Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Basketball

photo evaluation on Victor Hampton (American football)

cross-posted from Wikipedia talk:WikiProject American football § photo evaluation on Victor Hampton (American football)

The person pictured on Victor Hampton (American football) is playing basketball, but there's no mention of any basketball career. While the Flickr page says it's Victor Hampton and it's a Gamecocks account (and he played for the South Carolina Gamecocks football team), I wonder if there is any chance it's the wrong guy.

Would someone with more sports knowledge help out here? = paul2520 💬 19:52, 18 June 2024 (UTC)

Hi Paul2520. Honestly, I wouldn't recognize Victor Hampton, but looking at the Flickr link, the picture seems to have been taken at a charity basketball game, rather than an official college basketball event. There were probably several people involved who were locally notable but not members of the South Carolina basketball team. Zagalejo (talk) 01:19, 26 June 2024 (UTC)

That makes sense & is a relief. Thank you, Zagalejo! = paul2520 💬 02:12, 27 June 2024 (UTC)

Note

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alpe_Adria_Cup

Article forbids linking countries... 93.143.139.254 (talk) 13:24, 23 June 2024 (UTC)

According to Wikipedia rules, wikilink should not be used for countries. Maiō T. (talk) 16:03, 28 June 2024 (UTC)

National under-16 and under-17 basketball team

A national under-16 team that advances from a continental championship to a world championship will automatically become a national under-17 team. Many articles use both age categories in the title. And many don't. Compare these examples:

• Germany men's national under-16 and under-17 basketball team
• Germany women's national under-17 basketball team

So I would propose that all under-17 articles be renamed to "(Country) men's/women's national under-16 and under-17 basketball team". Could you comment on that? Thanks.
(My proposal also applies to U18/U19 teams.) Maiō T. (talk) 16:03, 28 June 2024 (UTC)

There is one more thing to note: FIBA Americas and FIBA Oceania also organize under-15 championships. So if we take Australia for example, the name of the article should look something like this:

• Australia men's national under-15, under-16 and under-17 basketball team

It's all the same team that plays three championships in three years. (The proposed title is quite long; it might be better to write it as ...under-15/16/17...) I've been waiting for someone to answer me for ten days. This debate needs to get going. User:Pelmeen10, we recently talked about this topic, could you comment here as well? Maiō T. (talk) 11:17, 7 July 2024 (UTC)

I would've made the u-16 the article name then redirect u-17 to it. Only 16(?) teams qualify to the u-x world championship and for most countries the u-16 and the u-18 are the primary teams. Howard the Duck (talk) 12:53, 7 July 2024 (UTC)

The article title needs to reflect the content too, so teams not participating in both competitions don't need the change, but those who do - yes, I support the rename. I haven't yet familiarized myself too much with the non-european teams. Have you checked all the articles and write it more clear what articles would you like to rename? In "current title → new title" format.

I would say go ahead and rename the pages if nobody disagrees. If you don't get enough feedback, or would like include more participants, you can start a page moving process. Check Wikipedia:Requested moves#Requesting multiple page moves Pelmeen10 (talk) 16:09, 7 July 2024 (UTC)

@Howard the Duck: Your idea is romantic. If it was the only proposal, I would vote for it. But now, there is the proposal that I and Pelmeen10 support.

@Pelmeen10: Do you think I should add those articles for renaming here to this discussion? Maybe there will be a hundred of them...

• Belgium women's national under-17 basketball team → Belgium women's national under-16/17 basketball team
• Czech Republic women's national under-17 basketball team → Czech Republic women's national under-16/17 basketball team
• France women's national under-17 basketball team → France women's national under-16/17 basketball team
• Germany women's national under-17 basketball team → Germany women's national under-16/17 basketball team
• Hungary women's national under-17 basketball team → Hungary women's national under-16/17 basketball team
• Italy women's national under-17 basketball team → Italy women's national under-16/17 basketball team
• Latvia women's national under-17 basketball team → Latvia women's national under-16/17 basketball team
• Portugal women's national under-17 basketball team → Portugal women's national under-16/17 basketball team
• Russia women's national under-17 basketball team → Russia women's national under-16/17 basketball team

This is the European Women's U17 category. I'll look at the other categories tomorrow, it's late tonight. Maiō T. (talk) 20:27, 7 July 2024 (UTC)

New Zealand men's national basketball team

I have tagged New Zealand men's national basketball team with {{too many sections}} and {{very long}}. Just reaching out here to gauge interest in any clean up. Thanks. DaHuzyBru (talk) 02:28, 5 July 2024 (UTC)

I assume the edits in question were related to the likely block evader? The WP:EVASION policy says:

This does not mean that edits must be reverted just because they were made by a banned editor ... but the presumption in ambiguous cases should be to revert.

