 19:46, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

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Above, I nominated Ned Brooks because all he had going for him was being moderator of Meet the Press for a long time. This guy had an even shorter tenure and similarly has no other reason to be on the list. Only 5 interwikis.

Support
  1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 15:42, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 09:07, 21 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makkool (talk) 17:24, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 11:46, 21 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discuss
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Add Jeff Kinney

Latest comment: 3 months ago10 comments6 people in discussion
FAILED
Not added 3-2. Makkool (talk) 18:35, 24 August 2024 (UTC)

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I know there's been a push to remove American authors but he is the author of the 4th best-selling book series of all time, Diary of a Wimpy Kid, and we list the other 4 authors in the top 5 (J. K. Rowling   5, R. L. Stine   5, Erle Stanley Gardner   5, and Stan and Jan Berenstain   5). Diary of a Wimpy Kid has spawned a media empire complete with live-action and animated films, video games, and even a musical and the books have been republished in 56 languages across 65 different editions. He has 41 interwikis and the Diary of a Wimpy Kid series has 37.

If we do need to remove someone, I've noticed that we list a decent amount of authors who are also famous for some book series that spawned a large empire but to a lesser extent than Diary of a Wimpy Kid. For example, we list Jeff Lindsay   5 who is famous for the Dexter book series that was developed into the much more famous TV show of the same name. Seems like Kinney beats this guy on every metric: more interwikis (41 vs 28), more notability for the authored book series (I bet you that most people don't even know Dexter (TV series) originated from a book series), and more book copies sold. Aurangzebra (talk) 04:03, 25 July 2024 (UTC)

Suport

  1. as nom Aurangzebra (talk) 04:03, 25 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom 49p (talk) 13:06, 26 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. support per nom., but should we list him with illustrators or writers? Maurice Sendak   5 is currently with writers, but I'm thinking they could be either way considered to be vital for illustrating or writing. Makkool (talk) 14:29, 26 July 2024 (UTC)
    Good point. I personally have no strong preference but I slightly lean authors since Diary of a Wimpy Kid is a bit more verbose than straightforward illustrated books like Where the Wild Things Are. Aurangzebra (talk) 20:20, 26 July 2024 (UTC)
    Yeah, I think they are categorized as chapter books in book stores and libraries. I'll go ahead and move Sendak to illustrators. Wilhelm Busch   5 is already there, and he's another author whose works have greater emphasis on pictures. Makkool (talk) 21:41, 26 July 2024 (UTC)

Oppose

  1. Would rather list the book series. J947 ‡ edits 07:21, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Same.--LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 06:33, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

Discuss

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Remove Jeffree Star

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments5 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:09, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

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Removal was suggested above.

Support
  1. As nom. Kevinishere15 (talk) 22:55, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 23:02, 18 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Obscure figure with almost zero impact on society. The Blue Rider   13:12, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Makkool (talk) 13:49, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Freddy Schuman

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments5 people in discussion
REMOVED
Added 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:11, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

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Seems like a cool guy, but that doesn't make him vital, zero interwikis. I don't think being a "superfan" of something would ever be enough on its own to warrant being here.

Support
  1. As nom. Kevinishere15 (talk) 22:55, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. pbp 03:44, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Per nominator. The Blue Rider   13:14, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Not vital Mathwriter2718 (talk) 12:54, 20 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Harold Russell

Latest comment: 3 months ago7 comments6 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 5-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:06, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

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He's a hero, he's in one famous movie, he's NOT VA5 pbp 01:09, 30 July 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. pbp 01:09, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 01:18, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Per nom. J947 ‡ edits 09:51, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Makkool (talk) 17:24, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
  5. Not that vital. QuicoleJR (talk) 21:33, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discussion
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French women additions

Latest comment: 2 months ago22 comments5 people in discussion
PASSED
All added 4-0. Makkool (talk) 05:10, 31 August 2024 (UTC)

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At the 2024 Summer Olympics opening ceremony, ten women were honoured as vital figures in French history. Of these, five are already listed as level-5 vital articles, the other five are not. As such, I thought I'd take the opportunity to propose the addition of the five missing entries to our list of vital biographies. --Grnrchst (talk) 11:25, 27 July 2024 (UTC)

Add Jeanne Baret

The first woman in history to circumnavigate the globe, Baret worked on the ship of Louis Antoine de Bougainville   5, who described her as an expert botanist for her time. Several plant species and a mountain range on Pluto are named after her. Proposing for addition to explorers list.

Support
  1. As nominator. --Grnrchst (talk) 11:25, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 12:09, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 21:01, 28 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 23:37, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss

Add Alice Milliat

A pioneering figure of Women's sports   4, Milliat was the main organiser of the Women's World Games and her lobbying efforts accelerated the inclusion of women at the Olympic Games   3. Proposing for addition to the Olympics section of the sports figures list.

Support
  1. As nominator. --Grnrchst (talk) 11:25, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 12:09, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 21:01, 28 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 23:37, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss

Add Paulette Nardal

One of the founding authors of the Négritude literary genre, Nardal provided a platform for black intellectuals to publish their works and cultivate global solidarity among the African diaspora. She was also a major figure in transnational feminism and held several high-ranking positions in the United Nations. Proposing for addition to the Caribbean section of the writers and journalists list.

Support
  1. As nominator. --Grnrchst (talk) 11:25, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 12:09, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 21:01, 28 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 23:37, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss

Add Gisèle Halimi

A lawyer that defended people involved in the Algerian and Basque independence movements, and chair of the Russell Tribunal, Halimi was a leading advocate for women's rights to contraception and abortion in France. Proposing for addition to the Modern European jurists section of the philosophers, historians, political and social scientists list.

Support
  1. As nominator. --Grnrchst (talk) 11:25, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 12:09, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 21:01, 28 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:08, 23 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss

Add Simone Veil

A magistrate by trade, as Minister of Health, Veil promulgated the legalisation of abortion in France. She was also the first woman to serve as the President of the European Parliament and later served as president of the Fondation pour la Mémoire de la Shoah, was elected to the Académie Française and served on the Constitutional Council of France. She received an OBE and received the highest cross of the Legion of Honour. Proposing for addition to the contemporary France section of the politicians and leaders list.

