Talk:Myanmar civil war (2021–present)

Map edits (August)

August has passed with continued resistance gains! With this month's updates I've been trying to iron out mistakes and issues with the map. Honestly, all that I've found is that PDF control in Magway-Sagaing-Mandalay is likely far too overblown in some areas and too small in others.

Nitpicks, Suggestions, and Maps:

• I've warmed up to the "labeling the different groups", it is actually a bit helpful. One problem, its so inconsistent! Both in text size and abbreviations. Why not they all be the same size, and why not all of them either be abbreviated or written out in full (abbreviations are probably easier)?
• Khampat is in Sagaing Region, and is controlled by PDF
• KIA not encircled Mansi
• KIA is active in vast parts of Sagaing Region, like Pinlebu, Indaw, and Shwe Pyi Aye. On the map, is showing PDF or KIA control more important? Perhaps we should do what many maps do and show joint control in the regions both control.
• KIA/PDF stable contested control in Maw Luu and Shwe Pyi Aye https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/kia-resists-juntas-offensive-recapture-strategic-towns-critical-regimes-supply-lines
• KNLA don’t control Kamarmaung
• TNLA/PDF stable contested control in Mogok and Nawnghkio
• Both the RCSS and SSPP likely, in my opinion, control way more than is shown. In central Shan, I'd say that the junta only has major control on the towns and roads, with the RCSS and SSPP controlling most of the countryside (similar to this map by firefly-in-red https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/s/dfrFF4iOZq)
• Junta control in Tapayin area
• Junta control in Bhamo area
• Nathan R. map also shows junta control around Myingyan https://www.google.com/maps/d/u/0/viewer?mid=1cTxsrLmndZrGxHGsz6Dl6rFN78Hacss&amp%3Bll=20.51837580228517%2C97.1300182245997&amp%3Bz=6&ll=21.36225529207786%2C95.36538696185849&z=9
• Southern Wa State based on this map, which also shows the RCSS bases at Loi Tai Leng, Loi Moong Merng, Loi Hsarm Hsip, Loi Gawwan, and Loi Lam. https://www.burmalibrary.org/sites/burmalibrary.org/files/obl/5-23-2019-SSRC-SHRF-Press-release-Eng-report.pdf
• My personal map(s) https://imgur.com/a/august-myanmar-map-suggestions-uBfs3SY https://imgur.com/a/august-clean-map-HsjUlD8 (also don’t just blindly follow my map if you’re planning on doing edits, do your own research because it’s quite likely that I’ve made mistakes on the map)

Indisputable Edits:

• PDF capture bases near Natogyi and Taungtha (also control rural Myingyan District) https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/pdf-groups-seize-guard-posts-for-chinese-pipeline-facilities-in-myanmars-mandalay-region.html
• PDF capture Nga Myar Village Tract https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/myanmars-civilian-government-aims-to-liberate-district-in-southern-mandalay.html
• PDF capture Tagaung https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/pdf-forces-capture-tagaung-town-mandalay-region
• PDF in Oat Pho Su https://myanmar-now.org/en/news/major-clashes-reported-as-myanmar-resistance-forces-gain-foothold-in-bago-yoma/
• PDF capture area near Inle Lake (Also PNA in Nyaungshwe township) https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/anti-regime-groups-seize-myanmar-junta-positions-in-southern-shan-state.html
• PDF capture Thabeikkyin (excluding military school) https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/myanmar-civilian-government-announces-seizure-of-district-level-town.html
• KIA-PDF attack Indaw, capture Naba intersection https://bur.mizzima.com/2024/08/17/30348 https://www.bbc.com/burmese/articles/cvg39kw8rpjo https://myanmar-now.org/en/news/fierce-battle-rages-as-myanmar-resistance-forces-advance-on-strategic-northern-sagaing-town/
• KIA/PDF launch assault on Htigyaing, with Mya Taung being captured by KIA https://mmpeacemonitor.org/329984/renewed-battle-to-capture-htigyaing-resumes/ https://bur.mizzima.com/2024/08/23/30919
• KIA/PDF launch assault on Pinlebu, encircling and capturing most of the town https://burmese.kachinnews.com/2024/08/23/am1-171/ https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/myanmar-resistance-encircles-three-sagaing-towns-amid-junta-bombardment.html
• KIA has controlled Nam Phat Kar since January https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/burma/junta-battalion-controlling-myanmar-china-trade-route-surrenders-to-kia.html https://myanmar.iiss.org/updates/2024-07
• KIA captured Sin Khan Bridge, cutting off Shwegu from Mansi https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/burma/kia-takes-four-towns-over-80-myanmar-junta-bases-since-launching-offensive-two-months-ago.html
• KIA captured La Maw Kone https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/kia-two-major-myanmar-junta-bases-seized-in-jade-hub.html
• KIA completes capture of Momauk https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/kia-momauk-township-seized-from-myanmar-junta.html
• KNLA control Taungdun, and have encircled Anankwin village https://www.bbc.com/burmese/articles/ce9zd5kk4lko
• KNLA/SAC clashes along Payathonzu-Thanbyuzayat Road https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/intensifying-clashes-payathonzu-thanbyuzayat-road-escalate-casualties
• KNLA/SAC clashes in Zayatkyi https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/burma/battle-for-bago-escalates-knu-says-myanmars-junta-on-verge-of-being-wiped-out.html
• TNLA attack Hsipaw https://www.bbc.com/burmese/articles/c4gex0rdgp5o
• TNLA attack Taung Kham https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/tnla-reportedly-captures-two-more-junta-bases-in-shan-states-nawnghkio.html
• MNDAA captured Nawngkawgyi https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/mndaa-seizes-juntas-147th-light-infantry-battalion-hsipaw-shan-state
• MNDAA controls Hsengkiao https://burmese.shannews.org/archives/42763
• AA in 105-Mile https://eng.mizzima.com/2024/08/11/12703
• AA captured Kyeintali https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/arakan-army-captures-town-in-far-south-of-myanmars-rakhine-state.html
• AA advanced to “32 km” north of Gwa https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/fighting-flares-in-gwa-southernmost-township-in-myanmars-rakhine-state.html
• No more clashes in Taungup https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/in-myanmar-the-war-for-rakhine-has-reached-its-southernmost-tip.html
• AA captured Gyeiktaw/Ngapali Beach https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/aa-launches-offensive-capture-junta-naval-base-thandwe-township-arakan-state
• AA captured last junta holdout in Thandwe https://bur.mizzima.com/2024/08/28/31441
• PNA/PNLA clashes in Loihtwea and Naung Kyaw Village-tract https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/people-face-difficulties-fleeing-fighting-hsihseng-town-southern-shan-state https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/burma/over-10000-villagers-flee-for-second-time-as-fighting-returns-to-myanmars-hsihseng.html
• KNDF attack Linlan and Sangka area, Nyangshwe Township (also mentions PNA in Nyangshwe) https://burmese.dvb.no/post/661199
• Clashes in Mobye https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/junta-intensifies-airlifts-weapons-and-ammunition-422nd-light-infantry-battalion-near-karenni
• No more clashes in Tedim https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/most-residents-have-returned-tedim-township-chin-state
• SSPP/RCSS clashes in Lai Kam, Kunhing Township https://burmese.shannews.org/archives/43098
• SSPP/RCSS clashes in Wan Sein, Kyethi Township https://burmese.shannews.org/archives/43176
• SSPP/RCSS clashes in several Lawksawk township villages https://burmese.shannews.org/archives/42947
• SSPP control Metlan, He Hseng village-tract and Mansae village-tract https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/military-council-suffers-high-casualties-laihka-township-battle

Disputable Edits:

• DKBA maybe control Three Pagodas and Payathonzu? Honestly this source just confused me https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/three-pagodas-pass-border-gate-reopened-after-two-month-closure
• Mone might have been recaptured by junta https://elevenmyanmar.com/news/security-operations-underway-in-mone-as-military-regains-control-of-local-battalion-sac

Disputable "Disputed" Towns: (The issues I've found with the many of the towns supposedly being fought over in Magway-Sagaing-Mandalay region)
No fighting in past 4 months = X: This is more about a lack of sources to back it up, as I could not find sources about the towns labeled X.
(This part is a bit low quality as I was tired making it, also some of the settlements on this list are for the Template:detailed map. I'd suggest doing research if you're skeptical about one of my claims.)