—Bagumba (talk) 05:26, 5 July 2024 (UTC)

The page was edited heavily by a now-blocked user. I'm not seeking to have all their contributions reverted, but rather checking if anyone else agrees that the page has too many sections and is too long. DaHuzyBru (talk) 13:00, 5 July 2024 (UTC)

Got it. If the topic should remain ambiguous, you should feel comfortable to pare it down, if you choose. Best. —Bagumba (talk) 13:50, 5 July 2024 (UTC)

Oldest basketball player

I have started a discussion at Talk:List of oldest professional athletes by sport#Oldest basketball player. I have found newspaper articles that confirm Whitey Von Nieda appeared in a professional game in 1978 when he would have been aged 55; neither source mentions his age. Any assistance in how to prove this feat would be appreciated. CalDoesIt (talk) 05:18, 6 July 2024 (UTC)

Naming college teams in national team rosters

In 2024 FIBA Men's Olympic Qualifying Tournaments squads, how should college teams be labeled? Via their full athletic name (like "Utah Utes"), or the short name of the college (such as "Sacramento State"), or the long name of the college (such as "Ateneo de Manila University").

In infoboxes for players, we use the short name (so it's "Texas" for Kevin Durant), and for coaches, it's still the short name (so Rick Pitino coached for "Kentucky", "Louisville" and "Boston Celtics"). In soccer/football infoboxes, it seems they use the athletic name of the college (like "Indiana Hoosiers"). We do need guidance on this so that there'd be a standard. Howard the Duck (talk) 20:23, 6 July 2024 (UTC)

2020 FIBA Men's Olympic Qualifying Tournaments squads looks like a mixed bag too, with both plain college names and then some like "Davidson Wildcats" and "Iowa State Cyclones". It seems like coaches who were in college and pros use just the college name interspersed with the full pro teams' names e.g. Larry Brown (basketball). I'm inclined to list the full college name for natl team rosters. —Bagumba (talk) 21:54, 6 July 2024 (UTC)

By "full college name" meaning "Davidson College" instead of "Davidson Wildcats", is that right? Howard the Duck (talk) 12:43, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

Sorry, I meant the full school+team name e.g. "Iowa State Cyclones" and not plain "Iowa State". —Bagumba (talk) 12:50, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

Ah, that's noted. Howard the Duck (talk) 12:55, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

As for infoboxes, it's just the college name, like "Kentucky". Is that right? Howard the Duck (talk) 12:57, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

Yes, that's consistent for |college= as documented at Template:Infobox basketball biography. I'd be open to using the school+team name for the "Career history" section of college coaches also, but WP:CBBALL should be involved in that discussion. —Bagumba (talk) 13:05, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

TBH, I'd be okay with whatever is adopted/is the standard, it's just that we have to stick with it. AFAIK you guys had a discussion about this a few years back and I don't think any of the positions have changed since then and I'd be okay with whatever was agreed upon. Howard the Duck (talk) 13:13, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

I'd also say that using just the college name for coached teams should be documented as well, if it hasn't already. Howard the Duck (talk) 13:16, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

One of WP's many de facto standards. —Bagumba (talk) 13:23, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

I have a follow-up question. Some people may have coached men's and women's college basketball teams in their career. How are these distinguished? What if a person coach both the men's and women's teams in some point? Howard the Duck (talk) 22:53, 14 July 2024 (UTC)

Not sure if this is a standard, but Paul Westhead and Michael Cooper put (men's) and (womens's) next to college teams, but not for pro. —Bagumba (talk) 04:50, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

I guess pro teams don't need this as they use full names.