Support
  1. As nominator. --Grnrchst (talk) 11:25, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 12:09, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 21:01, 28 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 23:37, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Wallace Fard Muhammad

Latest comment: 3 months ago5 comments5 people in discussion
PASSED
Added 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 02:57, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

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Again, making up for my recent proposals. Considering that the Nation of Islam has its own separate subsection for their figures, we should probably have its founder.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 21:48, 15 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. Seems pretty important. QuicoleJR (talk) 15:13, 16 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Definitely important as Louis Farrakhan, or Elijah Muhammad. 49p (talk) 16:35, 16 May 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 15:42, 17 May 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Film scholar additions

Latest comment: 2 months ago16 comments4 people in discussion

There is under-representation in art historians of scholars and historians focusing on film. I feel these could be essential names to list, to have more balance between different art forms in that section.

  1. It is worth noting that it may seem like film scholars are under-represented simply because film theory as an independent field is a relatively novel concept but there are many prominent film scholars we list whose primary contributions are in other domains e.g. François Truffaut   4 who was foremost a director and Gilles Deleuze   5 who was primarily a philosopher. Aurangzebra (talk) 06:11, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  1. Yeah, that's correct. We also already list Sergei Eisenstein   4 and André Bazin   5 who are prominent, and the latter is represented in the art historians and critics section. I think with the space we have, we can list some more. Makkool (talk) 09:11, 17 July 2024 (UTC)

Add David Bordwell

WITHDRAWN
Not enough interest, no votes in over 90 days. Makkool (talk) 06:22, 1 September 2024 (UTC)

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His book Film Art "is still used as a seminal text in introductory film courses". 14 interwikis.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 16:26, 16 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
  1. Going to reserve judgment on this one but it's worth noting that we don't include seminal textbook authors in other more noteworthy fields. Aurangzebra (talk) 06:11, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
    His article also mentions that he has written "influential articles on theory, narrative, and style". He seems to be an important figure in academic film studies, at least in North America. Don't know if his scholarship is read in Europe for example. Makkool (talk) 09:11, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Add Laura Mulvey   5

PASSED
Added 4-0, discussion started two weeks ago. Makkool (talk) 17:25, 31 July 2024 (UTC)

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Pioneering feminist film analyst. "Helped shift the orientation of film theory towards a psychoanalytic framework" and introduced the concept of "male gaze".

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 16:26, 16 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. makes sense Aurangzebra (talk) 06:11, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Per nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 12:49, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Iostn (talk) 21:22, 18 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discuss
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Add Vito Russo

WITHDRAWN
Not enough interest, no new votes in 90 days. Makkool (talk) 06:22, 1 September 2024 (UTC)

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Queer film theorist and author of The Celluloid Closet, "'an essential reference book' on homosexuality in the US film industry".

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 16:26, 16 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Iostn (talk) 21:22, 18 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discuss
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Add Manthia Diawara

WITHDRAWN
Not enough interest, no votes in over 90 days. Makkool (talk) 06:22, 1 September 2024 (UTC)

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African film scholar who "contributed significantly to the study of black film".

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 16:26, 16 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discuss
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Add Starhawk

Latest comment: 2 months ago3 comments2 people in discussion
WITHDRAWN
Not enough interest, no new votes in two months. Makkool (talk) 06:24, 1 September 2024 (UTC)

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An influential proponent on Neo-paganism in the public eye. List under Religious figures.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 15:42, 17 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. Interstellarity (talk) 13:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discuss
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Swap Meralda Warren  5 with Margaret Mahy

Latest comment: 2 months ago4 comments2 people in discussion
NO CONSENSUS
Not swapped 1-1, adding Mahy 2-0. No new votes in three months. I might start a new proposition just for adding Mahy. Closing this for now. Makkool (talk) 06:27, 1 September 2024 (UTC)

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Meralda Warren is a local writer from a tiny British Overseas Territory. Her Wikipedia biography tells more about other things she has done than her writing career. On the other hand, Margaret Mahy was an acclaimed children's author from New Zealand with major-award-winning books. Currently we don't list any children's authors from NZ.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 15:42, 17 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. Support addition per nom. She has won several major awards and written over 100 books. QuicoleJR (talk) 18:43, 24 May 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Oppose removal Her having more importance than just being an author is a point towards keeping, not a reason to remove. Her article does a pretty good job of showing importance, and there are plenty of authors from the U.S. and UK who have nothing going for them besides writing a few somewhat popular books that we can remove first to meet the quota. QuicoleJR (talk) 18:43, 24 May 2024 (UTC)
Neutral
Discuss
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US actors removals

Latest comment: 2 months ago34 comments8 people in discussion

These were suggested above in the Casey Affleck / Jared Leto proposal, which just passed. I'll open them up for discussion, where we could also test the criteria to include an actor in V5. Makkool (talk) 23:06, 27 June 2024 (UTC)

Remove Rami Malek

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 17:44, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

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Could he be too recent new actor where it's not clear if his career will be vital? He's an Academy Award winner though.

Support
  1. I think there should be more than one Academy Award to be automatically vital. Makkool (talk) 23:06, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 20:59, 23 August 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nomGeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 17:07, 3 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Forest Whitaker

PASSED
Removed 4-1. Makkool (talk) 17:44, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

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An esteemed character actor, whose also an Academy Award winner. Although most of his acclaim is from a role in one specific film, The Last King of Scotland.

Support
  1. I think there should be more than one Academy Award to be automatically vital. Makkool (talk) 23:06, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 21:00, 23 August 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nomGeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 17:07, 3 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. He's a prominent black actor. SailorGardevoir (talk) 05:33, 28 June 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Remove Zac Efron

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 13:49, 19 July 2024 (UTC)

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Star of a hit franchise, High School Musical, and now has a career doing character roles. No major awards.

Support
  1. No basis for vitality Makkool (talk) 23:06, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Is High School Musical even vital? SailorGardevoir (talk) 05:33, 28 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. pbp 02:58, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Chris Cooper

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 13:49, 19 July 2024 (UTC)

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Another esteemed character actor, who's an Academy Award winner.

Support
  1. I think there should be more than one Academy Award to be automatically vital. Makkool (talk) 23:06, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. SailorGardevoir (talk) 05:33, 28 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. As the person who first brought this up Iostn (talk) 00:24, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove James Franco

PASSED
Removed 6-0. Makkool (talk) 17:44, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

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Golden Globe winner, but his career seems to have petered out because of sexual misconduct allegations.

