Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2008 March 11

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March 11

Script conks out on every preview

Hi,

Every time I try to edit the article eye music, it chugs away and gives me an error message. If If I press "Continue with script" I just loop, if I stop script I end up with blank edit section.

What is interesting I can edit everything before the current version. I'd be willing to bet that the problem has something to do with the image file I copied from another entry with a whole bunch of errors I was about to fix: [[Image:solitude.png|thumb|600px|center|Hans-Christoph Steiner's score for Solitude...]].

Here it works, probably because it doesn't have the messed up external link which can be seen in the entry. Or I might be wrong entirely about placing the blame.

In any case, can someone give eye music a good talking to?

Best, Shlishke (talk) 00:19, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Edit count stat tool

Is anyone else having a problem with http://vs.aka-online.de/wppagehiststat/ today?--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTD) 00:22, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Just attempted. Got garbage code. Yep, it's down.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 00:26, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Yes, its down. - Milk's Favorite Cookie 00:27, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

The tool's creator has already been informed on his talk page (German Wikipedia) of the problem.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 00:30, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

It was working for a few hours and is down again.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTD) 23:25, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Need help on a table

OK, so it's just a silly little thing in my userspace. But I'm having trouble with the coding used at User:Dulcem/Hi, Mom!. Specifically, the gallery about a quarter down the page should be five images across (and be centered if at all possible), but for some reason only four will show up. Also, the black bar under the gallery should preferably go all the way to the blue border (as the upper black bar does), but it stops short. Any help would be appreciated (feel free to edit the page). Thanks! — Dulcem (talk) 00:52, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

I've fixed the gallery for you - you can specify the number of images in a row by adding perrow="5" to the first <gallery tag. As for centering, I had to give up and just use <center></center> as it apparently doesn't like "align" like everything else does. I'm working on the black line now, but it might take a little longer since you're using all these div tags.... grrr... Hersfold ^(t/a/c) 01:30, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks a bunch! As you can see from my disclaimer, I've swiped design elements from other people's pages if that helps you any. My basic user page has plenty of black lines that go all the way to the edge, so you can cannibalize from it if you need to. — Dulcem (talk) 01:32, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

I don't have the faintest idea. I think it has something to do with the way you're overlapping all those div's, but I can't figure out why or how to fix it - every time I try, the line stays the same and something else blows up. They all seem to close right, but I think it's the order you're closing them in that's causing the issue. Your user page is kind of the same, but since it's got less text blocks, there's less of the really weird overlapping that I swear is causing the problem on your gallery page. Unfortunately, I really don't know how to fix it. Sorry. :-( Hersfold ^(t/a/c) 01:49, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Ah, well. Thanks for trying! I guess this is what happens when someone who has no idea what he's doing (me) tries to play with templates and tables. :) — Dulcem (talk) 01:56, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Citations of Shakespeare

I'd like to know what the preferred style is for citing Shakespeare's works in Wikipedia articles. I've noticed some instances where people list the name of a play, followed by something like "2.1.4". I gather that's Act,Scene,Line(?). Is that sufficient, or should one refer to some canonical edition? LuckyThracian (Talk) 03:02, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

It looks like the Shakespeare Wikiproject is developing a template to standardise it, including the version (First Folio, etc.). Confusing Manifestation(Say hi!) 03:37, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

(Belated) thankyou, ConMan. LuckyThracian (Talk) 01:38, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

Recent changes and large size changes

I can see that Recent changes flags large negative article size changes in red. Does it also flag large positive changes? For example, the last change by 118.67.216.56 in the history at Gallipoli. Maybe that one should use red *and* <blink>? Hmmm, how about a 'large' font size?  :-) Shenme (talk) 05:05, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Yes, large changes in either direction are highlighted in bold. You're welcome to suggest further enhancement at Bugzilla, however I am highly doubtful that you'll ever see anything blinking there. Hersfold ^(t/a/c) 16:24, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Removing content from user talk pages.

Is it proper to remove some entries from my talk page?
The first is not constructive.

The second is uncivil, but does raise an issue.

(I would have discussed and denied conflict of interest if addressed civilly.)

My reading on the issue left me with the impression it would be justifiable, but poor form in the second case.

Novangelis (talk) 06:08, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Per WP:TALK, you may remove messages from your own talk page. You may also archive the messages. Wisdom89 _{(T / ^C)} 06:21, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Why could I not open the Japanese Wiki

By google, I could find the link in Wiki to Japanese words I want to see, but when I click it, I always failed to open it. And I have tried to open the Wiki Japanese directly by Wiki's link, but also failed. Exactly, except for Wiki English, every other language, like Korean, Thai, and Chinese, I have been tried could not be opened finally.