College teams in the US have mostly the same names for men and women's teama tho, e.g. basketball teams of either sex in Duke are both the "Blue Devils". Howard the Duck (talk) 09:44, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

I have another question: the "default" is for you to assume that someone coached a men's team; however it's not always clear cut. Geno Auriemma apparently coached women's teams exclusively, and the infobox doesn't specify that; you'd have to check each team, and yes, all of those were women's teams. I suppose someone has to have a bare minimum of knowledge to know this, or maybe read the lead. Howard the Duck (talk) 22:08, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

2024 Olympics

For anyone who's in an article-creating mood, the 2024 Summer Olympics starts in two weeks and there's several qualified basketball players missing articles: see up to 5 in the men's 5x5 tournament, up to 32 in the women's 5x5 (though not all rosters finalized), 12 in the men's 3x3, and 10 in the women's 3x3. Any with interesting facts can be featured at DYK during the Olympics; see Wikipedia_talk:Did_you_know#Special_occasion_idea:_Olympics for more information. BeanieFan11 (talk) 17:27, 12 July 2024 (UTC)

3x3 Cup anomalies

This is the first time I see two different articles of the same competition having 2 seperate articles, while the main article is made into a disambig. page

• 2024 FIBA 3x3 Europe Cup (currently disam page)
  • 2024 FIBA 3x3 Europe Cup – Men's tournament
  • 2024 FIBA 3x3 Europe Cup – Women's tournament
• 2024 FIBA 3x3 AmeriCup (currently disam page)
  • 2024 FIBA 3x3 AmeriCup – Men's tournament
  • 2024 FIBA 3x3 AmeriCup – Women's tournament
• 2024 FIBA 3x3 Asia Cup (currently disam page)
  • 2024 FIBA 3x3 Asia Cup – Men's tournament
  • 2024 FIBA 3x3 Asia Cup – Women's tournament

My question is why? The two articles also duplicate some information. I'm not sure if this is against MoS anyway. But there should be the main tournament page, and only if necessary, the subpages (men's and women's) to cover the topic in more detail. I tried to make 2024 FIBA 3x3 Europe Cup into an article, but i was reverted by the creator. Pelmeen10 (talk) 23:32, 17 July 2024 (UTC)

On multi-sports events, men's and women's tournaments have different pages, with the primary article showing the summary from both tournaments. This is not like that though, and it seems that on all 3 (6?) events, the men's and women's tournaments are held on the same venue on the same duration.

The closest analogy I have are the William Jones Cup men's and women's tournaments. In the 2024 William Jones Cup, both tournaments are in one page, and the women's tournament preceded the men's tournament.

Ultimately, if all events are done, would it be necessary for a WP:SPLIT? If it does not, then it should be just one. One could also argue that either sex's tournament are independently notable of each other and needs to be split off. Howard the Duck (talk) 05:22, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

Some related guidelines include WP:N:

This is not a guarantee that a topic will necessarily be handled as a separate, stand-alone page. Editors may use their discretion to merge or group two or more related topics into a single article.

WP:NOPAGE:

Often, understanding is best achieved by presenting the topic on a dedicated standalone page, but it is not required that we do so; at times it is better to cover a notable topic as part of a larger page about a broader topic, with more context (and doing so in no way disparages the importance of the topic. Editorial judgment goes into each decision about whether or not to create a separate page, but the decision should always be based upon specific considerations about how to make the topic understandable, and not merely upon personal likes or dislikes.

WP:AVOIDSPLIT:

Also consider whether a concept can be cleanly trimmed, removed, or merged elsewhere on Wikipedia instead of creating a new article. Some topics are notable, but do not need their own article; see WP:NOPAGE.

—Bagumba (talk) 05:39, 23 August 2024 (UTC)

Katie Cox

I was looking create page for this basketball youth player, from her professional football career perspective and notbility. Is there anyone who'd be able to help with the basketball side of her career? I'm not sure on the general format for basketball players, so was hoping there might be someone willing to pitch in. At a minimum, to cover the basketball infobox module, assuming she will have both this and the football biography module, within a person infobox. I wouldn't even no where to start looking for stats for basketball. Thanks, CNC (talk) 09:08, 24 July 2024 (UTC)

New AfD

Hi. I just started Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Sedale Threatt Jr. (basketball). Just flagging here in case anyone wanted to contribute. Thanks. DaHuzyBru (talk) 07:03, 27 July 2024 (UTC)