Support
  1. Only an Academy Award nomination. Makkool (talk) 23:06, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. pbp 02:58, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:27, 20 August 2024 (UTC)
  5. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 21:00, 23 August 2024 (UTC)
  6. per nomGeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 17:07, 3 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Seth Rogen   5

FAILED
Not removed 2-2. Makkool (talk) 13:49, 19 July 2024 (UTC)

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Golden Globe nominations. Has starred in popular comedies, but it might be too early to say anything about his legacy in film comedy.

Support
  1. Support for now Makkool (talk) 23:06, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. He is way too big to be removed. SailorGardevoir (talk) 05:33, 28 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Iostn (talk) 00:24, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Remove Woo Bum-kon incident  5

Latest comment: 2 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
NO CONSENSUS
Not removed 2-0. I'll move it instead to History as the article is framed as an event now. Makkool (talk) 17:17, 5 September 2024 (UTC)

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Article was moved from Woo Bum-kon and rescoped to be event-based and not a biography. It is now no longer fit for its section which is of criminal biographies. PARAKANYAA (talk) 01:45, 24 May 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 06:09, 25 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 08:36, 25 May 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
  1. This just brings up the question: does it really make much difference how the article is framed, if its still focused solely through the lens of its perpertrator (and I'm not sure if that page should've been even moved to start with, if reliable sources are just naming the events strictly through that lens anyway)? For example, if we list a murder case of someone who is only known for being the victim of that particularly murder case, should that be under the victims section? Iostn (talk) 16:53, 25 May 2024 (UTC)
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Visual artists and musicians removal. Part 2

Latest comment: 2 months ago49 comments7 people in discussion

Remove Cardi B

PASSED
Removed 5-0. Makkool (talk) 16:02, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

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She has released only 1 album. I like her music but I don’t think she has the trajectory to be listed yet.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 02:15, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
  2. I honestly thought she released at least like a couple of albums. 49p (talk) 03:10, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makkool (talk) 19:09, 27 August 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 01:55, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
  5. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 19:06, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Deadmau5   5

FAILED
Not removed 3-2. Makkool (talk) 11:54, 17 September 2024 (UTC)

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Famous during the late 2000s/early 2010s, but not enough of a lasting influence to be vital, I would say. Some of you have expressed that our electronic musicians list is somewhat short. I am open to swapping him for someone else.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 02:15, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom, a topic is already open for New Order to be added so it could be "swapped" with that if no other artist is suggested. 49p (talk) 03:20, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makkool (talk) 19:09, 27 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Strong oppose. Deadmau5 is easily one of the most influential EDM musicians. The Blue Rider   00:55, 29 August 2024 (UTC)
  2. Oppose admittedly he has declined in relevancy somewhat but he still left enough of an impact on the landscape of his genre to be listed here imo. If I were to suggest anyone currently listed under electronic music to be removed, I would suggest Imogen Heap   5 Iostn (talk) 20:59, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Remove Natori Shunsen

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 16:02, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

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He doesn’t appear to be among the most significant Japanese woodblock printers, of which we already list a few.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 02:15, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
  2. 49p (talk) 03:20, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makkool (talk) 19:09, 27 August 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 01:55, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Francis Greenway

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 16:02, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

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The article names several projects he worked on, but he was the architect for only a few of them, towards the end of his life. I’ve noted a considerable number of Australians who are carefully picked, and their articles are in good shape, but are not quite at the standard of vitality we are trying to establish.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 02:15, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
  2. 49p (talk) 03:20, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makkool (talk) 19:09, 27 August 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 01:55, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Russell Drysdale

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 16:02, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

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Similar to the above. 9 interwikis.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 02:15, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
  2. 49p (talk) 03:20, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makkool (talk) 19:09, 27 August 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 01:55, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Bob Loveless

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 16:02, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

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Knife designer. “Popularized the hollow ground drop point blade”. Just 1 interwiki.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 02:15, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
  2. 49p (talk) 03:20, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makkool (talk) 19:09, 27 August 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 01:55, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Lucienne Day

PASSED
Removed 5-0. Makkool (talk) 16:02, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

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Relatively obscure British textile designer. 4 interwikis.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 02:15, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
  2. 49p (talk) 03:20, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makkool (talk) 19:09, 27 August 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 01:55, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
  5. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 19:08, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Felipe Pinglo Alva

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 16:02, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

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Very few page views. Even the Spanish Wikipedia has only one short article dedicated to his songs—his signature song.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 02:15, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
  2. known as "father of Peruvian Musica criolla" but shows very little influence. 49p (talk) 03:20, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makkool (talk) 19:09, 27 August 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 01:55, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove F(x) (musical group)

PASSED
Removed 5-0. Makkool (talk) 16:02, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

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I know K-Pop is huge, but we have a high number of acts from the 2010s that probably have not established vitality yet, considering how cautious we have been towards English-speaking pop stars from this period.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 02:15, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
  2. 49p (talk) 03:20, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makkool (talk) 19:09, 27 August 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 01:55, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
  5. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 19:09, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove some pre-modern scientists

Latest comment: 2 months ago8 comments6 people in discussion
Last comment 2 months ago. Not removed 2-3. QuicoleJR (talk) 18:53, 31 August 2024 (UTC)

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I'm just going to make a giant block request for this one. The scientists I'm about to list either have single-digit interwikis, stubs, or both. NOTE: IW = interwikis, P=Paragraphs