• Kyadet: No evidence of PDF capture. Junta active in town as of November https://www.rfa.org/english/news/myanmar/nug-army-11272023050518.html/ampRFA
• Katha: Yes https://eng.mizzima.com/2024/08/28/13336
• Taungtha: Recent (unconfirmed) fighting https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/myanmar-junta-loses-grip-on-major-mandalay-region-town-resistance.html
• Budalin: June https://eng.mizzima.com/2024/07/06/11469
• Yedashe: April https://www.rfa.org/english/news/myanmar/bago-04232024143527.html/ampRFA
• Shwe Pyi Aye: No mentions since April
• Min Ywar: Only evidence of capture https://www.reddit.com/r/Myanmarcombatfootage/s/w51oCWYcEk
• Kalay: No
• Kanbulu: No https://myanmar-now.org/en/news/myanmar-junta-expands-military-presence-in-sagaing-region/
• Taze: No (?) https://myanmar-now.org/en/news/myanmar-junta-establishes-defensive-perimeter-around-taze/
• Myingyan: No
• Natogyi: No fighting since junta recapture
• Maw Luu: Most recent mention I can find gives no mention of clashes https://eng.mizzima.com/2024/08/28/13336
• Bawlakhe: No https://eng.mizzima.com/2024/06/30/11278
• Tabayin: No fighting since junta recapture
• Launglon: No
• Tarwertaing: ?
• Tantabin: X
• Mingin: X
• Hpruso: X
• Shwegu: X
• Khin-U: X
• Kani: X
• Wetlet: X
• Ayadaw: X
• Gangaw: X
• Yinmabin: X
• Pale: X
• Salingyi: X
• Chaung-U: X
• Htilin: X
• Zee Pyar: X
• Pauk: X
• Saw: X
• Seikphyu: X

IdioticAnarchist (talk) 15:56, 31 August 2024 (UTC)

Re: labels; I sized them differently based on my perceived "relevance". Like Indian Insurgent Groups or NDA-K being at the same size as SAC might not work. I think written out is better and can standardise so that it's all un-abbreviated and at max 3 different sizes. (gonna switch out "Karenni resistance" for Karenni IEC.

When the first version of this map was made, we kind of arbitrarily drew lines where there was joint territorial control on the Thomas Linge map. We can do a pattern but it might map the map look even messier.

Your maps are helpful! But yes, to confirm to any other readers who back-verify, I've been going off the sources mentioned. I think Sagaing was something we didn't touch mostly because it didn't show up in headlines as much.

Re: DKBA/KNA in Payathonzu I believe last month we had news about KNLA essentially controlling the area, but it's a similar situation to Myawaddy pre-KNA seizure from what I've heard. But I don't remember where I read that.

I can likely make these changes Tuesday; more to follow. Just wanted to express my thoughts if any one else tackles it in the meantime. EmeraldRange (talk/contribs) 21:51, 31 August 2024 (UTC)

Most of those "disputed" dots are because of clashes in the township, not necessarily the township centre. Borysk5 (talk) 10:20, 1 September 2024 (UTC)

They should still be changed though, considering its misinforming readers. IdioticAnarchist (talk) 00:18, 2 September 2024 (UTC)

Things that I didn't change:

• Re: Acronyms; I've left acronyms in where it would just be too long to fit otherwise, standardised everything to 14pt or 9pt font
• Joint control IMO is more important to show when two factions who might fight otherwise have agreed to join control like in Mongyai, Tangyan and Kutkai. It's simpler/more communicative not to put joint control for groups that are working together (e.g. Singu is also TNLA to some extent, Lailenpi is AA joint to some extent). It's harder to have hard evidence of joint control in rural areas (like shown on Thomas' map for example). The joint controls are really more of a de jure question rather than a de facto overview of control. Especially since PDFs are, de facto, local units using the same name not an organised army. Even in the case for this month, the Maw Luu update would be more accurate to show ABSDF (https://myanmar-now.org/en/news/myanmar-army-launches-offensive-to-retake-maw-luu-from-resistance/) not PDF if we want to go into de jure control.
• RCSS & SSPP definitely control more but unfortunately, user-generated content from weibo is not an RS for wikipedia. As such, I haven't changed the SSPP-RCSS control based on that map
• Unfortunately Nathan Ruser doesn't publish those maps elsewhere as far as I can tell, user-generated content on twitter or google maps is not an RS for wikipedia. Maybe we can pressure ASPI to publish them.
• Nyaungshwe news says 32 km from Nyaungshwe. Irresponsible reporting; it's nowhere near Inle Lake (also already represented by the PDF blob west of Inle)
• Loihtwea already on the PNLA/PNA border
• Some sources showing contestation in Sagaing towns: Tabayin contestation, Myinmu contestation

EmeraldRange (talk/contribs) 20:34, 2 September 2024 (UTC)

For clarity and future reference I've put the full list of changes I made below:

• Labels size standardised, Karenni resistance -> Karenni IEC
• Maw Luu and Shwe Pyi Aye shown as stable control by KIA and PDF respectively (https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/kia-resists-juntas-offensive-recapture-strategic-towns-critical-regimes-supply-lines)
• Road from Kamarmaung to Hpapun controlled by SAC up to 5 miles south of the Hpapun downtown
• Updated Wa South based on 2019 source from SHRF; left area east of Mong Hsat as before since this paper is focused on Loi Tai Leng and Mong Hta and the pre-existing borders were from another paper focused on far eastern shan with NDAA and Wa-South.
• PDF contested Indaw, Pinlebu, Natogyi and Taungtha
• PDF expanded PDF control in Myingyan District, including Ngarmyar; in Bago Yoma expanded towards Letpadan/Oatphosu
• PDF takes Tagaung and Thabeikkyin (but not two military schools on the 311)
• Junta regains ofKyadet. Junta regains control by default since no mention for at least three months the following: Budalin, Kanbulu, Tabayin, Shwegu, Kani, Wetlet, Ayadaw, Gangaw, Yinmabin. (Note: found unreliable sources showing contestation for Myaung, Khin-U so kept as it used to be; rural territories kept unchanged, as sources found variously for rural villages contestation)
• KIA control near Namphatkar expanded to include Namphatkar
• Shwegu-Mansi road runs south of the river, moved junta control; Sin Khan capture gives KIA control of rural areas north of river
• KIA contests Hpakant, captures Momauk
• KNLA/MNSP control near Anankwin updated as KNLA contests the village and takes Taungzun
• KNLA expands control near Zayatgyi, Htantabin Township and loses Mone
• TNLA takes Hispaw town, but surrounding areas still contested
• TNLA expands control south of Nawnghkio up to Myitnge river
• MNDAA controls southeast of Hsipaw in Hsengkiao and Nawngkawgyi
• AA control in "105-mile", Muse Township added; expanded in Kyeintali down to 20 miles north of Gwa
• Junta regains control of Taungup and Tedim
• KNDF control expanded, east of Mobye Lake near Linlan village tract
• Junta stable control in Hpruso due to lack of reporting of clash or capture in 4 months.
• SSPP territory near Kholam updated based on roads and fighting in Lai Kam, Kunhing; Laihka township villages

Other Rakhine changes were made by @Borysk5 and verified by me. EmeraldRange (talk/contribs) 20:35, 2 September 2024 (UTC)

Great map as usual! There's just a few things I noticed.