I am a user in China. I don'tkonw whthether it is the reason that I could not open these language editions of Wiki. Thank you. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Lingzhongren (talk • contribs) 06:34, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Unfortunately, you're probably being affected by the Firewall that China uses to censor the Internet. I'm kinda surprised you could get to the English Wikipedia at all. -- Kesh (talk) 07:59, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

For more information on the Great Firewall of china, see Golden Shield Project. If you use Tor (anonymity network), you might be able to get around those restrictions and access the articles you're interested in. — Ksero (talk | contribs) 08:58, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Please note, however, that we automatically block all IP addresses that come from Tor for security reasons. While you will be able to read articles, you will not be able to edit them. Sorry to have to tell you that. Hersfold ^(t/a/c) 16:22, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Wasn't there a private proxy for Chinese users? Something from User:ST47 maybe? Snowolf ^{How can I help?} 22:58, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

Holman Fenwick & Willan

The name of the firm needs to change - delete the ampersand! Many thanks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 23Azalea (talk • contribs) 09:25, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

What is your source? - Kittybrewster ☎ 09:39, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

The sources I found, including the official website, include & in Holman Fenwick & Willan, so I changed the article text instead to readd &. I also made other changes, including removing advertisement. PrimeHunter (talk) 14:12, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

New Users

Resolved

Is there a list of newly created user accounts? - Kittybrewster ☎ 09:35, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

There's this... Nick (talk) 09:43, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Halo 'o Vave

Hala 'o Vave on userpage User:Anacrossan/Sandbox.

I need an assessment of the article, whether it can be moved out of my userpage sandbox, to the normal page? Thank you.Anacrossan (talk) 10:10, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Hi Anacrossan, I've looked and I would say no, what's in your sandbox isn't even close to acceptable. You need to establish notability, provide references, make some case that the article has a reason to survive if you move it into the mainspace. Take a look at some existing articles in the same topic area and try to follow what they do. Regards. Franamax (talk) 10:37, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

The first thing you need to do is establish why this topic is notable. Why does it belong in an encyclopedia? Next, you have to show why someone other than you thinks it's important. For Wikipedia, you need to have a reference to a reliable source, a book, newspaper article, something that anyone else can go look at to be sure you're telling the truth. Have a look at WP:N, WP:V, WP:RS and WP:OR to get a feel for what's required. Hope you can make it work, could be an interesting article! Franamax (talk) 10:46, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Moving images from en to commons

I'd like to use the following three images in other wikis: Image:Pierre-Gilles_Rice_University.jpg, Image:Heckman.jpg and Image:Elfriede_jelinek_2004_small.jpg. Is there an easy way to transfer them to commons? (Instead of downloading them from here and uploading in commons again. Something like the ordinary "move" for images.) --Ephraim33 (talk) 14:14, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Use commons helper and check the 'direct upload' box and a bot will do it for you. Nanonic (talk) 14:18, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

"Even when we were no more, sun and moon would be there."

Is it a correct sentence/expression? Particularly the use of 'were', is it correct grammatically? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.96.6.244 (talk) 14:35, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Actually, this page is for requesting assistance in how to use Wikipedia. You ought to ask your question on the Reference Desk, in this case Wikipedia:Reference desk/Language.--217.44.171.224 (talk) 14:59, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

In the dialect I speak, it would be correct if it said "if" instead of "when". It may be correct as it is in some other dialects. --Coppertwig (talk) 03:21, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Edits are not visible

I am a new member and I made some edits to the USUHS page. The instructions for editing say that changes should be immediately viewable but its 9 hours later and the edits are not visible. What do I need to do to make edits visible to the public or did I do something wrong that caused them to blocked. I've searched the FAQs and instructions, and while I'm sure the answer to this question is there, I can't seem to find it. I have seen a lot of information about being blocked or vandalism and I hope my edits aren't being classified as such.

Thanks, Jeff —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jbh5350 (talk • contribs) 15:19, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

You have 4 registered edits to Uniformed Services University of the Health Sciences: [1]. All edits immediately become visible, including these 4. If you don't see them then you probably have to bypass your cache. PrimeHunter (talk) 15:24, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

If you ever get this problem again, there are at least two ways you can check to see whether Wikipedia actually got your edits. See: Help:History and Help:Contributions. --Teratornis (talk) 17:17, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Sortable table problem

Hi, how do I get the following table to resort properly (e.g. when I click a button, it groups the lines and summaries. Thanks, –thedemonhog talk • edits 15:34, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Name	Actor or actress	Starring seasons	Episode count
Jack Shephard	Matthew Fox	1, 2, 3, 4	71
Blah blah summary.
Kate Austen	Evangeline Lilly	1, 2, 3, 4	70
Yada yada yada.
Hugo "Hurley" Reyes	Jorge Garcia	1, 2, 3, 4	66
I am working on this in my sandbox.
Sayid Jarrah	Naveen Andrews	1, 2, 3, 4	61
This is for Characters of Lost per the discussion at Talk:Characters of Lost#Too long.