  1. Agathodaemon (alchemist)   5 (2IW and 3P)
  2. Aglaonice   5 (3P)
  3. Ahmes   5 (1P)
  4. Callippus   5 (4P)
  5. Cleopatra the Physician   5 (4IW and 4P)
  6. Du Shi   5 (8IW)
  7. Menaechmus   5 (6P)
  8. Pandrosion   5 (5P)
  9. Pingala   5 (4P)
  10. Pseudo-Democritus   5 (3IW)
  11. Tapputi   5 (3P)
  12. Zhang Zhongjing   5 (6P)
  13. Adelle of the Saracens   5 (3IW and 4P)
  14. Anthemius of Tralles   5 (6P)
  15. Dobrodeia of Kiev   5 (4P)
  16. Ibn Sahl (mathematician)   5 (4P)
  17. Al-ʻIjliyyah   5 (Throwing this in because almost all of the paragraphs consists of a single sentence.)
  18. Jia Xian   5 (9IW and 3P)
  19. Mahāvīra (mathematician)   5 (4P)
  20. Qin Jiushao   5 (6P)
  21. Yang Hui   5 (6P)
  22. Zhu Shijie   5 (5P)
Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 02:16, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. λ NegativeMP1 05:13, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Keep Mahāvīra (mathematician) and Pingala at least. J947 ‡ edits 05:32, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Oppose all on principle. These kinds of block nominations completely lack nuance and end up making some wild assumptions based on very little. Take Aglaonice, for example; her article may be relatively short and underdeveloped, but she was one of the first astronomers documented to have learned the cycle of lunar eclipses, has 37 interwikis, and has had a species of moth and a crater of Venus named after her. But the nominator wants her removed because of article quality and no other assessment? --Grnrchst (talk) 14:17, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
    The more I look at it, the worse it gets. Menaechmus, who discovered conic sections and has 29 interwikis; Tapputi, who was one of the first recorded chemists and has 24 interwikis; Zhang Zhongjing, who contributed so much to his period's medical understanding that he is held to be a sage, 23 interwikis; Anthemius of Tralles, the architect of the Hagia Sophia(!!!) and has 39 interwikis. It is astounding that these are all lumped together in a block removal proposal for no other reason than their articles aren't very long... --Grnrchst (talk) 14:43, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. I agree with the above. We can't just remove biographies on the basis that they're short don't have interwikis. These articles should be based on the contribution of their respective discipline in the context of the time. The whole point of WP:VITAL isn't to document Wikipedia's best articles, but to highlight the ones which are significant in the context of history. Thus, only sound reasoning outlining specifically the contribution (or lack thereof) of each individual person should be all that is considered when removing or adding articles. I am opposed to this removal and I am opposed to this style of 'block nominations'. Idiosincrático (talk) 14:39, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
  • User:Grnrchst, User:Idiosincrático: OK, first off, you guys know you can easily just say "Keep so-and-so" right? Second, the entire purpose of this project is to find globally relevant articles and bring them to at least good article quality. So yes, I do think that article quality and the amount of interwikis are good indication to judge vitality. If an article have spent most of its existence of with only a handful of paragraphs, that indicates that it's not possible to improve it. If an article has only a handful of interwikis, that indicates that it's not globally relevant. SailorGardevoir (talk) 18:46, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
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Move Mikael Agricola  5 to linguists

Latest comment: 2 months ago6 comments4 people in discussion
PASSED
Moved 4-0. Makkool (talk) 18:54, 24 September 2024 (UTC)

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He is more a vital to the encyclopedia as the founder of Finnish literary language, than as one of many Protestant reformators in Kingdom of Sweden. Makkool (talk) 18:47, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 18:47, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. SailorGardevoir (talk) 00:23, 13 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 16:57, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 04:26, 16 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Steve Albini

Latest comment: 2 months ago9 comments6 people in discussion
FAILED
Not added 3-2. Makkool (talk) 18:46, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

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Well-known producer known for producing albums from Pixies (band)   5, Fugazi   5, Nirvana (band)   4, PJ Harvey   5, etc. He recently passed away (a couple hours from this message) but I was surprised to know he wasn't on this list yet despite his contributions. 49p (talk) 19:35, 8 May 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. 49p (talk) 19:37, 8 May 2024 (UTC), per nom
  2. SailorGardevoir (talk) 00:25, 13 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 13:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Falls a little short in my opinion.Tabu Makiadi (talk) 00:28, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
  2. Not well-known enough, more of an alternative figure. Makkool (talk) 18:04, 30 August 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Visual artists and musicians removal

Latest comment: 1 month ago55 comments8 people in discussion

Remove Horiyoshi III

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 17:24, 5 August 2024 (UTC)

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Japanese tattoo artist. Made more sense when we had internal quotas, but his recognition seems regional at most.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 04:42, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 11:11, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 09:07, 21 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 02:05, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Lev Borodulin

PASSED
Removed 5-0. Makkool (talk) 17:24, 5 August 2024 (UTC)

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Russian and Israeli sports photographer. His article does not assert much vitality, and the Russian version is quite short too.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 04:42, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 11:11, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 09:07, 21 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. The article is barely intelligible. Aurangzebra (talk) 02:05, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
  5. Iostn (talk) 17:09, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Elizabeth Zimmermann

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 14:00, 30 September 2024 (UTC)

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British-born hand-knitting teacher and designer. Relatively obscure figure. Only 2 interwikis.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 04:42, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 11:11, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 09:07, 21 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. --Thi (talk) 20:56, 22 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Sailor Jerry   5

FAILED
Not removed 3-1. Makkool (talk) 14:00, 30 September 2024 (UTC)

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Another tattoo artist who probably doesn’t make the cut with the internal quotas gone.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 04:42, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 11:11, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 09:07, 21 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. High pageviews, may be a niche subject relatively speaking but that indicates he's important enough to list when we don't include many tatooists anyway. Iostn (talk) 17:09, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Remove Robert Trent Jones

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 14:00, 30 September 2024 (UTC)

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Golf course designer. I struggle to think he is among the 120 or so most important architects.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 04:42, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 11:11, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 09:07, 21 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. --Thi (talk) 20:57, 22 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Nico

PASSED
Removed 6-0. Makkool (talk) 11:33, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

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I appreciate the uniqueness of her discography, but she was never very successful, critically or commercially, and accusations of racism have tarnished her cult status. Falls a little short of other 1970s folk-rock artists we don’t have, like Jackson Browne, Randy Newman, and Bob Seger, and is included within the The Velvet Underground & Nico   5 article.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 04:42, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. 04:57, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makkool (talk) 11:11, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 09:07, 21 July 2024 (UTC)
  5. I think VU & Nico is sufficient, as she's rather niche outside of that. Iostn (talk) 17:09, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
  6. pbp 13:07, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Daniel O'Donnell

PASSED
Removed 5-0. Makkool (talk) 17:24, 5 August 2024 (UTC)

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Irish country singer. Stands out for his chart consistency, but not much else.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 04:42, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 11:11, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. pbp 19:11, 18 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 09:07, 21 July 2024 (UTC)
  5. Too regional in terms of success, even within the English-speaking world. Iostn (talk) 17:09, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Barry Manilow   5

PASSED
Not removed 1-3. Makkool (talk) 14:00, 30 September 2024 (UTC)