• RCSS bases along Myanmar-Thailand border not shown (shown in the SHRF source, labeled as IDP camps but stated to be controlled by RCSS)
• AA captured Ngapali beach and other junta holdout in Thandwe
• Isn't this map based off of user-generated content from Twitter? Thomas Van Linge, to my knowledge, doesn't post his maps in any "formal" way (I could be wrong though). If the map is based of a Twitter map created by a journalist, why cant we update it using a Twitter map created by a journalist?
• Moebye should be disputed
• KIA in Nam Phat Kar not shown

Like I said, great map as usual! IdioticAnarchist (talk) 03:29, 5 September 2024 (UTC)

• Ah yeah RCSS IDP control can be added
• I thought that hold out was the naval base not the beach. Beach is taken
• Fair point, though it was originally because there were so few maps. I can incorporate Ruser at least
• source for Mobye?
• Nam Phat Kar is shown as KIA control. Your imgur map is looking at Namkham, Namphat kar is further east

EmeraldRange (talk/contribs) 16:18, 5 September 2024 (UTC)

• There were 2 holdouts, 1 at Ngapali (which is hidden by the A in Thandwe), and the other at Maung Shwe Lay Naval Base (little peninsula south of Thandwe). Ngapali has definitely been captured, but I amend my statement that MSL Naval Base has been captured, as I think clashes continue.
• Moebye https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/junta-intensifies-airlifts-weapons-and-ammunition-422nd-light-infantry-battalion-near-karenni
• I see Nam Phat Kar now, thanks

IdioticAnarchist (talk) 17:56, 5 September 2024 (UTC)

Map updated with:

• RCSS camps added on Wa-south border
• AA Ngapali updated
• Bhamo, Tabayin and Myingyan maps updated to correspond with Ruser sources
• Mobye contested

EmeraldRange (talk/contribs) 21:07, 5 September 2024 (UTC)

Additional section on junta offensive?

I’ve noticed that the last edit included a very narrow but deep push by the junta into KNLA-controlled territory. (Specifically, it looks like the offensive is heading towards the city of Papun.) Given that this is clearly something new that isn’t a regular engagement in the war, I feel like it should be added into the timeline (if it hasn’t already). LordOfWalruses (talk) 20:39, 28 September 2024 (UTC)

I thought that was already included somewhere. Truth be told the post Laukkai section is such a mess but this is what we get for all the broad analysis being hidden behind closed doors. 21:17, 28 September 2024 (UTC) EmeraldRange (talk/contribs) 21:17, 28 September 2024 (UTC)

Well that sounds like a rough situation. Hopefully a section on the Papun offensive can be found/made. LordOfWalruses (talk) 03:49, 29 September 2024 (UTC)

I'm quite sure that the junta already controlled this area before the edit, and the edit was just to clarify the area. IdioticAnarchist (talk) 20:14, 2 October 2024 (UTC)

I see. Any specific reason as to why the junta’s control penetrates so deep into KNLA territory like that, or is it just a coincidence? LordOfWalruses (talk) 21:51, 2 October 2024 (UTC)

I haven't really paid too much attention to the main article, I have a feeling when the aftermath of Yagi settles, there might be new reasons to make new sections. Atm the situation in Kayah state is a bit of an question mark considering the damage the typhoon has done with massive impact to civilians. Idk, but logically, one could imagine that it too could affect any potential offensives by either side. As to the current information, I would bake it into the current sections and just make the text flow logically. However if anyone wishes to make new section for the offensives by the Tatmadaw, then there's a source here with their names and other such. Kennet Mattfolk (talk) 18:57, 4 October 2024 (UTC)

Yeah that makes sense. I would appreciate more information as you listed, though that source should be taken with a pinch of salt considering how it’s an opinion piece. LordOfWalruses (talk) 00:49, 5 October 2024 (UTC)

The way I used it was for the names and a quote. Then stating it's an anasysis. I know wikipedia has it's source recomendations to editors, however, imo most are ok if one uses them properly for what they are. Kennet Mattfolk (talk) 09:15, 5 October 2024 (UTC)

References

Map change

Should we change the map to October? 38.123.109.228 (talk) 08:40, 18 October 2024 (UTC)

Done. Borysk5 (talk) 10:07, 20 October 2024 (UTC)

Can you perhaps fix the river near Chipwi? It looks a bit sloppy how the KIA borders cut the river off. Also, can you please cite your sources when editing the map? Other than that, thanks for updating it. I've been taking a break for a while to focus on school and stuff, but I plan on editing the article and helping with the map again soon. IdioticAnarchist (talk) 15:30, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Fixed EmeraldRange (talk/contribs) 01:07, 23 October 2024 (UTC)

The changes were sourced on the module edits. Chipwi and Tsawlaw ([1]), Pinlebu ([2]), Hsipaw ([3]), Pangwar ([4]). Borysk5 (talk) 16:00, 23 October 2024 (UTC)

Map Edits (Recent)

Sorry I took a long break y'all! I was focusing on school and stuff.