Avoid colspan.--Patrick (talk) 16:09, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

More or less. The colspan, and the use of cells that don't fit into the sorting scheme, is screwing up the script. Sortable tables should contain only the information which they are intended to sort. It will never work properly with blank lines or plot summaries intermingled like that. Sorry. Hersfold ^(t/a/c) 16:19, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Freezing computer

I have been on several different computers at the same library today. I can sort of understand when ads are a problem, but I can't understand why this would happen to Wikipedia.

It doesn't last too long, or too many times, but when that square in the upper right corner of the page, between the underscore and the X, turns dark, and especially when there is a white square in the upper left corner, this is a scary situation. Sometimes when this happens the computer just shuts down.Vchimpanzee · talk · contributions · 17:57, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Browsers can become unresponsive due to javascript that is taking a while to run - there are a few scripts normally used on wikipedia that don't scale well - there's a script that runs on the history view to make things look nice, that takes too long when you're in a view with e.g. 500 entries - and on actual articles there's a script that runs to let you sort tables by clicking on the little arrow, and that takes a while to set up if there are really large tables. —Random832 18:37, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

contributing

how do i edit a page at wikipedia —Preceding unsigned comment added by 169.244.61.5 (talk) 18:54, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Click on the edit tab at the top of any page. See: Wikipedia:How to edit a page for more info and Welcome! Gtstricky^{Talk or C} 19:01, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

creating a page

How do you create a page at wikipedia. I was reading the instructions and it said to click on the red dot (or something like that) but I couldn't find it. Do you have to create on account first and then log in? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 169.244.61.5 (talk) 19:31, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

You will need to first register an account, which has many benefits, including the ability to create articles. Once you have registered, please search Wikipedia first to make sure that an article does not already exist on the subject. Please also review a few of our relevant policies and guidelines which all articles should comport with. As Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, articles must not contain original research, must be written from a neutral point of view, should cite to reliable sources which verify their content and must not contain unsourced, negative content about living people.

Articles must also demonstrate the notability of the subject. Please see our subject specific guidelines for people, bands and musicians, companies and organizations and web content and note that if you are closely associated with the subject, our conflict of interest guideline strongly recommends against you creating the article.

If you still think an article is appropriate, see Help:Starting a new page. You might also look at Wikipedia:Your first article and Wikipedia:How to write a great article for guidance, and please consider taking a tour through the Wikipedia:Tutorial so that you know how to properly format the article before creation. Gtstricky^{Talk or C} 19:38, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Richard Leiterman

Which stub template would be suitable to use for Richard Leiterman? Thanks —Preceding unsigned comment added by DIPPY (talk • contribs) 19:48, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

I would say {{Canada-film-bio-stub}}. Aecis^Brievenbus 19:54, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Entering Book Information

I want to create a page for an out of print book series. Is it a copyright violation to use the plot summary from the back of each book that tells the reader what the book is about without giving too much away? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Faaya (talk • contribs) 19:49, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

I don't think it would be right to use those plot summaries. Wikipedia:Copyrights says:

If you contribute material to Wikipedia, you thereby license it to the public

under the GFDL (with no invariant sections, front-cover texts, or back-cover texts). In order to contribute, you must be in a position to grant this license, which means that either

• you hold the copyright to the material, for instance because you produced it yourself, or
• you acquired the material from a source that allows the licensing under GFDL, for instance because the material is in the public domain or is itself published under GFDL.

If it's an old book series you're talking about, the copyright might have expired - see Public domain#United States law (the laws of the United States apply since the servers of the English-language Wikipedia are located there). — Ksero (talk | contribs) 20:00, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Editing an article and adding footnote

Edited the article on Hannibal Hamlin (US VP from Maine). Added some text with a footnote to a free web page that shows Hamlin's family tree in some detail. When saved, the footnote number (1) was there but not the footnote itself with the link. How is this done correctly? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Pres-scholar (talk • contribs) 20:41, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

It needed a reference section to work right. I put it in. Cheers Gtstricky^{Talk or C} 20:55, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

?

20:51, 11 March 2008 (UTC)24.1.15.31 (talk)BYTTWERE ANY SCIENTIFIC DISCOVERIES MADE IN CONJUNCTION OF THE WAR IN IRAQ ?