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We have excluded several musicians due to their lack of commercial success despite some critical recognition and influence. But what about the opposite? Let’s test this on someone whose lede admits he was “not a favorite artist of music critics”.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 04:42, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. His commercial success and popularity has been world-wide, and not limited to his country of origin. We shouldn't only list critical darlings. Makkool (talk) 11:11, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Iostn (talk) 17:09, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. --Thi (talk) 21:04, 22 September 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Remove Journey (band)   5

FAILED
Not removed 1-3. Makkool (talk) 17:24, 5 August 2024 (UTC)

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Similar to the above. Possible classic rock bias.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 04:42, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. I agree that there is likely a bias towards classic rock, but I say this one crosses the bar based on the impact of Don't Stop Believin', which has been inducted into the National Recording Registry for being culturally significant, and is also the best selling song digitally from the twentieth century in the United States. Similar bands from this time like Foreigner (band)   5, on the other hand, should be more likely candidates to be removed since they took way longer to get into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, have sold way less certified units than Journey, and don't have a song that even the government considers important. λ NegativeMP1 04:56, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per above. A popular artist on several continents, Europe and Asia too and not just North America. Makkool (talk) 11:11, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 17:09, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
Discuss

I need more guidance as to how many bands of each genre we want to list before I vote. pbp 15:34, 30 July 2024 (UTC)

I don't really think there's a definitive "we want this many" for each genre. But for me personally I'd only start voting to remove Journey if we decided to only have something like (for this example) 50 rock artists at V5, but before that point I'd say they should be listed before Foreigner, Boston, Chicago, and some others. λ NegativeMP1 17:08, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
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Remove Vanilla Ice

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 17:24, 5 August 2024 (UTC)

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Similar to the above. Today, he is largely a one-hit wonder, and the claim that he introduced the genre to White audiences has been exaggerated, given that the Beastie Boys went platinum in the 1980s.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 04:42, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 11:11, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 09:07, 21 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Iostn (talk) 17:09, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Bikini Kill

Latest comment: 2 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 15:42, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

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I loved their debut on Kill Rock Stars in 1993, and this band is influential to Riot grrrl era of music. But I think there are better ways of showcasing feminism in music, and this band is the weakest in the section it's currently listed. I don't believe this is a case where we list less commercially successful bands like Minor Threat   5, because they are the face of Hardcore punk   5 and DIY music. Bikini Kill is prominent in a sub-genre that we don't list, and we list some feminist bands already like Pussy Riot   5.

However I could be wrong, the cause seems like they have been lauded like Pitchfork giving their compilation album The Singles a perfect 10. I just don't think there's much justification to keep this band. Feel free to disagree.

Support
  1. 49p (talk) 16:12, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Support, too much of a niche artist. We used to list riot grrrl as a genre, but it got removed. Makkool (talk) 17:24, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 21:16, 23 August 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 01:55, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discussion
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Remove some world musicians

Latest comment: 1 month ago42 comments8 people in discussion

I hate to say this because we do need a more global array of people for this project, but I am coming across a lot of musicians with single digit interwikis. I am going to do a block request for each section and list the people I want removed along with the amount of interwikis they have.

Remove some non-Western art musicians

PASSED
All unstruck removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 17:10, 30 September 2024 (UTC)

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  1. Turgun Alimatov (3)
  2. Min Huifen (2)
  3. Daihachi Oguchi (3)
  4. Yatsuhashi Kengyo (5)
  5. Muthiah Bhagavatar (4)
  6. Buhurizade Mustafa Itri (2)
  7. Tanburi Büyük Osman Bey (0; already being discussed)

  1. K. P. H. Notoprojo   5 (5)
  2. Michio Miyagi   5 (8)
  3. Swathi Thirunal Rama Varma   5 (8)
  4. Mei Baojiu   5 (6)
  5. Farida Parveen   5 (6)
  6. Faramarz Payvar   5 (5)

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 01:41, 17 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Support all Makkool (talk) 19:44, 17 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. remove unstruck per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Support Turgun Alimatov (only 116 views in the past month) and Min Huifen (96). Iostn (talk) 23:04, 16 July 2024 (UTC)
  5. Remove the unstruck, except for Muthiah Bhagavatar and Buhurizade Mustafa Itri. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 04:04, 23 August 2024 (UTC)
  6. Support --Thi (talk) 20:37, 22 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Oppose removing Muthiah Bhagavatar and Buhurizade Mustafa Itri. Iostn (talk) 23:04, 16 July 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Remove some religious musicians

WITHDRAWN
Withdrawn by nom. Makkool (talk) 11:15, 19 June 2024 (UTC)

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  1. Shlomo Carlebach (musician) (9)
  2. Debbie Friedman   5 (8)
  3. William Billings   5 (9)
  4. Raihan   5 (6)
  5. Junoon (band)   5 (8)
Support

#SailorGardevoir (talk) 01:41, 17 June 2024 (UTC)

I hereby withdraw this proposal. SailorGardevoir (talk) 23:44, 18 June 2024 (UTC)
  1. Keep Shlomo Carlebach ("the foremost Jewish religious songwriter of the 20th century") and Junoon ("Pakistan's and one of South Asia's most successful bands"), remove the rest. Makkool (talk) 19:44, 17 June 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Lord Kitchener (calypsonian)   5

FAILED
Not removed 3-1. Makkool (talk) 17:10, 30 September 2024 (UTC)

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Luckily for the Caribbean section, Kitchener is the only one with less than ten interwikis (4).

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 01:41, 17 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 19:44, 17 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Regardless of interwikis he is quite clearly influential in the development of calypso, and pageviews are far higher than many of the others being proposed here. Iostn (talk) 23:04, 16 July 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Remove the entire klezmer sectionSwap Dave Tarras with Giora Feidman

NO CONSENSUS
Not swapped 2-0. Makkool (talk) 17:10, 30 September 2024 (UTC)

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I'm already requesting the removal of Josef Gusikov, but the other two (Naftule Brandwein   5 and Dave Tarras   5) also have single digit interwikis (9 and 3 respectively). On second thought, I am just going to nominate Tarras for removal. To keep Brandwein from being lonely, I am also going to advocate adding Giora Feidman. I think Fiedman the only klezmer musician with double-digit interwiki figures.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 01:41, 17 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Support swap Makkool (talk) 19:44, 17 June 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss

@User:Makkool, proposal has been changed. SailorGardevoir (talk) 23:44, 18 June 2024 (UTC)

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Remove some non-English pop musicians