Nitpicks, Suggestions, and Maps:

• The junta still controls Wawley, Thabawtboe, Falu, Minletpan and Oo Ka Yit Hta in southern Myawaddy Township. https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/knla-coalition-takes-junta-artillery-base-lay-kay-kaw-karen-state https://burma.irrawaddy.com/news/2024/09/04/390018.html
• I'd say it's fair to move SSA/SSPP borders to the Lawksawk-Taungkham road (like what is shown in the Thomas Van Linge map), as the SSPP seem to control the area around the road. They definitely control northern Lawksawk (as does SSA/RCSS) https://burmese.shannews.org/archives/42947 https://burmese.shannews.org/archives/41627 https://burmese.shannews.org/archives/41836 https://burmese.shannews.org/archives/42505 https://burmese.shannews.org/archives/43098
• I've found no evidence that resistance controls Htee Khee or the Dawei-Htee Khee road.
• Resistance does not control Myotha https://myanmar-now.org/en/news/resistance-forces-make-failed-bid-to-capture-police-station-near-mandalay/
• Looking on Google Maps, Phimaw (NDA-K-held town) is a little more north than what is shown on the map. Also, NDA-K control Kam Phan (which I have been told is "Kangfang" on Google Maps) https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/pang-war-town-residents-flee-fearing-airstrikes
• Can we get rid of that little sliver of SSPP territory between MNDAA and UWSA territory north of Mongyai? It doesn't really make sense, and looks bad
• Irrawaddy UWSA map https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/myanmar-china-watch/uwsa-facilitating-chinas-damming-of-salween-river-in-eastern-myanmar-report.html

Indisputable Edits:

• KIA capture Man Yut (I think encircing/cutting off road to Mansi) https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/burma/myanmar-junta-forces-push-back-in-kachins-bhamo-after-losing-battalion-hq.html
• KIA attack Tanai-Ledo road https://mmpeacemonitor.org/331462/more-locals-on-tanai-ledo-road-move-away-from-farming-amid-conflict-situation/
• KIA capture Singtawn https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/kachin-forces-capture-myanmar-junta-stronghold-in-myanmars-jade-hub.html
• KIA capture Chipwi, Hsawlaw, Lupi, Pangwar, and Shing Jai https://myanmar-now.org/en/news/kachin-fighters-seize-second-border-guard-force-station-near-china-myanmar-trade-hub/
• KIA capture Nuzaungbaung https://burmese.kachinnews.com/2024/10/31/am1-198/ https://www.rfa.org/burmese/news/kachin-border-police-camp-11012024010527.html
• KIA captures Phimaw, attacks Ganfai https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/kia-seizes-town-on-chinese-border.html
• KIA/PDF capture Pinlebu https://www.irrawaddy.com/in-person/interview/resistance-hails-huge-blow-for-myanmar-junta-in-pinlebu.html
• PDF capture Kanzee https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/sagaing-resistance-seizes-pro-myanmar-junta-village-near-nw-command.html
• PDF hold Ann-Padein road https://eng.mizzima.com/2024/10/30/15696 https://www.rfa.org/burmese/news/military-council-and-acdf-fighting-10302024050300.html
• KNDO/PDF capture Meelaungchaung https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/junta-launches-offensive-palaw-township-tanintharyi-region
• KNLA capture Baledo and Laykaykaw https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/junta-abandons-three-outposts-myawaddy-township-karen-state
• KNLA control Alu village https://mmpeacemonitor.org/331463/eight-junta-soldiers-killed-in-two-days-of-fighting-on-yangon-mawlamyine-road/
• KNDF capture Htu Chaung on Hpasawng-Bawlakhe road https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/after-fall-htu-chaung-camp-military-junta-reinforces-helicopters
• AA capture Mae Taung, Kine Khon, Mount Kantkaw https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/aa-seizes-another-strategic-junta-base-in-rakhines-mae-taung.html
• AA reaches 10 miles north of Gwa https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/more-residents-flee-gwa-amid-escalating-hostilities
• AA encircles Ann, capturing Ann Aiport https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/arakan-army-encircle-myanmar-junta-western-command-in-rakhine-state.html
• TNLA capture all of Hsipaw https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/tnla-defeats-final-myanmar-junta-base-in-hsipaw-township.html
• TNLA controls Einiang https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/tnla-levying-vehicle-tax-lashio-township
• RCSS control Yanghkam https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/junta-and-militia-launch-joint-attack-rcss-base-mongping-shan-state
• RCSS near Lawksawk https://burmese.dvb.no/post/647595 and Pindaya https://burmese.dvb.no/post/673940
• PNA control Nangtawng and Thitpinkauk,Nyaungshwe Township. Also, fighting occuring at Moeoo and Namhparmu (presumably with KNDF?) https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/junta-aligned-pa-o-militia-bans-residents-leaving-villages
• NDA-K captures Ganfai https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/kia-seizes-final-border-force-hq-despite-chinese-pressure.html
• Junta reaches Ohnmathee and Kantkaw https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/junta-launches-counteroffensive-naungcho-township-shan-state https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/displaced-civilians-turned-away-from-mandalay-garrison-town.html
• Junta captures Thone-sel-pay https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/myanmar-junta-attacks-force-mandalay-resistance-retreats.html
• Junta capture Aukyaehpyu https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/5000-flee-fighting-southern-launglon-township-tanintharyi-region
• Junta recapture Ngan Myar Gyi https://myanmar-now.org/en/news/myanmar-regime-retakes-key-town-southwest-of-mandalay/
• Junta recapture Gant Gaw (but are surrounded) and PDF/TNLA capture Bant Bwe https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/myanmar-junta-accelerates-bombing-of-northern-shan-towns.html https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/tnla-fights-myanmar-junta-for-key-road-junction.html
• Junta control Kyethi-Mongyai road https://www.rfa.org/english/news/myanmar/myanmar-shan-truck-convoy-09252024151013.html

Disputable Edits:

• KNLA/junta split control of most of Hpa-An Township(?). Taung Kalay and Thilone are KNLA (and maybe Hkalauk Noi, Naung Long, Eindu, Taung Kalay, and Mizan(?)), while junta controls Hpa-An, Kaso, Hti Pho Kain, Nhaung Myaw Lwe, and Hpa-An-Kawkareik road https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/junta-trying-collect-census-revolutionary-held-areas-hpa-district-karen-state https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/militia-group-joins-junta-asia-highway-checkpoints https://myanmar-now.org/en/news/myanmar-junta-launches-first-drone-attack-on-karen-national-union-headquarters/ https://eng.mizzima.com/2024/10/25/15474 https://eng.mizzima.com/2024/10/23/15358 (most of these are confusing)
• CB possible offensive on Falam? (Definitely means that CB controls area around Falam instead of CC) https://www.rfa.org/burmese/program_2/fighting-falam-residents-fled-10312024040802.html
• Junta/NDA-K bases north of Pangwa https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/kia-seals-off-house-of-myanmar-junta-allied-warlord-after-seizing-pangwa.html (whether this is referring to bases directly north of Pangwa, or if its referring to Phimaw I do not know)

IdioticAnarchist (talk) 20:20, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

Adding to this: Wa and junta contesting Tangyan

https://myanmar-now.org/en/news/wa-occupiers-recruitment-practices-alarm-locals-in-northern-shan-state-township/\ EmeraldRange (talk/contribs) 21:06, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

More extra news: KIA capture Kangfang from NDA-K (I've also been informed that Kangfang and Ganfai is the same settlement) https://www.rfa.org/burmese/news/kia-military-kachin-11042024115806.html IdioticAnarchist (talk) 15:59, 5 November 2024 (UTC)

Changes applied, map updated:

Additional notes to list above:

• "Oo Ka Yit Hta" is Ukrit- change applied
• Sources for RCSS control of Lawksawk seem to point to Kunhing, not Lawksawk- RCSS presence added near Lawksawk due to fighting attached to PNA areas
• Kantkaw and Gant Gaw are the same (in Nawnghkio junta counterattack)

Deviations from list above:

• I think the map we have of UWSA right now makes more sense than the Irrawaddy map- though an argument can be made for areas surrounding Tangyan now that there is contestation- though I'd want more clear sources [no change made]
• Tanai-Ledo road already has Kia presence on map [no change needed]
• Chipwi, etc. already KIA controlled [no change needed]
• Pinlebu already PDF controlled [no change needed]
• Kanzee already shown as PDF controlled, nearby villages given back to junta as per source
• Alu already shown with KNLA presence [no change needed]
• Hsipaw already captured [no change needed]
• Thitpinkauk, Moeoo and Namhparmu don't seem to exist on mimu or pcodes; expanded PNA control slightly across township borders to includ nangtawng (aka Nantaung)
• Thon-ze-pay already shown as junta control [no change needed]

Disputed edits clarification

• KNLA split edit: Taungkalay and Tilon town given to KNLA, but tempered by road and SAC MOC in both respectively being junta control. Hkalaukno-naunglon-eindu/mountain areas south of hpa-an given to KNLA. Other villages largely match what is already shown for junta.
• Chin Brotherhood attacking/contesting Falam- article mentions urban wards. area around updated only minimally as not mentioned otherwise.
• there probably were junta/nda-k bases north of Pang War before but would have been captured by now

EmeraldRange (talk/contribs) 20:35, 10 November 2024 (UTC)

Sorry for the extra edit, but it's quite big. Lanse ("Laching") was captured by KIA forces, the final NDA-K base in north KSR-1. Also the capture of Shing Jai isn't shown on the map. I'd say its fair to say that the KIA have completely encircled Kanpaikti. Great edits by the way! IdioticAnarchist (talk) 16:19, 11 November 2024 (UTC)

done. Also updated Kangfang since I missed that update you replied earlier. EmeraldRange (talk/contribs) 14:50, 12 November 2024 (UTC)

So how has the momentum of the war changed/continued overall? Depending on the answer, maybe we should add some new info in case the course of the war is changing in any meaningful way. LordOfWalruses (talk) 03:31, 15 November 2024 (UTC)

The "Timeline" section is too long and simply unreadable

This is actually a common issue of all wikipedia articles covering ongoing conflicts. Every new event is added, but when they turn out to be minor and next to irrelevant to the conflict, they aren't removed or edited according to the context. In fact this section isn't even in chronological order as it is necessarily the case with a timeline. There are many sub sections about specific operations and geographic areas and the text travel back and forward in time at a dizzying pace. It is more like a dump of news articles than an informative text.

I am not a frequent Wikipedia writer either and I don't know what would I be allowed to do if I decided to summarize this text, therefore I ask the community what could and should be done here, because at least to me the issue is very visible.I personally think that ongoing/recent conflicts' articles have no reason to be so drastically different from historical ones and this is where the problem is.138.62.255.10 (talk) 09:51, 25 November 2024 (UTC)

Every so often I end up being the one summarising, doing some splits and shortening the sections. One of the unique issues with the coverage on the Myanmar civil war is that it's harder to find analysis on how to group all the news events. I think early on we grouped it by locaiton within a broader timeframe that had overarching takeaways. However, analyses have certainly shifted to a more constantly updated regional focus.

I know analyses have not been properly incorporated into the article yet but it's certainly harder to follow now that the most recent "timeframe" has the most events and the longest timeframe. I'm personally a bit busy for a few weeks but I'd be happy to try to find those analyses and reorganise the sections- especially post 1027. For now I guess I also want to see what others think. I know a few months ago we dicussed if it would be worth spliting the entire article into a Myanmar civil war (2021-present) and a Myanmar civil war (2023-present) or if that would be misleading to the average viewer who probably isn't aware that there is a war at all. EmeraldRange (talk/contribs) 05:06, 26 November 2024 (UTC)