This Help desk is for asking questions about the use of Wikipedia. The reference desk is probably more suited to your query. Incidentally, typing all in capital letters is considered poor etiquette, as it is often seen as shouting. Thank you, Confusing Manifestation(Say hi!) 22:11, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

inclusion of college technical reports

I teach a course to 3rd year mechanical engineers on design for the environment. Students work in groups of four on a term-long project comparing three technologies that accomplish a similar purspose based on the relative merits in these areas: a) technical performance b) environmental life cycle analysis c) cost analysis and d) societal analysis.

On the one hand it could be useful to have this content available on Wikipedia because of the synthesis work involved (perhaps linked to the "Life cycle assessment" page on Wikipedia), but on the other, since each report is a comparison of three alternatives, it doesn't seem to be a clear "fit" for a regular article. Any thoughts or suggestions will be much appreciated. --SRego (talk) 21:15, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Are you talking about having the students upload and collaborate on this work on Wikipedia itself? If so, please read WP:SYN. In short, we don't accept original research on Wikipedia.

What you probably want to do is run a copy of the MediaWiki software on your school's servers. You can then control access to the documents and create whatever you'd like on there. -- Kesh (talk) 21:59, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

This looks like a good match for Wikiversity, which is a Wikipedia sister project. -Arch dude (talk) 02:25, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

We also have a Wikiversity article which provides an overview. You might also see the following pages:

• b:Wiki Science/How to start a wiki (every school should have at least one wiki)
• Wikipedia:Wikipedia in academic studies
• Wikipedia:Researching Wikipedia
• Wikipedia:WikiProject Wikidemia
• User:Teratornis/Tips for teachers

--Teratornis (talk) 05:14, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

Equation numbering

Hi

Does anyone know how to get right-justified equation numbering to be correctly vertically aligned? This is what I have been trying:

$a=b+c\,$

(1)

but you can see that the "(1)" is not properly aligned with the equation, leading to unsightly spacing. I suppose I could use a table, but it seems like an awful lot of hassle for something that ought to be simple. Matt 22:03, 11 March 2008 (UTC).

Have you tried putting the equation in an \array, and getting the equation number in that? It shouldn't be too hard to get the equation numbers aligned properly that way. Confusing Manifestation(Say hi!) 22:09, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

i.e.:

${\begin{array}{rclr}a&=&b+c&(1)\\d&=&e-f&(2)\end{array}}$

I'm sure there's better ways than (1) and (2) as well, but I don't know of them. Proper LaTeX has eqnarray but Wikipedia doesn't use the full gamut and shortcuts some things. x42bn6 Talk Mess 23:43, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the suggestions. Ideally I want the numbers of various different equations separated by pieces of text to line up horizontally, which I think I can't do with the "array" method? Anyway, I've gone with tables for now... Matt 01:30, 12 March 2008 (UTC). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.129.130.93 (talk)

Is it possible to restore a userpage/talk page after a username change?

I had my name changed after I was blocked for vandalizing the Justine Ezarik article (let he who is without sin cast the first stone) [2]. I would like to keep this user name, but if it's possible to restore my old user and talk pages restore on my current user account. Who would I need to contact? -- Scarpy (talk) 22:50, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

I'll take this one. Bencherlite^Talk 23:00, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Gadgets

On Special:Preferences, there is a tab labeled "Gadgets". It appears that checking one of the boxes listed will install a "default version" of the associated user script. My questions are:

a) What would happen if I checked a box for a user script that I already have installed?

b) Aside from involving less clicking/typing, how is checking a box different from installing a script manually?

- SigmaEpsilon → ΣΕ 23:16, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Not completely sure about the first one, but it doesn't seem to have any effect. In the case of the second, the only way to avail yourself of the full range of customizations in scripts like Twinkle is to install them manually. Carom (talk) 23:29, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

1. Some scripts have checks to avoid installing it twice. If a script doesn't have such checks, it will almost always still work without any issues. In a rare couple of cases some errors might occur in certain very specific situations. The safest is always to either import everything yourself or to only use gadgets.
2. Not much. Its easier to install, and often requires less bypassing of your cache or of that of wikimedia servers to get it actually running. monobook.js can be troublesome on that front sometimes. It's mostly something intended for the users who are less experienced with configuring their monobook.js

--TheDJ (talk • contribs) 23:31, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

With Twinkle and Friendly, if you select them as gadgets while you have them installed you'll get two sets of each extra tab. Think outside the box 11:55, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

I think the idea behind it is to try to make the life easier for people not familiar with the inner workings on Wikipedia. While I have no idea of the effects of overlapping scripts between gadgets and monobook (as I never used the former), I'd suggest you keep everything on the monobook. Snowolf ^{How can I help?} 22:55, 13 March 2008 (UTC)