PARTIALLY PASSED
APO Hiking Society (3-1), Vital Signs (3-1) and Azam Khan (2-1) not removed. The rest unstruck removed with at least 4 supporting votes and 1 opposing vote at most. Makkool (talk) 17:10, 30 September 2024 (UTC)

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

  1. Phyu Phyu Kyaw Thein (2)
  2. Azam Khan (singer)   5 (3)
  3. Vital Signs (band)   5 (3)
  4. Lee Mi-ja (4)
  5. Awie (5)
  6. KRU (2)
  7. Sharifah Aini (3)
  8. Sarantuya (7)
  9. Muboraksho Mirzoshoyev (8)
  10. Gru (rapper) (2)
  11. W. D. Amaradeva (4)
  12. Clarence Wijewardena (2)
  13. APO Hiking Society   5 (3)

  1. Gong Qiuxia   5 (9)
  2. Teng Yu-hsien   5 (7)
  3. Boudewijn de Groot   5 (8)
  4. Irakli Charkviani   5 (7)
  5. Kaveret   5 (9)
  6. Vali Rácz   5 (6)
  7. Abrar-ul-Haq   5 (8)
  8. Narayan Gopal   5 (9)
  9. Aruna Lama   5 (8)
  10. Dewa 19   5 (8)
  11. Didi Kempot   5 (9)
  12. Koes Plus   5 (5)
  13. Ichirō Fujiyama   5 (6)
  14. Michiya Mihashi   5 (8)
  15. Pink Lady (duo)   5 (9)
  16. The Stalin   5 (7)
  17. Ros Serey Sothea   5 (9)
  18. Drunken Tiger   5 (8)
  19. Shin Joong-hyun   5 (7)
  20. Cartola   5 (9)
  21. Lydia Mendoza   5 (6)
  22. Menudo (group)   5 (5)
  23. Felipe Pinglo Alva (9)
  24. Rodrigo (musician)   5 (7)
  25. Vikingarna (band)   5 (8)
  26. Eraserheads   5 (6)

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 01:41, 17 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Keep APO Hiking Society, Vital Signs and Azam Khan - remove the rest. Makkool (talk) 19:44, 17 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. Support removing Phyu Phyu Kyaw Thein (unclear if she is one of the most notable Burmese pop musicians), Muboraksho Mirzoshoyev and Sarantuya.
  4. Remove unstruck, except for Khan. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 04:06, 23 August 2024 (UTC)
  5. Support --Thi (talk) 20:40, 22 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Oppose removing Azam Khan, Vital Signs, Lee Mi-ja (Trot is an important older form of Korean pop music), Awie, W. D. Amaradeva and APO Hiking Society.
Discuss
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Remove some African musicians

PASSED
All unstruck removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 17:10, 30 September 2024 (UTC)

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  1. Christy Essien-Igbokwe (6)
  2. Mahmoud Guinia (4)
  3. Lady Jaydee (3)
  4. Le Grand Kallé (4)
  5. E. T. Mensah (3)
  6. Daniel Owino Misiani (3)
  7. Ayub Ogada (6)
  8. Wazimbo (3)

  1. Ayinde Barrister   5 (6)
  2. Diamond Platnumz   5 (9)
  3. Eusèbe Jaojoby   5 (7)
  4. Jua Cali   5 (5)
  5. Mamady Keïta   5 (7)
  6. Tunde King   5 (5)
  7. Mahotella Queens   5 (8)
  8. Thomas Mapfumo   5 (9)
  9. Siti binti Saad   5 (9)
  10. Tilahun Gessesse   5 (7)
  11. Lourdes Van-Dúnem   5 (8)

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 01:41, 17 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Support all. Makkool (talk) 19:44, 17 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. remove unstruck per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Support Mahmoud Guinia, Lady Jaydee, Daniel Owino Misiani and Wazimbo. Iostn (talk) 23:04, 16 July 2024 (UTC)
  5. Support --Thi (talk) 20:41, 22 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Oppose removing Ayub Ogada and Le Grand Kallé. Iostn (talk) 23:04, 16 July 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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General comments

I really do not understand why this is being judged using interwikis as the sole metric for measuring vitality, not to mention that bloc nominations have been criticised many times before for being hard to implement on voting. Another massive problem with this is for the "African popular music" section, where you are using interwiki links to measure vitality while African languages are notorious for being underrepresented and thus automatically have a disadvantage if you are using those to measure vitality - as can be seen by the fact that the number of those nominated for removal equals half the entire articles listed in the section. As such I'm effectively opposing all of these proposals in the current state, at least until they are being looked at individually. Iostn (talk) 10:02, 18 June 2024 (UTC)

I expressed concerns for this type of viewpoint on a different proposal on a different talk page. Per WP:SYSBIAS, it is proven that Wikipedia has a general bias against developing nations and leaves their articles generally less developed. This also applies to whether or not the articles exist on other language Wikipedias. Also speaking from that viewpoint, some of these proposals would leave Western musicians, an already messy session, vastly over-represented. I can get behind using interwikis for some proposals (it made sense for stuff like the television hosts), but it just doesn't make sense her per the SYSBIAS essay. λ NegativeMP1 16:48, 18 June 2024 (UTC)
Where have bloc nominations been criticised? I don't take a stand on systemic bias, but if we intend to make any progress in cutting the sections over-quota by over a hundred articles, we need to think of new ideas than having just individual nominations. Makkool (talk) 17:05, 18 June 2024 (UTC)
I can agree with you on that, as I do think massive cuts are needed, but my concern is more or less that we should be cautious, and interwikis may not be the best metric for 100% of nominations. λ NegativeMP1 18:11, 18 June 2024 (UTC)
Regardless of country of origin, having 0 or 1 interwikis is a red flag. If you want to compensate for underrepresentation of Africans, maybe the rule of thumb should be 5 interwikis in the Third World and 10 in the First... pbp 23:02, 18 June 2024 (UTC)

@User:Makkool, @Iostn, @User:NegativeMP1: After much thought, I decided to withdraw my nominations for mostly everyone with more than five interwikis due to the issues brought up (so just close my religious section request). I am also withdrawing my nominations for K. P. H. Notoprojo (he is probably the biggest name in gamelan), Faramarz Payvar (his Persian article kind of indicates he is a major Persian traditional musician), Koes Plus (six of their albums are on Rolling Stone Indonesia's 150 Greatest Indonesian Albums of All Time list), Menudo (one of the biggest boy bands), Jua Cali (represents genge), and Tunde King (founder of jùjú music). I'm still going to nominate those with less than five interwikis (that's still too small to be on here), along with Yatsuhashi Kengyo (stub), Awie (does not have at Rate Your Music page, although his previous band Wings does have one), Sarantuya (stub), Muboraksho Mirzoshoyev (does not have at Rate Your Music page), Christy Essien-Igbokwe (she was originally listed under the music industry figures for reasons I just can't find), and Ayub Ogada (I'm not seeing anything that makes him vital). SailorGardevoir (talk) 23:44, 18 June 2024 (UTC)

I've finally gone through and attempted to vote on these, but I think many of those that were withdrawn could've easily gone anyways, regardless of however many times the article has been translated. Iostn (talk) 23:04, 16 July 2024 (UTC)

Remove some British Prime Ministers

Latest comment: 1 month ago33 comments6 people in discussion

These PMs only had the position for about a year or so.