3x3 basketball cleanup

Does anybody have any suggestions on how to improve this page? There is a lot of repetition in the Rules section, specifically between the 'Possession and overtime' and 'Scoring' subsections. –uncleben85 (talk) 15:45, 30 July 2024 (UTC)

All-Star Five in infobox

Does FIBA Men's Olympics All-Star Five belong in players' infoboxes (e.g. LeBron James, Stephen Curry)? It hasn't seemed to be a prior practice with FIBA Basketball World Cup All-Tournament Team or NCAA all-tourney teams. A relevant guideline is MOS:INFOBOXPURPOSE:

The less information that an infobox contains, the more effectively it serves its purpose, allowing readers to identify key facts at a glance.

I don't think it'll be defining in anyone's obit, or that it would be prominently in any player's lead in prose. Too much tends to get crammed in infoboxes. —Bagumba (talk) 04:53, 19 August 2024 (UTC)

A player making the he FIBA Basketball World Cup All-Tournament Team is routinely mentioned in various articles about them, examples [1][2][3][4][5]. If the infobox is crowded, maybe start by removing high school magazine awards in instead of awards by the sport's global governing body? Alvaldi (talk) 17:47, 19 August 2024 (UTC)

we allow about 3-4 awards from HS, and each level of play is determined on its own. But if it means keeping minor tournament designations out at other levels then by all means I vote we drop Parade All-American (though this routinely shows up in designees’ obits). Rikster2 (talk) 22:33, 19 August 2024 (UTC)

All-tournament (at any level) is not significant enough for an infobox that supposedly draws lines about what is included at each level. Stick with just MVP from these events, the Olympic tourney is only 6 games after all, nothing like a full season. Every single award doesn’t need to be there. Rikster2 (talk) 22:31, 19 August 2024 (UTC)

All tournaments (pun intended) are not created equal. The above sources show that the FIBA Basketball World Cup All-Tournament Team are considered a significant part of a players career. The FIBA Men's Olympics All-Star Five is on the other hand is a new award, was first awarded at the Tokyo Olympics so chances are it has yet to gain significance. My main gripe is that an all-team award shouldn't get automatically rejected from the highlights of the infobox just because the competition it belongs to has a "tournament" designation. The highlights section of the infobox is for the highlights of the players career. For some it is being a part of a FIBA Basketball World Cup All-Tournament Team, for others it might being a Fourth-team Parade All-American. Alvaldi (talk) 10:33, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

At WP:NBASTYLE for NBA bios, it limits infobox highlights for those "with 5+ professional highlights". Perhaps that's the cutoff for All-Star Five? It's fine in prose in the body. Re: Parade, that was the prominent honor back in the day for high schoolers, not just a run-of-the-mill magazine award. At any rate, it's defunct, so will affect modern stars' bios less and less, and zero impact to non-US players. —Bagumba (talk) 10:52, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

For players who have few highlights in the infobox, such as Patty Mills and Shawn Kemp, I see no problem including All-Star Five or All-Parade teams. For players with many highlights, I would think it would be case-by-case. For Stephen Curry, being an the All-Star Five might not be one of his top-20-ish highlights, though the same might be said of his NBA Clutch Player of the Year award. Maybe it would be best to limit the highlights to a certain numer. Alvaldi (talk) 13:57, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

FWIW, Clutch POY is not listed at WP:NBAHIGHLIGHTS. —Bagumba (talk) 14:44, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

Cull awards in the infobox. The soccer player infobox does not have it. Lionel Messi infobox is short and sweet with just over 2 screens on mobile as a result. Compare with Lebron James. which is almost 4 and a half screens (on my phone, results may vary, but you'd get the point) Very few of the awards are summarized in the article extensively. Remove it and we won't have these kinds of discussions that don't really improve the article per se. Howard the Duck (talk) 22:55, 20 August 2024 (UTC)

RfC at WikiProject Sports

An RfC at WikiProject Sports is currently seeking a consensus on whether images of all venues in a tournament should be presented in a tournament article's § Venues section. Feel free to join in and share your thoughts! — AFC Vixen 🦊 15:27, 19 August 2024 (UTC)