Remove Spencer Compton, 1st Earl of Wilmington

PASSED
Removed 4-1. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 22:26, 5 October 2024 (UTC)

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Only about seventeen months.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 21:02, 28 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 07:19, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. --Thi (talk) 20:43, 22 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. pbp 15:54, 17 September 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Remove William Cavendish, 4th Duke of Devonshire

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 22:26, 5 October 2024 (UTC)

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Only seven months.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 23:25, 28 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 07:19, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. --Thi (talk) 20:43, 22 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove John Stuart, 3rd Earl of Bute

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 22:26, 5 October 2024 (UTC)

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Only about eleven months.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 00:39, 29 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 07:19, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. --Thi (talk) 20:43, 22 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Charles Watson-Wentworth, 2nd Marquess of Rockingham

PASSED
Removed 4-1. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 22:26, 5 October 2024 (UTC)

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Only has an accumulated tenure of fifteen months.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 02:22, 29 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 07:19, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. --Thi (talk) 20:50, 22 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. pbp 15:54, 17 September 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Remove Augustus FitzRoy, 3rd Duke of Grafton

PASSED
Removed 4-1. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 22:26, 5 October 2024 (UTC)

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Only about fifteen months.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 05:45, 29 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 07:19, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. --Thi (talk) 20:43, 22 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. pbp 15:54, 17 September 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Remove William Petty, 2nd Earl of Shelburne

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 22:26, 5 October 2024 (UTC)

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Only about eight months.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 06:13, 29 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 07:19, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. --Thi (talk) 20:43, 22 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Latest comment: 1 month ago24 comments5 people in discussion

Remove Joan Armatrading

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 19:28, 19 July 2024 (UTC)

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I don't see anything at all to indicate vitality. No Grammies, no #1 single or album, nothing.

Support
  1. pbp 19:48, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 19:54, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. I think she was just put on here to fill up the Caribbean section, which as I mentioned when I moved her to the general pop section, she did not fit beyond being born there. SailorGardevoir (talk) 20:40, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discussion
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Remove Al Bowlly

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 19:28, 19 July 2024 (UTC)

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Maybe it's because his article's poorly written, but I'm not seeing enough evidence that he's VA5. Only 11 interwikis which is underwhelming for a pop figure. pbp 19:48, 25 June 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. pbp 19:48, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 19:54, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. I think he's the biggest name in British dance band? But yeah, just remove him. SailorGardevoir (talk) 20:40, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discussion
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Remove The Shirelles   5

NO CONSENSUS
Not removed 3-0. Makkool (talk) 17:13, 9 October 2024 (UTC)

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Doesn't have the acclaim of some of the other groups on here. pbp 19:48, 25 June 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. pbp 19:48, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 19:54, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discussion

On the one hand, they recorded "Will You Love Me Tomorrow" and "Tonight's the Night". On the other hand, they were not as big as The Supremes or as critically loved as The Ronettes. Neutral overall. SailorGardevoir (talk) 20:40, 25 June 2024 (UTC)

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Remove The Wiggles   5

FAILED
Not removed 1-3. Makkool (talk) 13:35, 20 July 2024 (UTC)

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Very little chart success in Australia and almost none outside of it. pbp 19:48, 25 June 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. pbp 19:48, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. The article demonstates their influence well. Children's music is a genre where vitality doesn't translate well to chart success. We should also list some other children's music artist besides Alvin and the Chipmunks. Makkool (talk) 19:54, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per Makkool. If we're judging solely within the context of children's music, they're the biggest act of all time. SailorGardevoir (talk) 20:40, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 00:24, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
Discussion

pbp 19:48, 25 June 2024 (UTC)

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Computer scientist and programmer additions

Latest comment: 1 month ago10 comments6 people in discussion

Add Dan Bricklin   5

PASSED
Added 4-0. Makkool (talk) 18:13, 11 October 2024 (UTC)

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The developer of Visicalc, dubbed "the father of the spreadsheet".

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 17:13, 5 September 2024 (UTC)
  2. Iostn (talk) 09:37, 18 September 2024 (UTC)
  3. --Thi (talk) 21:15, 22 September 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 16:09, 3 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discuss
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Add John Vincent Atanasoff   5

PASSED
Added 4-0. Makkool (talk) 19:18, 27 September 2024 (UTC)

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Credited as the inventor of the first digital computer.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 17:25, 5 September 2024 (UTC)
  2. Glaring omission, considering Atanasoff–Berry computer   5 is vital 49p (talk) 18:59, 9 September 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 09:37, 18 September 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 19:04, 20 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discuss
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Add Hassan al-Banna

Latest comment: 1 month ago5 comments4 people in discussion
PASSED
Added 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 22:36, 5 October 2024 (UTC)

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Founder of the Muslim Brotherhood   5. His ideas shaped the modern discourse on the intersection of Islam and politics.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 15:34, 11 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. SailorGardevoir (talk) 00:26, 13 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 13:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 03:37, 30 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Kevin Poulsen

Latest comment: 1 month ago5 comments4 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 22:26, 5 October 2024 (UTC)

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Not actually that important as a hacker (he is currently listed under "computer crimes") and his subsequent journalism career which he is actually more notable for itself doesn't seem to be enough to make the cut (he is simply a "contributing editor", and has been involved a few major/majorish cases mentioned but that's it)

Support
  1. Nom Iostn (talk) 16:59, 26 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 15:51, 27 May 2024 (UTC)
  3. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 00:33, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
  4. --Thi (talk) 20:45, 22 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Hu Ronghua

Latest comment: 1 month ago6 comments5 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 4-1. Makkool (talk) 17:19, 30 September 2024 (UTC)

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Stub and only has 7 interwikis.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 07:36, 7 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint 02:08, 14 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. Xiangqi   4 might be level 4 but it is certaintly not on the same level as Chess   4 since it is only contained in one (large) country. These titles, the X, the best player of a famous sport, of Y, a niche sport, are thrown around a lot, so I don't think is meaningfull. The Blue Rider   21:52, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
    Also the citation that support that he is often considered the Bobby Fischer of Xiangqi doesn't actually support that, the source in question just says he is the Bobby Fischer...so it doesn't support the often. The Blue Rider   22:06, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
  4. --Thi (talk) 20:47, 22 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. He is considered the Bobby Fischer   4 of Xiangqi   4 (aka Chinese chess) and even had an effect on the rules of the game. Also, the article is not a stub and I have reassessed it as Start-Class. QuicoleJR (talk) 16:18, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Remove Guo Qiru, Hou Baolin, and Katsura Bunshi VI

Latest comment: 1 month ago5 comments4 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 17:21, 30 September 2024 (UTC)

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I get the desire to be diverse, and the native versions of Hou's and especially Katsura's articles are in much better shape, but they each only have two to three interwikis.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 03:25, 9 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 18:06, 10 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 06:27, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. --Thi (talk) 20:52, 22 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Rock Steady Crew and Crazy Legs (dancer)

Latest comment: 1 month ago6 comments4 people in discussion
PASSED
Both removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 17:16, 30 September 2024 (UTC)

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I hate to do this, because I have heard people consider the Rock Steady Crew and Crazy Legs in particular as being very important to the development of breakdancing. But the Rock Steady Crew is in piss poor shape and only has eight interwikis, while Crazy Legs (whose article is at least decent) only has four.

Support
  1. Reluctantly. SailorGardevoir (talk) 04:43, 14 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 12:56, 15 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 00:34, 14 August 2024 (UTC)
  4. --Thi (talk) 20:53, 22 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Lady Jane Grey

Latest comment: 2 months ago5 comments4 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 12:01, 17 September 2024 (UTC)

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Unlike Empress Matilda, whose claim to the throne lasted for years, Grey's claim to the throne only lasted for nine days.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 05:58, 28 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 07:19, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:54, 23 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Weezer  5

Latest comment: 1 month ago6 comments5 people in discussion
PASSED
Added 5-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 22:38, 5 October 2024 (UTC)

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Not sure why these guys arent listed? Weezer (Blue Album) and Pinkerton (album) are considered to one of the greatest album of 1990s. Not to mention, but Pinkerton (album) is extremely known to be influential in Emo   5 and Alternative rock   5. I even think Pinkerton is possibly enough on its own to be vital. I guess these guys are ignored because popularity ≠ vitality, but I think they have a chance here.

Support
  1. 49p (talk) 17:50, 2 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. I could also see a case for Pinkerton being vital, since it alone seems to have been decently influential, has a lot of post-release acclaim, and a perfect 100 on Metacritic. λ NegativeMP1 02:31, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. Aurangzebra (talk) 06:15, 17 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Support. There are many rock albums/songs I would list before Pinkerton or their debut though. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 01:56, 21 September 2024 (UTC)
  5. --Thi (talk) 20:53, 22 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Tron (hacker)

Latest comment: 1 month ago8 comments5 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 22:29, 5 October 2024 (UTC)

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Other than maybe his naming controversy, I don't think he's vital. We have too many phreakers in this list. I don't think he's the notable levels of John Draper   5 and I never heard of his name.

Support
  1. 49p (talk) 17:37, 2 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 07:48, 6 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 06:29, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. --Thi (talk) 20:53, 22 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss

Might I suggest swapping for Markus Hess, who was involved in a significent espionage incident? Iostn (talk) 17:09, 29 July 2024 (UTC)

His case seems big, but I'm not sure about his legacy. To be fair, I don't thinks any computer hacker's legacy are big as Kevin Mitnick   5 or even Gary McKinnon   5. Which sucks, cause I honestly never heard of this guy and he seems very talented.
I honestly think computer hackers should be reduced. It should be around the numbers of the espionage section, which has eight articles. Those eight articles are arguably important to each country's history, and I feel like hackers should be like that. 49p (talk) 17:34, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
fwiw, I think there should actually be more entries listed under espionage (even though in many cases there's an overlap with other fields) Iostn (talk) 18:07, 29 July 2024 (UTC)
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Add Keir Starmer

Latest comment: 1 month ago3 comments2 people in discussion
NO CONSENSUS
Not added, 1-0 or 1-1. Likely should be revisited in 2025 if he's served longer pbp 19:28, 1 October 2024 (UTC)

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New UK prime minister.

Support
  1. As nom. Kevinishere15 (talk) 21:50, 8 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss

If he lasts into 2025... pbp 01:39, 9 July 2024 (UTC)

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Add Walter Mondale  5

Latest comment: 1 month ago6 comments4 people in discussion
PASSED
Added 4-0. Makkool (talk) 18:16, 11 October 2024 (UTC)

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Attorney general of Minnesota, junior senator from Minnesota, VP of the United States. Page exists in 70 Wikis and has received a little over 100,000 page viewes in the past 30 days. Mondale was mentioned as a non vital politician in an attempt to remove Mitt Romney. I argued that Mondale should be added. Questions? four Olifanofmrtennant (she/her) 20:36, 24 September 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nominator. Questions? four Olifanofmrtennant (she/her) 23:51, 24 September 2024 (UTC)
  2. Never should've been removed pbp 23:47, 24 September 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 20:30, 3 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. Politicians and leaders in 2394/2400. We can re-include him. Makkool (talk) 13:27, 4 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
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Remove H. G. Peter

Latest comment: 1 month ago6 comments5 people in discussion
PASSED
Removed 5-0. Makkool (talk) 15:54, 6 October 2024 (UTC)

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Interestingly, the Wonder Woman article mentions him only once in the article's body, and in the first sentence. We already list William Moulton Marston   5, who is more generally regarded as the creator.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 02:04, 21 September 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 13:51, 21 September 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 19:52, 21 September 2024 (UTC)
  4. Makkool (talk) 20:03, 21 September 2024 (UTC)
  5. --Thi (talk) 21:18, 22 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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